i have gone for 50-50 blame as the copper should have anticipated the drivers move as he was indicating and his mirrors were slightly obscured, plus it was dusk and the copper should have had his blues on!
what do you think■■?
its 50 -50 in a sense, i mean the police car was going 70+ mph faster than the hgv, he could look and see nothing and 2 seconds later the police car was there, and the turn off he wanted involved him going into lane 3,
now the truck should have mayby stayed in lane 2 longer and the police car could have easily went round him
wonder what happened to the driver?
Yes, the truck was indicating BUT what was it doing going into lane 3 especially when the ‘throw arrows’ were just ahead to put it back into lane 2 
The police car anticipated the right turn intention of the truck but not the use of lane 3 
ROG:
Yes, the truck was indicating BUT what was it doing going into lane 3 especially when the ‘throw arrows’ were just ahead to put it back into lane 2The police car anticipated the right turn intention of the truck but not the use of lane 3
trying to stop the car pulling in front and slamming on, as they do on a regular basis?
Giblsa:
ROG:
Yes, the truck was indicating BUT what was it doing going into lane 3 especially when the ‘throw arrows’ were just ahead to put it back into lane 2The police car anticipated the right turn intention of the truck but not the use of lane 3
did it not used to be three lanes going on to the roundabout there? right hand lane for going on to the M18 northbound?
what did you go for in the end anyway rog? in the survey?
Looking at the video both lanes 2 & 3 are marked for the right turn and the trucker should have an easy vision of the throw arrows putting lane 3 back into lane 2.
So, truck should not be in lane 3 but that does not excuse the possibility of that happening so the police car should have anticipated that possibility - the what if…
If that had been me in that senario with a truck moving across to the right with no real possibility of a sudden change to the left - not at that speed - then my option would have been to pass on the inside.
Bad anticipation and consideration of options by the advanced driver IMO.
i did actually edit my post after watching for a second time and looking at the road. you were right Rog, the road did have throw arrows into lane 2 from 3
50/50 IMNSHO, the copper wasn’t using blues, and should have anticipated the wagon may have wanted to go right. A driver not familiar with the junction may well have gone to lane 3 to make the right, having missed the lane ending markers.
This has been around for a few of years now.
There’s a point you should be aware of
There never was a chase, it was a boring shift, so to ‘liven it up’ they ‘simulated’ a chase.
That’s why he didn’t have the blues n twos on.
As to blame.
That is the M180 to M18 junction, coming from the sunny Scunny direction, I think.
There is a small 1m in the bottom left of that huge roundabout sign. It’s very easy to miss if you don’t know the area, so your expecting the roundabout to be coming up a lot quicker.
Does this seem reasonable course of events for the truck driver?
Your busy checking your mirrors, to move over to the outside lane for a right at the roundabout.
You’ve already seen that the road immediately ahead is clear, so not really paying that much attention to what’s right in front of you.
By now your in lane two, checking both sets of mirrors and still aiming at lane 3. There’s still nothing of note in front of you (as you note when your eyeballs click going from 1 mirror to the other)
A car is coming up at 127 mph, you might have spotted it but it was so far back it wasn’t an issue. By the time it caught up you’d be in the outside lane, normally. You don’t see it because your checking your off side mirror as he comes up behind you. As you check your nearside mirror he’s behind your trailer. By the time you see it in your offside, because he’s doing 120 he’s actually alongside you.
In my scenario, it’s all to do with timing.
If the car had been doing 70 to 80 ish, it would have been seen, because that’s what most cars do, it’s what we’re used to, what we expect and so the way we work. It’s because the car was going so fast that the trucker was caught out.
Blues and twos wouldn’t have been much help.
At that speed, because of the Doppler effect, two tones can’t be heard above wind noise, apparently.
The car might have been spotted earlier, if it had the blues on, you’d probably be expecting something out of the ordinary and kept an eye on it.
The first time I went through this roundabout, I almost went over to lane 3.
I was busy checking what was coming up behind me, knowing that ahead of me was clear. I didn’t notice the throw arrows until very late, just in time. Far too early for that junction.
My take was -
Bad anticipation and consideration of options by the advanced driver IMO.
Would you agree with that Simon
ROG:
My take was -
Bad anticipation and consideration of options by the advanced driver IMO.Would you agree with that Simon
I think so ROG
Just one copper and one truck on a lonely highway and the copper hits it, what was it carrying, super dooper hiper powered magnets■■?
Coppers fault entirely, he didn’t take into account the curve of the road and the trucker being blind to anyone around the offside because of it, Trucker may be able to see the car in his n/s mirror but as already stated no blues would not of alerted him to be wary, the truck o/s mirror isn’t seen till the noddy car is almost alongside. If the copper is local he should have known that the throw arrows are there, and given the truck was indicating right, a change of speed and going to the sighted and clear inside would have been prudent, and it would’ve given him a better line round the roundabout! The truck was indicating at least 10 seconds before the collision, during that time plod had travelled one third of a mile, if it took us that long to make a life or death decision I thinks there’d be a lot more bouquets on the roadside.
