Janos never found a good paying driving job then.
eagerbeaver:
albion:
I’m not in charge of answers Franglais, way past my pay grade!EB, I was once in a meeting where someone actually used the word blue sky thinking…I could barely keep a straight face.
Mine would have been something along these lines mate…
No one said owt about “thinking” and “boxes” then? Dipper wasn`t present at that meeting I guess.
Saturday night rules.
The politics of envy still at large here i see.
The problem with being happy to see those rich union tanker lads 
having to take a pay cut is who’s next?
There have always been jobs, specialised, possibly mucky, skilled, dangerous, especially when unionised, where the pay is at the upper end, apart from this present justifiable action generally the lads on the better pay are going the extra mile for it in many ways.
If the only end result is going to be lowest common denominator one size fits all one standard pay rate in a soviet style socialist utopia, then there is nowhere to go, no better job to strive for.
But most importantly if there are no better jobs for the better drivers to aim for, what does anyone think will be the end result for all other drivers? quick answer wage stagnation, when your boss knows you have nowhere else to go that pays better terms then he has no need to ever raise pay to attract or retain staff.
Maybe not just wage stagnation either, if Suttons lads take a 30% pay cut, what’s to stop other operators jumping on board? be careful that green eyed monster doesn’t devour you too.
Swings and roundabouts if other contractors jump on the band wagon and lower their wages or rates that they pay. This will prevent any one new from entering the driving industry or encourage decent drivers to leave due to the fact of the low pay packet, for the most, it is unlawful to lower the wages now as a lot are near to the bone of minimum wage anyway. This will create a real driver shortage and then push the rates up in order to actually hire a driver. So it is not necessarily in the interest for most hauliers to do the same as Sutton’s. I doubt many pay high enough wages to look at Sutton’s as a model to follow.
I do not know what exactly the miners lost but common sense would suggest that if you go on strike you will have no money coming in and as a result if you are unable to pay your mortgage your house is in danger of being re posssessed . I am also confident that many miners did not wish to strike but were subject to intimidation and felt that they had no choice .
I just hope that those who peddle the line that the Sutton’s drivers are overpaid and that the company has to take this action take an identical view when it happens to themselves.
It will be for the good of the company and its shareholders after all.
mrginge:
Janos never found a good paying driving job then.
Been too busy as an o/driver for the last 30yrs.
cav551:
I just hope that those who peddle the line that the Sutton’s drivers are overpaid and that the company has to take this action take an identical view when it happens to themselves.It will be for the good of the company and its shareholders after all.
RIght then, lets have a show of hands to show who earns more than 40 grand driving a truck? Not many I am guessing. Would somebody driving for an agency on 13 quid an hour like to think they have something in common with these union fatcats? Does anybody honestly think that the union gives a stuff about any of you on general haulage? Some real mugs on here. This strike has nothing to do with the average joe on the street. To think some of you are willing to stand in line with them beggars belief.
Funny that everybody complains about the inequity of wages for bankers etc, and yet they allow a closed cartel to do the same in their own industry, and are willing to fight to retain the status quo. To claim that these drivers losing a portion of their wage will cause a further downward spiral in all wages is nonsense.
Sorry to break this to a lot of you, but the day is not coming any time soon when you will be paid over 60 grand to drive a truck.
albion:
It is. I’m an optimist though. And it’s Miss
Well if that fool hasn’t put a ring on it yet then that opens up the door for me! Ahem…(down on one knee here)…Miss Albion…will you do me the honour of being my wife? I’m handy with a frying pan, I know how a washing machine works and being a driver I can keep a close eye on those lazy oiks you’ve got malingering for you! Say yes, you know you wanna!
Juddian:
The politics of envy still at large here i see.The problem with being happy to see those rich union tanker lads
There have always been jobs, specialised, possibly mucky, skilled, dangerous, especially when unionised, where the pay is at the upper end, apart from this present justifiable action generally the lads on the better pay are going the extra mile for it in many ways.If the only end result is going to be lowest common denominator one size fits all one standard pay rate in a soviet style socialist utopia, then there is nowhere to go, no better job to strive for.
