Nagel Logistics / Heritage International - Dover

[rikki-uk]

Neville has done what many other companies are reluctant to do , come on here and discuss his business model openly with owner drivers, and for that you have to give the man credit.

Certainly I would expect any owner driver who is considering working for him to do a lot more research than simply discussing on here, but it is a start. The Private Messaging system is ideal for some of the more financial questions, as it is kept out of the public view (reproducing the contents of PM’s on the public forums is disallowed on here).

It is refreshing for a company to read and respond to the more negative comments in an open manner, (rather than e-mailing or ringing me up and shouting at me ) however I will ask ALL people in this thread to keep off attacking individuals or posting comments about particular problems with their business arrangements with each other this may be better dealt with in private

Remember subbying is definatly “horses for courses” one owner drivers ideal agent/haulier maybe completly unsuitable for another. that doesnt mean that the agent/haulier is in the wrong, or that the subby didnt want to work and earn, just that they were mismatched

[davepenn54]

It is good to see a company director coming on to the forum and answering critics. Can’t say I’ve seen many of the well known Co’s; challenging things that have later turned out to be true!!!

As far as I’m aware ‘Heritage’ have a good reputation in the transport game and I’m sure there are subbies and employed drivers all making a reasonable living through them at the moment but every part of the industry is being squeezed at the moment.

As far as owner drivers are concerned I can’t say I’ve ever met one who doesn’t’ say the job’s not paying enough The only ones who make it are those who have gone into it with their eyes wide open and have some real experience and backup support and contacts plus enough capital to keep themselves going for the first 3/6 months. Trying to run as a start up on credit will always end up in tears and repossessions

The UK Transport Industry appears to be in terminal decline and it is definetly not the fault of the majority of people who work in it and have dedicated their working lives to it. We should be supporting companies that are keeping OD’s on the road and making a living not slaggging them off

[pjk]

Good luck to the man. Well done Neville. He’s stuck at it when a lot of us just didn’t think it was worth it. I for one am always pleased to see there vehicles over the water, there aren’t that many any more. Keep up the good work.

[brit_pete]

I am not a O/D just a driver and it was
excellent to read these posts and its
immpossible to please every one
good luck to Neville and the Heritage
company, I do belive that no other firm
has come on here and discussed so openly
about the way they work as for keeping
the rates earnt private, that is how it should be as
some one posted many others read these posts and
such information would help them make a counter claim .or rate for the work,
Where I work we have a subbie who would willing
put all her trucks onpulling for our firm if she could
due to the rate paid and the fact that it gets paid
when she wishes to have it with out any problems

[sprinter]

Met a few Heritage drivers on the ferries never heard any of them bad mouthing the Company etc.

Normally it’s a driver called Charlie i see on a regular basis on the boat but not seen him recently, nice bloke lives down in the West country i think, and a bit of a character.

Anyway nice to see a director stick his head over the parapet

Welcome to Trucknet Neville

Regds

Iain

[neville]

Thanks for your comments. You have obviously never been on the early boat out of Dover on a Monday when there are always a few of mine… All telling each other what they are and are not going to say to me when they get the chance… But like I tell them all… Their money is in the bank each week, they have some of the best kit available… We run the job with all proper insurances, tax, permits Etc…
As for Charlie… still here… been on Holiday this last couple of weeks bless him. I have known the man for 20 years… never let me down. Old school driver who lives in the real world with us.

Regards to you.

[neville]

Sorry… pressed the wrong button !

[mike_ryan_no_really]

I must admit that I’ve been following this post with a keen interest and am heartened to actually see someone from a company of Heritage’s standing come on and discuss some of the finer points of their subbie arrangements.

I did actually have a chat with Heritage myself about a year or so ago, and decided in the end, that it just wasn’t for me.

What I do find interesting is the whole trailer hire issue, while I agree with routier (and others) that in principle a subbie should not have to pay for the upkeep of a customers trailers, I’d also say it would be quite naieve to believe that those companies that don’t “charge” for use of their trailers, haven’t already factored this cost into the rates they pay subbies.

