Will the diesel fairys become dragon flys
Darkside:
3 wheeler:
If the link works any of you with a narrowboat is going to have to run on white diesel not red as the eu has just shafted you.Maybe a little google search on how the EU has funded canal restoration in the UK may have been prudent before you said the EU had shafted boat owners…
■■■■ foreigners very generously sending our own money back over here so we can repair the canals, so we can use narrow boats etc etc
A bit of bold rewording, just for the giggles obviously. 
Why do you use the term “foreigners”? You do know we are still in the EU, so we would or could have been party to such decisions.
I’d hate to think you used it to imply some kind of racist ignorance on behalf of people who don’t agree with your political views, I mean that would be the actions of a really ignorant cocksocket too stupid to understand the irony of using such hate to platform themselves as intellectual and right.
As you clearly love google, why don’t you do a little search on the new leadership of the EU, their pasts, how they became candidates etc, then when you’ve put your racist card back in your pocket try to use your vast intelligence to begin to understand that some people voted out for reasons that have nothing to do with race, immigration, tariffs or even basic politics.
You might then realise how tedious some remain minded voters can become, and by the same measure how easily they can appear to be moronic hypocrites when it boils down to it. 
malcolmgbell:
Will the diesel fairys become dragon flys
albion:
Not remotely an engineer type carryfast, but I’m not sure that even covered in solar panels there would be enough sun to generate enough electricity in winter.My boat is all diesel, no coal, no gas
No but you could still just use the electric motor conversion and you’ve got more than enough weight capacity for as many batteries as you could possibly need for a day or two running at canal/river type speeds.Then charge them and cover all your other needs like lighting and cooking and heating with a stand alone portable diesel generator which you ‘can’ run on …red diesel. 
machinemart.co.uk/p/clarke-d … generator/
Well done EU.You’ve put Volvo and MTU out of business.While I or someone else can get on with bringing back the Gradner name making spark ignition LPG fuelled boat and truck engines.Along the lines of the Packard type shown in the PT boat example where more power is needed. 
toonsy:
As Harry has said, there was room for tax evasion there.That’s money that could go to our NHS (remember the bus?)
And as we’re leaving the EU in October we can choose to not apply this? Sovereignity and that?
Except the money that you’re talking about goes to pay for east euro ‘development’ and propping up the German banks.Bearing in mind the VAT charged on the duty.
As opposed to allowing boaters to use red diesel and charging them a bit more on income tax to be spent at home.In addition to the tax revenues created by the employment in a thriving pleasure boat market and industry.Oh wait we could also apply that idea to the road transport industry too.‘If’ that is we are no longer subject to EU rule.
Darkside:
Maybe a little google search on how the EU has funded canal restoration in the UK may have been prudent before you said the EU had shafted boat owners…■■■■ foreigners sending money over here so we can repair the canals, so we can use narrow boats etc etc
Maybe a little google search as to the definition of a ‘net contribution’ would be prudent regarding how we are actually most definitely being shafted by the zb EU.
"Franglais’':
Not to mention those who in the past have complained about other EU countries, ignoring EU rules that we obey, and they don’t. Now, we seem to be ignoring rules that they do obey.
No surprise that you’re all for using unelected EU bureaucracy to impose your raving green party policy because you can’t get a mandate for it.Also no surprise that you try to paint the EU as a Confederation of Sovereign States when it suits you but a centrally ruled dictatorship when it doesn’t.
On that not zb ‘their’ stupid foreign ‘rules’.When we could do it far better and fairer and in a way which doesn’t trash the economy and in which the money raised in revenues gets spent here not in mainland Europe.
The passenger carrying narrowboat on our local canal is powered by batteries as the authorites said that a diesel engine could pollute the waterway, it doesn’t have a massive range though.
Pete.
windrush:
The passenger carrying narrowboat on our local canal is powered by batteries as the authorites said that a diesel engine could pollute the waterway, it doesn’t have a massive range though.Pete.
At canal/river type speeds I’d guess that no one is going to get very far in a day anyway.While a boat,especially a canal type narrow boat,provides a great battery capacity v power to weight equation.Electric propulsion seems to be the perfect solution in that case.IE no need for speed or big range,weight of batteries isn’t an issue and can be charged from mains.Or a portable generator running on red diesel.
Electric boats are all well and good, but what about the ducks who will be squished silently?
Wheel Nut:
Electric boats are all well and good, but what about the ducks who will be squished silently?
Nah, they’ll just duck off out of the way …
d/p !
Darkside:
3 wheeler:
If the link works any of you with a narrowboat is going to have to run on white diesel not red as the eu has just shafted you.Maybe a little google search on how the EU has funded canal restoration in the UK may have been prudent before you said the EU had shafted boat owners…
■■■■ foreigners sending money over here so we can repair the canals, so we can use narrow boats etc etc
our money that we give to them
raymundo:
Wheel Nut:
Electric boats are all well and good, but what about the ducks who will be squished silently?Nah, they’ll just duck off out of the way …
To be fair a small river or canal boat motor chugging along at a few rpm and around less than 10 mph isn’t going to scare anything.As opposed to this which they’ll hear coming a mile away but still won’t have time to get out of the way. 
youtube.com/watch?v=AR_fsmgI8mU
‘‘This is how you can escape from North Korea’’ comment classic.
Wheel Nut:
Electric boats are all well and good, but what about the ducks who will be squished silently?
Probably get a bill.
Norfolkinclue1:
Darkside:
3 wheeler:
If the link works any of you with a narrowboat is going to have to run on white diesel not red as the eu has just shafted you.Maybe a little google search on how the EU has funded canal restoration in the UK may have been prudent before you said the EU had shafted boat owners…
■■■■ foreigners very generously sending our own money back over here so we can repair the canals, so we can use narrow boats etc etc
A bit of bold rewording, just for the giggles obviously.