But most importantly if there are no better jobs for the better drivers to aim for, what does anyone think will be the end result for all other drivers? quick answer wage stagnation, when your boss knows you have nowhere else to go that pays better terms then he has no need to ever raise pay to attract or retain staff.Maybe not just wage stagnation either, if Suttons lads take a 30% pay cut, what’s to stop other operators jumping on board? be careful that green eyed monster doesn’t devour you too.
Spot on .
Janos:
cav551:
I just hope that those who peddle the line that the Sutton’s drivers are overpaid and that the company has to take this action take an identical view when it happens to themselves.It will be for the good of the company and its shareholders after all.
RIght then, lets have a show of hands to show who earns more than 40 grand driving a truck? Not many I am guessing. Would somebody driving for an agency on 13 quid an hour like to think they have something in common with these union fatcats? Does anybody honestly think that the union gives a stuff about any of you on general haulage? Some real mugs on here. This strike has nothing to do with the average joe on the street. To think some of you are willing to stand in line with them beggars belief.
Funny that everybody complains about the inequity of wages for bankers etc, and yet they allow a closed cartel to do the same in their own industry, and are willing to fight to retain the status quo. To claim that these drivers losing a portion of their wage will cause a further downward spiral in all wages is nonsense.
Sorry to break this to a lot of you, but the day is not coming any time soon when you will be paid over 60 grand to drive a truck.
Oh Janos…I’m sorry you haven’t been able to break through the £40k ceiling whilst being self employed. I haven’t managed it myself. But I don’t want to see anyone who has have it swiped away from them because that would be one less opportunity for my good self to aim for. See where I’m coming from? Now stop swallowing those bitter pills man!
Love the guys on here who imply that we should be…
‘Ohhh so grateful to have jobs’
and should be
‘Oh so understanding why we should be expected to work for ■■■■ all and/or take a pay cut’ to keep companies in business.
Jeez H, 
God help us all, what ■■■■ chance do we have here.
Case in point…Divided AND conqured. 
Janos:
cav551:
I just hope that those who peddle the line that the Sutton’s drivers are overpaid and that the company has to take this action take an identical view when it happens to themselves.It will be for the good of the company and its shareholders after all.
RIght then, lets have a show of hands to show who earns more than 40 grand driving a truck? Not many I am guessing. Would somebody driving for an agency on 13 quid an hour like to think they have something in common with these union fatcats? Does anybody honestly think that the union gives a stuff about any of you on general haulage? Some real mugs on here. This strike has nothing to do with the average joe on the street. To think some of you are willing to stand in line with them beggars belief.
Funny that everybody complains about the inequity of wages for bankers etc, and yet they allow a closed cartel to do the same in their own industry, and are willing to fight to retain the status quo. To claim that these drivers losing a portion of their wage will cause a further downward spiral in all wages is nonsense.
Sorry to break this to a lot of you, but the day is not coming any time soon when you will be paid over 60 grand to drive a truck.
Not sure that anyone on here really believes that they are going to achieve £60 k mate.
But there are a few younger drivers on here that seem to be showing a bit of fighting spirit, and I applaud them. We all know that the majority of truck drivers are 50+.
Sooner or later there WILL be a shortage of drivers. Yes, there are plenty of licence holders according to DVLA, but less new lads are joining than old hands are leaving.
I want ALL these newer drivers to show some spirit. It’s about time these crappy paying haulage companies are FORCED to pay up. I don’t give a toss about ’ market forces ', and I sure as hell don’t care about companies undercutting each other. That’s THEIR problem, not mine. The time will come when the conveyor belt of EE drivers begins to dwindle, and then our newer Brothers need to get even more militant.
You want us to drive on congested roads full of bellends risking our lives every day? You want to apologise to every sad prick who phones up and complains about our driving because you are terrified it may affect your share price? Then start backing your drivers and show some balls and loyalty. Pay us properly or do it yourselves. Or go bust and [zb] off down to the dole queue in your sharp suit.
GOOD LUCK TO THE SUTTON’S DRIVERS, and good luck to any driver on here and beyond who has something about them. Without lorry drivers these firms will simply not exist. No company Range Rover’s, no flash suits, no hotel jolly’s, no [zb] all!..