I have, however, always thought that actually charging trailer hire (rather than factoring it into their cost’s) could be very unwise for the like’s of Heritage.

For argument’s sake, if a subby decides that once he has got to, say, Germany, that they’d rather do their own (better paying) backload than the collection Heriatge have allocated to them, and were this decision to cause a major service failure for Heritage (and possibly even the loss of a contract), what right of legal recourse, if any, would Heritage have in terms of taking action against the subby.

While I think we all understand that the trailer is intended solely for use for Heritage collections/deliveries, If a subby is hiring the trailer, and insuring both it and it’s contents, then from a legal standpoint, it is surely then his to do with as he pleases.

From my limited understanding of the law on this issue, I know that a rental contract can make specific exclusions as to the type of loads a trailer is used to carry, but I don’t believe it can specify for whom work is to be undertaken.

Any thoughts?

[mjt]

i have employed ownerdrivers in the past even got a few out of the goo goo by giving them work fuel tyres and early payment.as soon as they ok again want more moan all the time then try and poach my work. wont do it any moare just buy more motors.carnt trust any body any moore.

[jessicas_dad]

holmes-d9:
Dont think about heritage. they will break you. i live in nottingham. i would leave sunday night empty. park at ids callais. sit and wait for a job. i would end up at mouscron . del tuesday about 550 quid. back out empty . pick up bananas at loon plage . to norwich del thurs. then back out to belgium back to bolton then back home. I ave £ 1700. i paid £300 for a trailer which was only full one way. and then the fuel and running your truck. put it this way i earned about 16000 grand and only drew £3500. i had a letter saying i owe them. i can only pay what work you gave me. its your problem if you cant load me both ways. then you have to up the rates or get more work. one last thing. how the hell do some owner drivers on heritage aford to drive new volvos & scania on them rates.

at which point did you realise that this venture was not going to work…

i think when i was told to run empty from nottingham to calais and wait for a load.

from what ive read off this thread is that neville has been very fair and game on joining this thread but it seems clear that you have to have your own work out to europe and inform heritage where and when you will be empty. also to be fair any work going out is going on their own trucks plus the subbie blue eyed boys.

[evvo]

For argument’s sake, if a subby decides that once he has got to, say, Germany, that they’d rather do their own (better paying) backload than the collection Heriatge have allocated to them, and were this decision to cause a major service failure for Heritage (and possibly even the loss of a contract), what right of legal recourse, if any, would Heritage have in terms of taking action against the subby.

While I think we all understand that the trailer is intended solely for use for Heritage collections/deliveries, If a subby is hiring the trailer, and insuring both it and it’s contents, then from a legal standpoint, it is surely then his to do with as he pleases.

From my limited understanding of the law on this issue, I know that a rental contract can make specific exclusions as to the type of loads a trailer is used to carry, but I don’t believe it can specify for whom work is to be undertaken.

Any thoughts?
[/quote]

You make an interesting point Mike, my understanding of it would be if you are renting the trailer you are entitled to load it yourself, although you may find someting in the contract stating you must load Heritage loads only??

Personally if I was heritage & a Subbie let me down on a load so he could load himself to earn a quick buck that would be the last load he would ever do for me.

You should never bite the hand that feeds you.

[wheel_nut]

I dont have to stick up for Neville or anyone else here, He probably doesnt need me, but I bet if he had a choice he would rather not run any trailers at Heritage but is probably forced to because some of his sub contractors do not own a fridge or have no spare credit to hire one.

I had a sub contractor who decided that I wasnt being fair on him and give our company trucks the cream, at the same time I had my own company drivers saying that the sub contractors were taking all the best work. Now we still had to make a profit and also service all the contracts we had so in fact no one was treated any differently. A truck was a truck, a driver was just that, no favourites. Some drivers were more suited to some customers. especially the time critical ones.

That is, until the day my main customer rang me to say the subbie had just turned up at his office demanding to talk to my customers boss. The subbie seemed quite surprised that I never looked for another load for him

[marcustandy]

Oopps!!

