Any old promotor drivers around

You only have to read some of the posts here on TNUK to know that us Brits are and always have been an adventurous lot and want to see the world or at least part of it. For some of us the only way to achieve that goal was as a lorry driver, however for some there were other ways. I was chatting to a guy and his wife about their travels when they were young. Both of them, now well into their seventies as a lot of people on TNUK are, are still very active and haven’t given up yet on a bit of adventure.

The guy, an ex policeman, told me his first trip was in 1963 with three mates, no wife then, they bought an old Land Rover and headed off to Iran via Iraq. Said there were no paved roads after Istanbul except in Tehran.

His second trip was in 1968 in an old Commer van and that trip lasted a year and this time he had a wife to keep him company. It included most of North Africa, the Sahara and they got as far south as Nigeria before heading back up to Morocco. From there they drove across to Egypt and then up to Turkey. The next part of their journey was meant to take them to India but they had been away for getting on for a year and the old Commer van needed a bit of attention so they decided to return home.

That wasn’t the end of their travels though. In 1975 the two of them undertook what most people would look upon as their most foolhardy adventure yet. They drove down to the south of Iran via the usual route we all know. Across europe into Asia, crossing Turkey to enter Iran at Bazargan. They remember the queues of lorries at the border even wondering if they had to join the back of them. Luckily they didn’t. They drove down to the south to look at some historical sites then made their way back to Tehran. After a few days there it was back to the UK. So what you may say. Whats so special about this last trip! What was foolhardy about it! Many lorry drivers have done that been there and got the t-shirt. YES. But they didn’t do it in a blo-dy converted RELIANT three wheeler thats for sure. The mind boggles at the thought of driving a three wheeler all that way but it was also converted into a motorhome and so they slept in it most of the time as well. And to think I sometimes complained about my Scannie.

Apologies if I have put this in the wrong thread but I was looking on Topruns forum and the latest batch of excellent pics are of, mainly Friderici lorries on the Me/Pakistan run. One of the pics, shows a driver stood next to a Kenworth with no headlights or fog lights and the caption says he has removed them to avoid problems with Saudi customs.
Whats that all about ?

Suedehead:
Apologies if I have put this in the wrong thread but I was looking on Topruns forum and the latest batch of excellent pics are of, mainly Friderici lorries on the Me/Pakistan run. One of the pics, shows a driver stood next to a Kenworth with no headlights or fog lights and the caption says he has removed them to avoid problems with Saudi customs.
Whats that all about ?

I think it was about new-fangled halogen headlamps on European trucks dazzling the Saudi King or one his princes, so Saudi customs were told to takes a hammer to them. Drivers removed any fogs and spots that fell into the category. Someone will be able to flesh out the story. Robert

Can’t help a lot with that last post Suedehead but something stashed away in the little guy cells tells me Robert is somewhere near the mark.

I have attached a few photos taken just to the north of Baghdad. The first one was taken maybe 100km north. The reason I took it was that I had just gone through either a hail storm or snow shower. The desert was definitely white but by the time I had grabbed my camera it was nothing but rain and the desert had returned to its normal yuk colour. The other two photos show the entrance arches to the city. Straight on for the city or left for Basra.

All roads lead to Baghdad Fair. Possibly 86 or 87. Photos courtesy of Italian M/E drivers forum.

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I remember our Efes saying a while back there weren’t many photos of the National to be seen. I quite agree. Has anyone got any? A few have done the rounds and I have reposted them here but could do with some more from the 70’s and 80’s.

Hello Brian, you asked as to the reason for not filling up at the National, well the only thing I can offer is in the early days we did because they would only handle UTA credit vouchers which is what we used alongside Shell personal banking(nudge,nudge). I seem to remember then DKV came alive and slowly UTA got sidelined. Seeing that line of trucks reminded me of the time 4 or 5 of us were in my Scania in that spot and directly opposite was a Yugo reg VW beetle. It was late evening and we,d all had a few sherbets when we noticed there was a bloke and his bird in the beetle and it started to shake up and down so I flashed my headlights at it which lit it up like a beacon. Everytime he tried the obvious I flashed the lights! This went on for about half an hour until he jumped out the car fuming but he soon changed his mind when he saw how many of us were in the truck still laughing our heads off. He retreated gracefully, started the beetle up and shot off down the road. I think we managed to ruin his moment of joy at least for one night anyway! :wink: :wink:

‘Baghdad International Exhibition for Military Production’.
This exhibition was nothing to do with foreign companies setting up production in Iraq, it was just an excuse for the Iraqi’s to get their hands on the latest weapons and technology. It should have been titled ‘Military Equipment Exhibition’ but the Iraqi’s were to vain for that.

