A handy Microsite on our partner website that tells in plain english what you need to know about the upcoming rule changes on April 11th 2007
roadtransport.com/staticpage … shours.htm
If you have any questions you can e-mail them , or post on here and i am sure that we can find the answer for you.
Looking at that link, it says about your daily breaks that you must have a 15 min break followed by a 30 min break. Can this be taken the other way arround
30 min followed by a 15 min break ■■?.
hal56:
Looking at that link, it says about your daily breaks that you must have a 15 min break followed by a 30 min break. Can this be taken the other way arround
30 min followed by a 15 min break ■■?.
no, the last part must be 30 minutes
The official Transport Office site has a better list. It shows the current rules against the new version for each change.
as a recovery person then operating inside the 100k radius of base, i take it i am excempt fom the regs but as soon as i go over that line then for the whole working week i then come under the working time directive and am then entitled to the rest time of 9 or 11 hours daily
After a driving period of 4.5 hours a driver must take an uninterrupted break of no less than 45 minutes; however, this break may be replaced with a break of at least 15 minutes followed by a 30 minute break within the 4.5-hour period
No mention of the word ■■■■■■■■■■■ driving in there.
Currently drivers only have to keep tachograph records for days on which they are driving, however from 11th April drivers needs to keep a record of both driving and non driving days within a fixed week, where in scope driving has occurred. The record should include all periods of availability and other work including work carried out for any other employer.
So do we need to carry unused tachos for rest days now?, or do we have to fill in the dates for rest days?, it cant be a rest day if you need to go in to work to fill out a tacho can it?, is it ok to fill a tacho out in advance or in arrears for rest days or is that fraud?.
Vehicles used, or hired without a driver,
I really would like to see that one.
jammymutt:
Currently drivers only have to keep tachograph records for days on which they are driving, however from 11th April drivers needs to keep a record of both driving and non driving days within a fixed week, where in scope driving has occurred. The record should include all periods of availability and other work including work carried out for any other employer.
So do we need to carry unused tachos for rest days now?, or do we have to fill in the dates for rest days?
No, because a rest day is neither a driving day or a non driving day. Non driving day means a day when you are working but not driving, on a rest day you aren’t working.
OK this is how I am reading it. The driver of a vehicle over 7.5 tons which is used for the Non Commercial carraige of goods will need to used a tachograph as from 11th April, whereas before the tacho was not required.
A Semi tractor on it’s own, with no trailer, and therefore not being used for non commercial carriage of goods (such as an old American show truck) would still be exempt from having to use a tachograph.
However when the said Semi tractor was used in conjunction with a trailer for say, motorsport transportation/ living accomodation, it would fall into the scope of the new rules and require the driver to use a tachograph disc.
Is this correct?
I have contacted VOSA on this subject, and although the lady with whom I spoke was very pleasant, I got the feeling that she didn’t quite grasp the concept of what I was saying, as my particular question didn’t really fit with the program.
If that is the case on motorsport,then I can see VOSA are going to be VERY stretched by visiting a lot of race meetings on weekends.
As someone who has just retired from racing,I know how many transporters/converted coaches are used,and I’m not talking about big race circuits/meetings either.
VOSA can’t handle what we throw at them,never mind weekend working,due to their budget restraints.
However.If the government charged every foreigner that came into the country,then more cash would be available…
Ken.
Tramper:
:?: OK this is how I am reading it. The driver of a vehicle over 7.5 tons which is used for the Non Commercial carraige of goods will need to used a tachograph as from 11th April, whereas before the tacho was not required.
A Semi tractor on it’s own, with no trailer, and therefore not being used for non commercial carriage of goods (such as an old American show truck) would still be exempt from having to use a tachograph.
However when the said Semi tractor was used in conjunction with a trailer for say, motorsport transportation/ living accomodation, it would fall into the scope of the new rules and require the driver to use a tachograph disc.
Is this correct?
As I’ve said before, I think you are wrong here. Have a look at this link and scroll down to the list of exemptions halfway (ish) down. The Right hand column (“New Exemptions”) is the complete list of vehicles that will be exempt once the new rules come in. Which of those do you feel applies to you driving your Pete without a trailer?
As Quinny said, it’s going to be nigh on impossible to enforce and it will actually make it illegal for many people who work long weeks even doing non driving things to drive their toy at a weekend which is just silly.
Paul
repton:
Which of those do you feel applies to you driving your Pete without a trailer?Paul
Hi Paul,
I think that this is where my truck fits in…
Current rules: Vehicles used for the non-commercial carriage of goods and personal use.
New rules: Vehicles or combination of vehicles with a maximum permissible mass not exceeding 7.5 tonnes used for the non-commercial carriage of goods.
as without a trailer the Pete weighs less than 7.5 tons (Just)
I think I’m right, but I know I’m confused! 
