In or out of EU ? Poll

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
21

Carryfast:

Dolph:

Speedy Duck:
Hello Dolph

The people in countries around the world that purchase scotch whisky are not going to stop just because the UK extracts itself from the EU, including all of Europe, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Japan, Russia, EE; everywhere.

It is a smokescreen that trade will be adversely affected.

Hello Duck

Some people might continue buy it some may not. But if EU impose 20% import tax people might switch to Irish whisky for example.
Nothing is known yet, what will or will not happen.

Great EU imposes 20% import tax on Scotch whisky then we impose 40% import tax on French wine and Brandy.So does Switzerland and Norway.While domestic consumption increases because we save the EU VAT component which gets taken off the domestic price. :bulb:

You seem to have this weird one sided idea of trade wars. :unamused: :laughing:

You are hungry for wars. Brexit will be mass for all, but UK will suffer more then anyone else. Put to the equation the 3 million jobs(bare minimum) directly linked to EU, employers living UK, investors living UK etc. add to this the trade war that you talks so much about, because of all of the above devaluation of the pound, lost savings, growing insecurity. Second comes peoples life what EU nationals will do in UK, will they be forced to leave, what about their property, vice versa, what about UK nationals in EU. What about the families of mixed marriages, what about their kids…
It will be mess for sure.

22

Dolph:

Carryfast:

Dolph:
Some people might continue buy it some may not. But if EU impose 20% import tax people might switch to Irish whisky for example.
Nothing is known yet, what will or will not happen.

Great EU imposes 20% import tax on Scotch whisky then we impose 40% import tax on French wine and Brandy.So does Switzerland and Norway.While domestic consumption increases because we save the EU VAT component which gets taken off the domestic price. :bulb:

You seem to have this weird one sided idea of trade wars. :unamused: :laughing:

You are hungry for wars. Brexit will be mass for all, but UK will suffer more then anyone else. Put to the equation the 3 million jobs(bare minimum) directly linked to EU, employers living UK, investors living UK etc. add to this the trade war that you talks so much about, because of all of the above devaluation of the pound, lost savings, growing insecurity. Second comes peoples life what EU nationals will do in UK, will they be forced to leave, what about their property, vice versa, what about UK nationals in EU. What about the families of mixed marriages, what about their kids…
It will be mess for sure.

You’re the one who seems to be all about imposing trade sanctions in the case of a Brexit not me.While yes I’ve already taken account of all the bs that Eastern Europe obviously intends if we decide to get out of the scam.IE net contributor and net importer are self explanatory.In that whatever you choose to throw at us economically it will cost you money and jobs while saving us money and providing jobs.In which case our economy can only be stronger because unlike now we’ll have control over our trade balance with the EU.

As for who leaves and who stays do you really think that we were another isolated version of North Korea before we joined the EU. :unamused:

23

Dolph, the same scare tactics and lies were used in the run up to the Scottish indi referendum, all complete unsubstantiated BS and but they scared a enough of the hard of thinking to swing the vote.

The EU is a busted flush, their accounts haven’t been signed off for 14yrs FFS, it’s run by a bunch of bureaucrats and failed politicians with delusions of grandeur, who couldn’t run a bath let alone a collection of highly diverses advanced economies.

24

Carryfast:

Dolph:

Carryfast:

Dolph:
Some people might continue buy it some may not. But if EU impose 20% import tax people might switch to Irish whisky for example.
Nothing is known yet, what will or will not happen.

Great EU imposes 20% import tax on Scotch whisky then we impose 40% import tax on French wine and Brandy.So does Switzerland and Norway.While domestic consumption increases because we save the EU VAT component which gets taken off the domestic price. :bulb:

You seem to have this weird one sided idea of trade wars. :unamused: :laughing:

You are hungry for wars. Brexit will be mass for all, but UK will suffer more then anyone else. Put to the equation the 3 million jobs(bare minimum) directly linked to EU, employers living UK, investors living UK etc. add to this the trade war that you talks so much about, because of all of the above devaluation of the pound, lost savings, growing insecurity. Second comes peoples life what EU nationals will do in UK, will they be forced to leave, what about their property, vice versa, what about UK nationals in EU. What about the families of mixed marriages, what about their kids…
It will be mess for sure.