DON’T DRIVE FOR CRAP FIRMS. BOYCOTT THEM AND SOONER OR LATER THEY WILL FOLD
TiredAndEmotional:
Janos:
cav551:
I just hope that those who peddle the line that the Sutton’s drivers are overpaid and that the company has to take this action take an identical view when it happens to themselves.It will be for the good of the company and its shareholders after all.
RIght then, lets have a show of hands to show who earns more than 40 grand driving a truck? Not many I am guessing. Would somebody driving for an agency on 13 quid an hour like to think they have something in common with these union fatcats? Does anybody honestly think that the union gives a stuff about any of you on general haulage? Some real mugs on here. This strike has nothing to do with the average joe on the street. To think some of you are willing to stand in line with them beggars belief.
Funny that everybody complains about the inequity of wages for bankers etc, and yet they allow a closed cartel to do the same in their own industry, and are willing to fight to retain the status quo. To claim that these drivers losing a portion of their wage will cause a further downward spiral in all wages is nonsense.
Sorry to break this to a lot of you, but the day is not coming any time soon when you will be paid over 60 grand to drive a truck.Oh Janos…I’m sorry you haven’t been able to break through the £40k ceiling whilst being self employed. I haven’t managed it myself. But I don’t want to see anyone who has have it swiped away from them because that would be one less opportunity for my good self to aim for. See where I’m coming from? Now stop swallowing those bitter pills man!
You have me all wrong T&E. I have had some really good years, and would not change my status. I am not against fighting for a good wage per se, I am against the inequity of some tanker drivers earning half of what Suttons old school lot are on, and them being stupid enough to think the day will come when all firms will pay them the same rate if they support the fight. Most drivers will get a wage dictated by the market, as do most working people, me included. It is not about jealousy, it is about closed shop union bully boys shouting the odds. Makes my blood boil. Working out of Liverpool Docks, and having to frequent the steel works of the UK during the eighties and nineties was an education.
TiredAndEmotional:
albion:
It is. I’m an optimist though. And it’s MissWell if that fool hasn’t put a ring on it yet then that opens up the door for me! Ahem…(down on one knee here)…Miss Albion…will you do me the honour of being my wife? I’m handy with a frying pan, I know how a washing machine works and being a driver I can keep a close eye on those lazy oiks you’ve got malingering for you! Say yes, you know you wanna!
I can put you on the list…in fairness he did try, but I wasn’t having any of it 
Janos:
You have me all wrong T&E. I have had some really good years, and would not change my status. I am not against fighting for a good wage per se, I am against the inequity of some tanker drivers earning half of what Suttons old school lot are on, and them being stupid enough to think the day will come when all firms will pay them the same rate if they support the fight. Most drivers will get a wage dictated by the market, as do most working people, me included. It is not about jealousy, it is about closed shop union bully boys shouting the odds. Makes my blood boil. Working out of Liverpool Docks, and having to frequent the steel works of the UK during the eighties and nineties was an education.
There are more bullies wearing the old school tie mate than in any “closed shop” if there is such a thing these days. When you come on here raging about the offshore fiddles, lords and masters paying less tax than their domestics and hiring young pretty things thinking they’re free to ■■■■■ and manhandle them because they’ve “bought it” I might have more time for your thoughts. You obviously have an axe to grind so it’s personal for you rather than a general discussion about the politics.
albion:
TiredAndEmotional:
albion:
It is. I’m an optimist though. And it’s MissWell if that fool hasn’t put a ring on it yet then that opens up the door for me! Ahem…(down on one knee here)…Miss Albion…will you do me the honour of being my wife? I’m handy with a frying pan, I know how a washing machine works and being a driver I can keep a close eye on those lazy oiks you’ve got malingering for you! Say yes, you know you wanna!
I can put you on the list…in fairness he did try, but I wasn’t having any of it
I’ll take my spot then! What number am I?
Janos, ‘‘they’’ arn’t some aliens beamed in from the planet zod, they are drivers in this case who happen to be in jobs that pay above the norm.
You make it sound as if getting jobs like this are impossible, well it isn’t impossible for anyone who wants the better paying work and is prepared to put the effort in, i made the jump from general haulage onto one of the best paying night trunk jobs of the 80’s by packing in the lorries and going driving vans for more money, right time right place, you never know when that opportunity will present itself.