I guess it comes down to the definition of Maximum Permissible Mass, whether that is what the truck actually weighs or what the truck is plated at. I’m sure someone will let me know.
Either way, I’m lucky as my truck has a tacho head installed already 
, according to VOSA, the others on the show curcuit have a year to get one put in, but I guess they will have to have a digital tacho fitted 
, and thats just not going to look right in a 1970’s yankee rig, or go down at all well.
Quinny:
If that is the case on motorsport,then I can see VOSA are going to be VERY stretched by visiting a lot of race meetings on weekends.As someone who has just retired from racing,I know how many transporters/converted coaches are used,and I’m not talking about big race circuits/meetings either.
VOSA can’t handle what we throw at them,never mind weekend working,due to their budget restraints.
However.If the government charged every foreigner that came into the country,then more cash would be available…
Ken.
Even at lower formulas and some club meets there are professional teams who should already be running tachograph’s, but I agree there are many privateers who run large vehicles who don’t use tachograph’s.
The same could be true for many horse shows aswell, it opens up a total minefield for VOSA to check them especially as they don’t have ‘O’ licences.
Tramper:
I think that this is where my truck fits in…
Current rules: Vehicles used for the non-commercial carriage of goods and personal use.New rules: Vehicles or combination of vehicles with a maximum permissible mass not exceeding 7.5 tonnes used for the non-commercial carriage of goods.
as without a trailer the Pete weighs less than 7.5 tons (Just)
I think I’m right, but I know I’m confused!
I would have thought that driving the Pete to a show would still be exempt. The new wording is vehicles used for the non commercial carriage of goods but you aren’t carrying goods. I would say that carrying a mates furniture while you help him move house or taking a car to a race meeting etc is non commercial carriage of goods - you are carrying something but not getting paid and it is a private arrangement not a commercial one.
The Pete travelling solo to a show isn’t carrying goods, whether commercial or otherwise, in fact I would think you could take it to a show coupled to an empty trailer and it still isn’t non commercial carriage of goods. I would say that this change of regulation is aimed at those who use a truck at the weekend to move furniture, take stuff to a tip, take their car or motorbike to a race meeting etc - in effect use a truck to carry anything that doesn’t fall under a commercial arrangement. If you aren’t carrying anything then it isn’t non commercial carriage of goods.
That’s just my take on it, nothing official.
muckles:
The same could be true for many horse shows aswell, it opens up a total minefield for VOSA to check them especially as they don’t have ‘O’ licences.
Indeed 
If my daughter hadn’t just passed her hgv I would have needed some careful planning to drive her to an event in our 11tonne horsebox
What I don’t understand is why it’s ok to drive a 7.5tonne horsebox but not an 11 tonne one
the 11tonner is much safer & handles better and unlike a lot of 7.5t horseboxes it’s unlikely to be over weight ( some 7.5 ones are close to weight empty )
badly thought out rules IMHO
what about loading and unloading, as it stands i have to make sure my mode is switched to cross hammers when i load or unload but does this count as driving or just work. what i mean is for example, today it took two hours to get to where i needed to unload, i stopped unloaded, then loaded which took two hours, do i still have two and a half hours of driving left before i need a break, by that time time i was back at base.
Yes of course. Driving is just that, driving. Loading /Unloading is classed as other work.
Ok is it the same when i went to Morrisons Depot in Northampton and took 4hrs to get there then had to wait 4hrs to be unloaded then took 1 and a half hours to un load then another 1.5hrs to load so in total i did 4hrs driving but hung around for 7 hours, then still had to drive back. i did put a 45 min break down when i had lunch. so did i break the law as it was a long day
Going by those timings, depending on when you took the 45 min break you may have broken the law. I suggest you read this… amicustheunion.org/Default.aspx?page=1550
Tramper:
New rules: Vehicles or combination of vehicles with a maximum permissible mass not exceeding 7.5 tonnes used for the non-commercial carriage of goods.as without a trailer the Pete weighs less than 7.5 tons (Just)
The Max Permissible Mass will be whatever the unit is plated at which will probably twenty-something tons I would think.
Paul
Coffeeholic:
I would have thought that driving the Pete to a show would still be exempt. The new wording is vehicles used for the non commercial carriage of goods but you aren’t carrying goods.
Yes, you’re right, so that exemption doesn’t cover it any more. My point (that everyone so far seems to be missing) is that none of the other exemptions on the list cover it either so in my opinion it is no longer exempt for any use at all be it commercial or otherwise.
To word it another way, the new list of exemptions doesn’t mention non commercial or personal use AT ALL other than for vehicles plated at under 7500Kg.
So as I see it you have 2 choices. Either you leave it plated as is and restrict yourself to only driving on one day each weekend and have to stick to all the usual tacho laws, or you downplate it to 7500Kg (assuming it’s lighter than that) and restrict yourself to running around solo and never towing a trailer.
Paul