You’re the one who seems to be all about imposing trade sanctions in the case of a Brexit not me.While yes I’ve already taken account of all the bs that Eastern Europe obviously intends if we decide to get out of the scam.IE net contributor and net importer are self explanatory.In that whatever you choose to throw at us economically it will cost you money and jobs while saving us money and providing jobs.In which case our economy can only be stronger because unlike now we’ll have control over our trade balance with the EU.

As for who leaves and who stays do you really think that we were another isolated version of North Korea before we joined the EU. :unamused:

Trade sanctions? Its simply EU trade mechanisms to protect its members, they are active now. The moment you leave, the rules will be changed and you will be treated like outside of EU country.
Simple example, try to import car from US and from Germany/France/Italy etc. all EU countries, and tell me which one cost more in taxes.
Work visas will be implemented both ways, Ex pats wont be able to retire in many if not all EU countries. And this is one of the many unknown questions that need to be answered.
Stop comparing UK after leaving EU with UK before entered EU, everything is different. How you gonna be net contributor and importer when you loose millions of jobs, billions of investment, all of your mechandise becomes expensive because of import taxes those uncompetitive etc.

25

chicane:
Dolph, the same scare tactics and lies were used in the run up to the Scottish indi referendum, all complete unsubstantiated BS and but they scared a enough of the hard of thinking to swing the vote.

The EU is a busted flush, their accounts haven’t been signed off for 14yrs FFS, it’s run by a bunch of bureaucrats and failed politicians with delusions of grandeur, who couldn’t run a bath let alone a collection of highly diverses advanced economies.

Lets wait and see what Brexit is going to show, based on the result Scotland might decide to have 2nd referendum…

26

So, why, Dolph do you promote the scare mongering diatribe of the ‘stay in’ brigade, if we do not know what will happen?

“SCOTTISH exporting would be “extremely adversely affected” if the UK leaves the EU, a former trade minister has warned MSPs.
Brian Wilson said 330,000 jobs in Scotland are dependent on exporting to Europe, and he told Holyrood’s Economy Committee that a vote to leave would be “bonkers”.
46% of the Scottish exports is done to EU.”

If people around the world want Scottish products (and products from elsewhere in the UK)they will buy them, trade or non-trade barriers or not.

My suggestion is that our beloved politicians accept the concensus of opinion and plan the withdrawal of the UK from the EU, whilst renegotiating a trade deal with exactly the same terms as now currently in place.

The trade organisation GATT has for years been moving towards the removal of all trade and non-trade barriers on movements of goods around the world. This is their stated aim and will be delivered by all participants. There are some current exceptions to this to prevent dumping of steel products etc. So what will remain is inclination and partiality towards purchases from everyone around the world. If people like Scotch, they will buy it. If people prefer Japanese products they will buy that, all on a level playing field.

So, trade is a smokescreen to the whole question of ‘in’ or ‘out’.

The main questions are bringing back legislature to the UK, and bring back the best democracy we can hope for, stopping the enormous waste and duplication involved in running the EU (why do we need a president of the EU and a president of the EC? The answer is we don’t, but our beloved politicians around Europe deem it necessary at enormous cost).

27

Speedy Duck:
So, why, Dolph do you promote the scare mongering diatribe of the ‘stay in’ brigade, if we do not know what will happen?

“SCOTTISH exporting would be “extremely adversely affected” if the UK leaves the EU, a former trade minister has warned MSPs.
Brian Wilson said 330,000 jobs in Scotland are dependent on exporting to Europe, and he told Holyrood’s Economy Committee that a vote to leave would be “bonkers”.
46% of the Scottish exports is done to EU.”

If people around the world want Scottish products (and products from elsewhere in the UK)they will buy them, trade or non-trade barriers or not.

My suggestion is that our beloved politicians accept the concensus of opinion and plan the withdrawal of the UK from the EU, whilst renegotiating a trade deal with exactly the same terms as now currently in place.

The trade organisation GATT has for years been moving towards the removal of all trade and non-trade barriers on movements of goods around the world. This is their stated aim and will be delivered by all participants. There are some current exceptions to this to prevent dumping of steel products etc. So what will remain is inclination and partiality towards purchases from everyone around the world. If people like Scotch, they will buy it. If people prefer Japanese products they will buy that, all on a level playing field.