Why do you use the term “foreigners”? You do know we are still in the EU, so we would or could have been party to such decisions.
I’d hate to think you used it to imply some kind of racist ignorance on behalf of people who don’t agree with your political views, I mean that would be the actions of a really ignorant cocksocket too stupid to understand the irony of using such hate to platform themselves as intellectual and right.
As you clearly love google, why don’t you do a little search on the new leadership of the EU, their pasts, how they became candidates etc, then when you’ve put your racist card back in your pocket try to use your vast intelligence to begin to understand that some people voted out for reasons that have nothing to do with race, immigration, tariffs or even basic politics.
You might then realise how tedious some remain minded voters can become, and by the same measure how easily they can appear to be moronic hypocrites when it boils down to it.
Sorry to have offended, I will admit it was low blow but I was replying to the original post in the tone I thought that was written in, and it certainly wasn’t meant to offend you as much as it obviously did…
Not a big user of Google to be honest, though I did google ‘cocksocket’, 
still trying to delete the pop ups…
Darkside:
3 wheeler:
If the link works any of you with a narrowboat is going to have to run on white diesel not red as the eu has just shafted you.Maybe a little google search on how the EU has funded canal restoration in the UK may have been prudent before you said the EU had shafted boat owners…
■■■■ foreigners sending money over here so we can repair the canals, so we can use narrow boats etc etc
We’ve been a net contributor to EU coffers for ages. That means any schemes you see with signs and flags saying was funded by the EU were actually paid for by us. What they’ve been doing is bribing us with our own money.
Franglais:
Harry Monk:
The way it works is this.All canalside diesel is red, and it all goes into one tank. At purchase you make a written declaration of what proportion you intend to use for propulsion, and what proportion for domestic (heating water, charging batteries). HMRC expect boaters to declare 60/40, most boaters declare 0/100. Full duty is then charged on the propulsion element.
If this system stops and all diesel is charged at the full rate, I imagine canalside road garages will see a significant increase in red diesel sold into 20l drums.
OK. So HMRC were expecting all boaters to play ball and not take the Mickey.
If as you say most were evading tax on the fuel used for propulsion, I don’t really wonder about the loophole being closed.
I can see conversion from one tank to two is expensive to do properly, but surely there is no reason it couldn’t be done on new builds or renovations.
Red from cans? If a lot start that won’t there be a few bankside “dippings”? Customs won’t need to invest millions in a high speed cutter to chase you down. [emoji5]
On road vehicles running red illegally they can be confiscated. Does same apply with other modes of transport? Kind of concentrates the mind, gambling tax evaded against your boat?
HMRC Excise Licence 75.
And what of anyone supplying fuel for illegal use? Surely they will have some responsibility?
.
I’m sure you are 100% honest Harry, but it seems some have been evading taxes for years, and it’s about to end.
Better to take pleasure from the money already saved, rather than moan about having to pay dues in the future, surely?Typo. Excise Notice 75
I used to sell Red diesel on the canal from my narrow boat, when I lived on and ran a business from my working boat. As a registered dealer of controlled fuels, I had to keep records of all red diesel sold (and collect the duty due, and pass that on to HMRC annually. Unpaid tax collector 
), and keep detailed records of each sale, as to how much, if any, percentage was declared as ‘propulsion’ fuel, as opposed to ‘domestic’, wich included generating electricity or hot water (via a heat exchanger). I also occasionally sold fuel to canal side contractors for use in their site equipment.
Most boaters were quite genuine in their declarations, but some took the ■■■■. However, the 40/60 declaration as dreamed up by HMRC (in conjunction with BW and the EA in them dark days), was based on recreational boating use, not live aboard use. Live aboards will generally run the engine every day, to charge batteries and to create hot water. If you only move once every fortnight, a 10/90 split is quite realistic.
At any rate, the amount of “tax evaded” would be so small, HMRC could not be bothered to persue it in ernest.
Franglais:
Harry Monk:
The way it works is this.All canalside diesel is red, and it all goes into one tank. At purchase you make a written declaration of what proportion you intend to use for propulsion, and what proportion for domestic (heating water, charging batteries). HMRC expect boaters to declare 60/40, most boaters declare 0/100. Full duty is then charged on the propulsion element.
If this system stops and all diesel is charged at the full rate, I imagine canalside road garages will see a significant increase in red diesel sold into 20l drums.
OK. So HMRC were expecting all boaters to play ball and not take the Mickey.
If as you say most were evading tax on the fuel used for propulsion, I don’t really wonder about the loophole being closed.
I can see conversion from one tank to two is expensive to do properly, but surely there is no reason it couldn’t be done on new builds or renovations.
Red from cans? If a lot start that won’t there be a few bankside “dippings”? Customs won’t need to invest millions in a high speed cutter to chase you down. [emoji5]
On road vehicles running red illegally they can be confiscated. Does same apply with other modes of transport? Kind of concentrates the mind, gambling tax evaded against your boat?
The UK Government has never wanted even the 60/40 split system, but it was forced on them by the eu in the first place, there tending to be nowhere near as much leisure use on canals in mainland Europe. HMRC do not enforce even the current system because it would cost far more to administer than it would raise so it’s difficult to see that changing, and as many boats are used infrequently, particularly those in marinas with mains hook-ups, it would take decades for many boats’ fuel tanks to be clear of traces of rebated fuel.
Boats shouldn’t have to use DERV anyway, the clue is in the name. 
Harry Monk:
Boats shouldn’t have to use DERV anyway, the clue is in the name.
Nothing new in the French etc not understanding/refusing to understand plain English when it suits them.