That didn’t last forever, and i moved on to car transporters and have eventually onto tankers myself, i’ve had down times as well of course, ended up on agency meself before getting this job which hopefully (there are no guarantees) will see me out.
You say about some tanker drivers not being paid as much as the Suttons lads, well no doubt those lower paid tanker lads are just biding their time till they get a chance to move up onto a better pad, and that’s why any driver worth his salt is willing the lads to win their case, because whilst there are these good jobs it gives others something to aim at, and other tanker operators won’t want to just provide free training only for their best drivers to be snapped up by the Suttons of the world, so pay should stay on a par.
I started on the pits of car transporter work, i didn’t have a relation or best mate to get me in somewhere top notch so i had to do it another way, ie i skilled myself up and eventually when drivers were needed i managed to get in on one of the big operators.
These were all supposed to be dead mans shoes jobs, but that isn’t the case, if you use your noddle and are prepared to rough it for a while till you skill up and if an opportunity comes grab it with both hands, then there is always a way in.
Oh and landing one of these jobs is only the start, chances are you have to take a right ■■■■■ shift pattern and lump the work you get, till you get your feet under the table a bit.
Things worth getting are usually worth putting some effort in.
You’d be surprised what some drivers are earning out there by the way.
Juddian:
Janos, ‘‘they’’ arn’t some aliens beamed in from the planet zod, they are drivers in this case who happen to be in jobs that pay above the norm.You make it sound as if getting jobs like this are impossible, well it isn’t impossible for anyone who wants the better paying work and is prepared to put the effort in, i made the jump from general haulage onto one of the best paying night trunk jobs of the 80’s by packing in the lorries and going driving vans for more money, right time right place, you never know when that opportunity will present itself.
That didn’t last forever, and i moved on to car transporters and have eventually onto tankers myself, i’ve had down times as well of course, ended up on agency meself before getting this job which hopefully (there are no guarantees) will see me out.You say about some tanker drivers not being paid as much as the Suttons lads, well no doubt those lower paid tanker lads are just biding their time till they get a chance to move up onto a better pad, and that’s why any driver worth his salt is willing the lads to win their case, because whilst there are these good jobs it gives others something to aim at, and other tanker operators won’t want to just provide free training only for their best drivers to be snapped up by the Suttons of the world, so pay should stay on a par.
I started on the pits of car transporter work, i didn’t have a relation or best mate to get me in somewhere top notch so i had to do it another way, ie i skilled myself up and eventually when drivers were needed i managed to get in on one of the big operators.
These were all supposed to be dead mans shoes jobs, but that isn’t the case, if you use your noddle and are prepared to rough it for a while till you skill up and if an opportunity comes grab it with both hands, then there is always a way in.
Oh and landing one of these jobs is only the start, chances are you have to take a right ■■■■■ shift pattern and lump the work you get, till you get your feet under the table a bit.
Things worth getting are usually worth putting some effort in.You’d be surprised what some drivers are earning out there by the way.
Juddian, your story is inspiring for those hoping to break into these ‘top jobs’. My beef is that you even have to mention ‘closed shops’. Also, the fact that these jobs are never advertised, so are not given really on merit. Although, I am sure you are worthy. Having had many run-ins over the years with union guys, I know they feel certain jobs are beneath them, so to have the guys doing those jobs supporting their action makes we wonder exactly where they are coming from. How this dispute will end, is anybodies guess, but something has to give, as it is uneconomic at the moment. By standing firm, without compromise the union are doing what they have always done, and all the current jobs may suffer because of that. As has happened so many times in the past.
These ‘Top jobs’ that everyone mentions,…
Lads who I have spoken to over the years with maybe not ‘Top jobs’ but let’s say the better end of the market jobs with better pay, pay structures, and general conditions, (and I may be generalising here because no doubt there will be exceptions) as if by magic all seem to be firms where the drivers are in a Union collectively, and where the Unions negotiate rather than try and dictate…as it should be.
So all the bandwagon riders and jumpers, who bad mouth them should maybe consider that fact for a minute.
I personally work for a firm where there is a vast potential to change policies, terms and attitudes towards drivers, but I know it will never happen because there is no union with either a small ‘u’ or Trade Union presence, so the ■■■■ goes on, which is a pity.