So, trade is a smokescreen to the whole question of ‘in’ or ‘out’.

The main questions are bringing back legislature to the UK, and bring back the best democracy we can hope for, stopping the enormous waste and duplication involved in running the EU (why do we need a president of the EU and a president of the EC? The answer is we don’t, but our beloved politicians around Europe deem it necessary at enormous cost).

+1

28

Great EU imposes 20% import tax on Scotch whisky then we impose 40% import tax on French wine and Brandy.So does Switzerland and Norway.While domestic consumption increases because we save the EU VAT component which gets taken off the domestic price. :bulb:

You seem to have this weird one sided idea of trade wars. :unamused: :laughing:
[/quote]
You are hungry for wars. Brexit will be mass for all, but UK will suffer more then anyone else. Put to the equation the 3 million jobs(bare minimum) directly linked to EU, employers living UK, investors living UK etc. add to this the trade war that you talks so much about, because of all of the above devaluation of the pound, lost savings, growing insecurity. Second comes peoples life what EU nationals will do in UK, will they be forced to leave, what about their property, vice versa, what about UK nationals in EU. What about the families of mixed marriages, what about their kids…
It will be mess for sure.
[/quote]
You’re the one who seems to be all about imposing trade sanctions in the case of a Brexit not me.While yes I’ve already taken account of all the bs that Eastern Europe obviously intends if we decide to get out of the scam.IE net contributor and net importer are self explanatory.In that whatever you choose to throw at us economically it will cost you money and jobs while saving us money and providing jobs.In which case our economy can only be stronger because unlike now we’ll have control over our trade balance with the EU.

As for who leaves and who stays do you really think that we were another isolated version of North Korea before we joined the EU. :unamused:
[/quote]
Trade sanctions? Its simply EU trade mechanisms to protect its members, they are active now. The moment you leave, the rules will be changed and you will be treated like outside of EU country.
Simple example, try to import car from US and from Germany/France/Italy etc. all EU countries, and tell me which one cost more in taxes.
Work visas will be implemented both ways, Ex pats wont be able to retire in many if not all EU countries. And this is one of the many unknown questions that need to be answered.
Stop comparing UK after leaving EU with UK before entered EU, everything is different. How you gonna be net contributor and importer when you loose millions of jobs, billions of investment, all of your mechandise becomes expensive because of import taxes those uncompetitive etc.
[/quote]
Outside of the EU we won’t be able to make money out of the EU. It’ll be like losing lots of money by being in the EU - but less. That’s net better off.

For Scotland - They’ll be able to negotiate their own trade deals, without going through the UK to get them. It will actually be a further step towards “devo max” if the UK leaves the EU therefore.

If the EU refuse to sell us their wares, or attempt to charge levies upon their wares - we’ll just have to source the stuff in question from somewhere else.
This will hurt EU trade more than it will hurt us having to transport it in from further afield. This extra use of transportation - will be good for the transport industry of course…

If the EU refuses to buy our stuff - well, what with nearly all our industry gone as it is - there’s not actually a lot of stuff that they buy off us that’s making us rich as it is.
Better off we flog it straight to the far east and the Americas instead. America won’t like us weakening NATO, and China won’t like us loosening our position in Europe - but they’ll not trade sanction us for it! That’s an act of war after all…

German car sales in America look to be mortally wounded as it is. A good time for our own car industry to open up new trade ties with petrol vehicles with the rest of the world - now that Petrol is coming back into fashion again. :wink:

29

In

30

Dolph:

Carryfast:
You’re the one who seems to be all about imposing trade sanctions in the case of a Brexit not me.While yes I’ve already taken account of all the bs that Eastern Europe obviously intends if we decide to get out of the scam.IE net contributor and net importer are self explanatory.In that whatever you choose to throw at us economically it will cost you money and jobs while saving us money and providing jobs.In which case our economy can only be stronger because unlike now we’ll have control over our trade balance with the EU.