[cold_up_north]

Hello, Just thought that I would add my opinions about Heritage.

We have had a unit on for them since October, we hire a trailer from them, which I believe is subsidised, and is not £300 per week.

They insist that the trailer is clean, inside and out, but it can be washed on their account with LKW.

Most of the work is empty out, but our driver did 2 out loaded last week, which pays well.

Money is always in the bank!

It helps if you can get loads out to belgium or Kent from your base to start the week.

Some rates can vary according to the importer and the euro rate, but it evens itself out.

The office guys are good as long as you keep them updated on progress.

I am not biased either way, but they don’t ask you to run bent, or press you to do the impossible.

Cheers, Cold Up North

[muhandis89]

I have just gone into the transport business(again!) after a gap of some years.Currently operating a 'fridge and tractor,and finding my own cargo.Have purchased a UK company with an O licence from someone retiring(we do of course have our own International Licence and EEC permit).The company purchased had a truck and ECMT permit,which is very usefull.We sold the truck and purchased a nearly new LHD one.The truck is fitted with tracking,so that clients(and their clients) can see where my truck is,at all times.That helps with planning,on all sides.

I read the remarks of many in this post,and a good defence by Heritage.Nagel is well known to me,and an excellent company.I have done some direct work for one of their German offices.You do have to get on with it,when you load from them,but all that takes is organisation.Having ADR also helps.

There seems to be some dispute here on what is traction(with or without trailer hire!).That means to me being paid a pre-agreed rate to tow someone else’s trailer around Europe.However both sides need to establish exact terms,before they start to work together.

My 2 pennys.!

[carl]

never saw this first time round but my 2peneth is.i worked for a firm who tipped in kent and would run out empty to mouscron, kontich,rotterdam etc for hertage to load back for the uk and to be honest it was good work i were never pushed or hassled by the lads at heritage.another thing you could choose which ferry crossing you wanted which was paid both ways.the firm i used to work for still does the odd load for heritage.if i were daft enough to become an owner driver id give heritage a ring.fair play to ya neville for coming on here and putting your side

[derf]

I worked for Heritage a few years back and found them a good bunch to work for, although i was employed directly by them, the subbies seemed to agree that in the main we were all treated the same.
My only regret is the way we parted, i didn’t give Neville a fair crack at sorting out a problem i had, indeed, in hind-sight i wished I 'd told the then wife where to go rather than Heritage.
When I moved from Kent to Dorset, they were very accomodating and bent over backwards to find inbound loads tipping in the south west for me. Robin in the office always respected my opinions and if i told him i couldn’t do a run legally, he’d rescedule.

I can say that all in all it was a pleasure working for them,and running with Charlie, Paddy and several of their regular subbies (who’s names escape me, but I think 1 was called niel or Nigel and worked for Lynch’s)

I’ll conclude by saying, if ever i were to dip my toe into fridge work, Heritage would be very near the top of my list of phone calls to make.

[routier]

Derf:
I worked for Heritage a few years back and found them a good bunch to work for, although i was employed directly by them, the subbies seemed to agree that in the main we were all treated the same.
My only regret is the way we parted, i didn’t give Neville a fair crack at sorting out a problem i had, indeed, in hind-sight i wished I 'd told the then wife where to go rather than Heritage.
When I moved from Kent to Dorset, they were very accomodating and bent over backwards to find inbound loads tipping in the south west for me. Robin in the office always respected my opinions and if i told him i couldn’t do a run legally, he’d rescedule.

I can say that all in all it was a pleasure working for them,and running with Charlie, Paddy and several of their regular subbies (who’s names escape me, but I think 1 was called niel or Nigel and worked for Lynch’s)

I’ll conclude by saying, if ever i were to dip my toe into fridge work, Heritage would be very near the top of my list of phone calls to make.

your post seems full of regret!!! sorry for ye troubles

you are a newbie on this site so Welcome…I started the thread and all but one or 2 posts ref Heritage are excellent, am sure Neville is a sound fella to work for and with, either perm or subbie for, I see many posts on Coolload…now thats on another thread.

Gud luck to ye now.