IMO just another dumb ■■■ ignorant car driver who hasn’t got a clue about forward planning, the only thing that sets him apart from joe public is his epilettes.
Maybe when he sees a “If you can’t see my mirrors, I can’t see you” sticker he’ll think about how hard them brown stains were to scrub out.
I think Simon hit the nail on the head as far as I’m concerened, Of course the Copper had to make a big deal about it, as he’d been made to look a bit of a [zb] on camera.
IMO its the coppers fault he is far more trained in driving at speed than the average truck driver, we get it drilled in to use about forward planning
And IMO the copper had a better view of what was happening in front of him,as a police driver he should of slowed down when he saw the truck put is indicator on.
That would not happened he as the driver of the car had a choice to slow down but didn’t do that.
You can’t take for granted what a truck driver is going to do just cos it in the regs that he is not allowed in the 3rd lane
the truck driver mite not no the road lay out could have been from abroad, could have had a left ■■■■■■
and one thing the copper did not put is light on until he hit the truck and i an sure that the did not have the sirens on two
i have been on a motorway at night and there nothing on the road, have see copper coming up on my right with head light flashing just as he got to me he put his blues and two on and when he passed he turned them off
There are two threads on this video on the advanced drivers site which includes many traffic police officers -
Just one other thing on here and other boards some discussion has taken place regarding the heavy not allowed in lane 3.
The right-hand lane of a motorway with three or more lanes MUST NOT be used (except in prescribed circumstances) if you are driving
any vehicle drawing a trailer
a goods vehicle with a maximum laden weight exceeding 3.5 tonnes but not exceeding 7.5 tonnes, which is required to be fitted with a speed limiter
a goods vehicle with a maximum laden weight exceeding 7.5 tonnes
a passenger vehicle with a maximum laden weight exceeding 7.5 tonnes constructed or adapted to carry more than eight seated passengers in addition to the driver
a passenger vehicle with a maximum laden weight not exceeding 7.5 tonnes which is constructed or adapted to carry more than eight seated passengers in addition to the driver, which is required to be fitted with a speed limiter
I can’t find these prescribed circumstances, but as I recall they include if the l/h lane is a filter (eg aproach to j34 m1 meadowhall), if directed by TO HATO or ■■■■■■ vehicle, signs & roadworks there are a couple more but I can’t remember them.
In this case the lanes were filtering for the various exits off the mway therefore the HGV driver possibly had every right to be in the third lane.
If you go to Google earth & search for M180, then look at the approach to the M18 junction, this must be where he was traveling down the hatched area in the 2nd clip.
Interestingly, if you pan back to the last junction on the M180 you can clearly see 2 trucks both encroaching lane 3 ! Use the tilt function so you’re looking down on them with the road from bottom to top of your screen. (untick “show roads” so you get a clearer view of the road markings).
try 53°35’32.41"N 0°58’14.63"W (have now place marked it).
I think there is 3rd factor here besides the 2 drivers: the road design.
The major route direction sign for the junction ahead is just before the over bridge. It is relatively rare to have a roundabout at the end of a m/way (they usually continue onto an A road).I think that having seen the route layout sign, if wanting to turn right onto the M18 they will initially think they need to be getting over to the right (yes i know no HGV lane 3, but they could well be expecting the right lane to be marked up for right turn on approach to the rab, those markings would then over ride the HGV ban), then sometime after you go under the bridge, the white arrows come up in lane 3. I can’t see on On G earth the signs advising lane 3 ending, there will surely be some. Further on it becomes clear as there is another sign showing only the 2 lanes. The whole set up is potentially dangerous even just for cars because you have the right lane closing immediately after the on slip. (traffic tends to move a lane to their right to let people on).
The m/way has clearly been designed with the 3rd lane contuning to the rab, but has subsequently been hatched off.
I also ageee that the Police officer did not have is flashing headlights on, but then he didn’t say he had did he? and that the trucks mirror could not be seen initially, therefor the truck driver could not see him. I consider that passing a junction & approaching a round about, he should certainly have had all warning devices available to him employed.
Everywhere, but especially on the road, always expect the unexpected to happen.
Which is what the trafpol driver did not…
Tell him we can negotiate a price for some driver improvement training!
coppers fault (If in doubt blame everything on the copper thats what they are put on this planet for)
r-kid:
coppers fault (If in doubt blame everything on the copper thats what they are put on this planet for)
Cop or not - car driver made the wrong decision by not taking all factors into consideration