As for who leaves and who stays do you really think that we were another isolated version of North Korea before we joined the EU. :unamused:

Trade sanctions? Its simply EU trade mechanisms to protect its members, they are active now. The moment you leave, the rules will be changed and you will be treated like outside of EU country.
Simple example, try to import car from US and from Germany/France/Italy etc. all EU countries, and tell me which one cost more in taxes.
Work visas will be implemented both ways, Ex pats wont be able to retire in many if not all EU countries. And this is one of the many unknown questions that need to be answered.
Stop comparing UK after leaving EU with UK before entered EU, everything is different. How you gonna be net contributor and importer when you loose millions of jobs, billions of investment, all of your mechandise becomes expensive because of import taxes those uncompetitive etc.

You continue to seem to be having some weird ideas on economics and our ability to run our own country.

Exactly what is supposedly so different about a post EU membership Britain v a pre membership one ?.

Why would it be as expensive to import a car from the US after EU exit than before.Bearing in mind that it’s the EU which sets the anti US tarrif barrier not us.

Why wouldn’t we also have the beneficial alternative of replacing EU imports with UK manufactured goods instead with an obvious advantage that we don’t need to charge so much VAT because we are no longer subsidising the EU to support East European basket case economies.With the win win effect of Brit jobs for Brit workers not German or East Euro ones.On the basis if it’s sold here it’s made here. :unamused:

Now let me guess you’re going to use the same old one sided trade war bs that you’ll hit us from a position of trade surplus weakness but we can’t hit you from one of trade deficit strength.IE you can try to change the rules but this time we’ll do what we should have done in 1973 in getting into a trade war with you that we can’t possibly lose because it can only put our country back to work.Instead of handing over Brit jobs to foreign workers and paying a fortune for the privilege. :unamused:

31

Winseer:

[quote whoever]
Some people might continue buy it some may not. But if EU impose 20% import tax people might switch to Irish whisky for example.
Nothing is known yet, what will or will not happen.

Great EU imposes 20% import tax on Scotch whisky then we impose 40% import tax on French wine and Brandy.So does Switzerland and Norway.While domestic consumption increases because we save the EU VAT component which gets taken off the domestic price. :bulb:

You seem to have this weird one sided idea of trade wars. :unamused: :laughing:
[/quote]
You are hungry for wars. Brexit will be mass for all, but UK will suffer more then anyone else. Put to the equation the 3 million jobs(bare minimum) directly linked to EU, employers living UK, investors living UK etc. add to this the trade war that you talks so much about, because of all of the above devaluation of the pound, lost savings, growing insecurity. Second comes peoples life what EU nationals will do in UK, will they be forced to leave, what about their property, vice versa, what about UK nationals in EU. What about the families of mixed marriages, what about their kids…
It will be mess for sure.
[/quote]
You’re the one who seems to be all about imposing trade sanctions in the case of a Brexit not me.While yes I’ve already taken account of all the bs that Eastern Europe obviously intends if we decide to get out of the scam.IE net contributor and net importer are self explanatory.In that whatever you choose to throw at us economically it will cost you money and jobs while saving us money and providing jobs.In which case our economy can only be stronger because unlike now we’ll have control over our trade balance with the EU.

As for who leaves and who stays do you really think that we were another isolated version of North Korea before we joined the EU. :unamused:
[/quote]
Trade sanctions? Its simply EU trade mechanisms to protect its members, they are active now. The moment you leave, the rules will be changed and you will be treated like outside of EU country.
Simple example, try to import car from US and from Germany/France/Italy etc. all EU countries, and tell me which one cost more in taxes.
Work visas will be implemented both ways, Ex pats wont be able to retire in many if not all EU countries. And this is one of the many unknown questions that need to be answered.
Stop comparing UK after leaving EU with UK before entered EU, everything is different. How you gonna be net contributor and importer when you loose millions of jobs, billions of investment, all of your mechandise becomes expensive because of import taxes those uncompetitive etc.
[/quote]
Outside of the EU we won’t be able to make money out of the EU. It’ll be like losing lots of money by being in the EU - but less. That’s net better off.

For Scotland - They’ll be able to negotiate their own trade deals, without going through the UK to get them. It will actually be a further step towards “devo max” if the UK leaves the EU therefore.

If the EU refuse to sell us their wares, or attempt to charge levies upon their wares - we’ll just have to source the stuff in question from somewhere else.
This will hurt EU trade more than it will hurt us having to transport it in from further afield. This extra use of transportation - will be good for the transport industry of course…

If the EU refuses to buy our stuff - well, what with nearly all our industry gone as it is - there’s not actually a lot of stuff that they buy off us that’s making us rich as it is.
Better off we flog it straight to the far east and the Americas instead. America won’t like us weakening NATO, and China won’t like us loosening our position in Europe - but they’ll not trade sanction us for it! That’s an act of war after all…

German car sales in America look to be mortally wounded as it is. A good time for our own car industry to open up new trade ties with petrol vehicles with the rest of the world - now that Petrol is coming back into fashion again. :wink:
[/quote]
I think both us and the US long ago realised that trade for trade sake won’t work.When what’s needed is trade barriers and quotas which in this case usually sorted themselves out.IE American buyers bought mostly American cars and we bought mostly British anyway.Bearing in mind that no one can buy a car or anything else from anyone if they are unemployed because their job has been lost to imports. :bulb:

32

Good luck with the idiotic idea of “if its not made here its not for sell here” in 21 century. Yeah, nothing changed since 1973 :unamused: :unamused:
There is no point of arguing, lets wait and see what will happen.

33

I don’t have a problem with “protectionism”. In fact, it would improve our balance of trade deficit no end.

34

Dolph:
Good luck with the idiotic idea of “if its not made here its not for sell here” in 21 century.

It’s better than allowing cheap labour economies to gradually destroy our industries by importing stuff that we can make for ourselves.Bearing in mind that unemployed workers don’t buy anything from anyone and are a net burden on the economy even if they find work in lower paid sectors.

Or we can continue to take more advice on how to run the country from …Bulgaria.That’ll work. :unamused:

Having said that if the steel industry issue doesn’t say it all,about the choice between Socialism v Nationalism and protectionism,nothing does.Workers of the world unite isn’t working.It’s time for the unions to wake up and smell the coffee.Le Pen’s ideas are the way forward not Corbyn’s. :bulb:

35

I’d say the correct way to influence the balance of trade - is to go on a diet with regards to overspending on imports - rather than giving those imports up (not popular) and pushing those exports that buyers cannot easily source from another nation - thus keeping prices at a level that can resist downward pressures from fresh sourcing overseas.

Right now for example, the price differential of Brent crude above WTI and other crudes - has remained high. The differential involves mostly the cost of transportation and the £/$ exchange rate to the UK rather than to the buyer.
This means that since the price of transportation has fallen these last couple of years, and the differential has remained high - why not push up production, and flog as much of this overpriced anomaly as we can?

We’re effectively exporting our own transport at a premium price!

"To become richer, one needs to emulate what rich people do more often, and what poor people do - less often."

36

Winseer:
I’d say the correct way to influence the balance of trade - is to go on a diet with regards to overspending on imports - rather than giving those imports up (not popular) and pushing those exports that buyers cannot easily source from another nation - thus keeping prices at a level that can resist downward pressures from fresh sourcing overseas.

Right now for example, the price differential of Brent crude above WTI and other crudes - has remained high. The differential involves mostly the cost of transportation and the £/$ exchange rate to the UK rather than to the buyer.
This means that since the price of transportation has fallen these last couple of years, and the differential has remained high - why not push up production, and flog as much of this overpriced anomaly as we can?

We’re effectively exporting our own transport at a premium price!

"To become richer, one needs to emulate what rich people do more often, and what poor people do - less often."

The usual story with Brent crude is that it is valued more because it’s lighter better quality stuff that needs less refining to make petrol etc.I’d say the opposite to your idea.As in 1973 we should limit its export because the reserves are relatively limited by comparison with Saudi or Russia.Then keep it for ourselves sold at Saudi type local prices.The downward effect on ( real ) inflation would then effectively be the same thing as a massive wage increase across the board which would cut pressure on wage costs thereby increasing competitiveness.That,combined with getting the coal industry back on line to reduce energy costs and import trade barriers/quotas,would be a game changer for domestic industry while also cutting the import bill.

37

Just bumped this back up as it had gone off the front page so get voting if you’ve not done so.

38

Why?

39

IN, anything else is just short sighted jingoistic nonsense.

40

Out