By the mid to late 80’s I was spending most of my time in either Iran or Iraq. In fact I worked in both countries the whole time the war between them was taking place. Not full time but one year in the mid to late eighties I spent a total of seven months between the two. Promotor Exhibitions were the leading exhibition service company and event organiser for both countries and I handled much of the work. From selling our services, both freight and travel and the many other services exhibiting company representatives needed to enable them to do their job, I was kept busy. I had a good contact in Baghdad who worked with the British pharmaceutical companies and a couple of times a year seminars would be held and the British companies would hold an exhibition at the same time. It involved us shipping out one trailer comprising stands and exhibits and again we provided flights and hotels for our clients. Promotor driver Tommy Birch was my choice of driver as he had been an electrician before his driving days so could wire up the stands. Tommy would drive out whilst I took the easy option and flew.

I think it would have been late November 1988 as I was wrapping up the job at the Baghdad International Trade Fair and flying home next day that I noticed a few important looking Iraqi’s in the British pavilion. Later in the day our agent asked me to talk to them as they were organising a ‘Military Production" exhibition for the following year. At the meeting I outlined our companies experience in organising British Group participation at such events and "hay ho’ we were asked to get involved. The Iraqi who was tasked with organising the exhibition was Hussein Kamel al-Majid, Minister of Military Industries and Saddam Hussein’s son in law. Little did I know then what a ‘can of worms’ we were getting involved in. Even Maggie herself was involved.

Upon my return to the UK we set about organising the exhibition. We approached the British Overseas Trade Board and various trade organisations for support but strangely nobody wanted to know so we took it upon ourself to form a ‘British Group’ to participate at the event. We did a mail shot and advertised the show but it proved hard work to get anyone interested. We realised later that there were a great many companies involved in supplying the Iraqi armed forces but they preferred to keep their heads below the parapet. A lot of business was hush hush but still supported by the British government so why shout about it. However, we had two companies involved that made the event viable. One was the Iraqi owned ‘Matrix Churchill’ from Coventry and the other was BAE Systems who were trying to sell the Hawk trainer jet amongst other things to Iraq. We also managed to pull in a small number of other others and a grand total of twelve companies participated.

The ‘British Group’ were allocated part of the British Pavilion so that meant we were setting up on known territory. I contracted the building of the stands to our friend from Cyprus, George Stavaros, who had built stands for us at events in North Africa. Matrix Churchill had a large stand with a fair number of machine tools on display. BAE had a smaller stand but we had to kit it out internally for them. Of course they didn’t have a Hawk trainer there. That was down at the old airport which had been revamped a few years before and was located in the suburbs in the north west of the city. Here a large number of foreign companies were showing off all kinds of military hardware but unfortunately we weren’t involved.

Whenever I was involved in an exhibition in Iraq one of my first ports of call was the British Embassy. I got to know a number of ‘commercial secretaries’ over the years and this event was no different. I was also introduced to the “Military Attache” who was very interested in the show but neither of them wanted to be involved other than keeping an eye on proceedings. We shipped the exhibits out in two trailers. One was a Promotor lorry the other was a subbie. I handled all the onsite work myself with the help of local labour provided by our agent. The travel arrangements for the exhibitors was not too arduous. I think a number of the exhibitors made their own arrangements but we still had a fair sized group that we stuck in the ‘Ishtar Sheraton’ Hotel down Sadoun Street. I only had to meet one small group at the airport and ferry them back to the hotel but of course as most flights came in around midnight it meant I didn’t get much sleep.

More to follow;.

I have followed this thread almost from inception in 2016. What a fantastic opportunity all those that worked with Promotor had.

I would have given my right arm for an opportunity that some of you guys got to experience, though I guess those days are long gone with half of Iraq/Iran/Syria now a warzone :cry:

Steve H:
I have followed this thread almost from inception in 2016. What a fantastic opportunity all those that worked with Promotor had.

I would have given my right arm for an opportunity that some of you guys got to experience, though I guess those days are long gone with half of Iraq/Iran/Syria now a warzone :cry:

Hello Steve H. Considering we were a such a small company its surprising the varied work the company became involved in. Almost all down to the late Peter Calderwood and his talent for spotting business opportunities and I am sure some will say poaching others ideas and doing them better.

‘Baghdad International Exhibition for Military Production’.
Part 2.

You know how it is. You see something but you don’t really take it in. Something is happening, you look, you see, but perhaps its only for a fleeting moment. Thats how it was with me.

The stands were built, most of the exhibits were in place. The airfreight had been collected from the airport. Tomorrow the exhibition would be declared open. I was standing outside the British Pavillion with the commercial secretary from the embassy. Although he and the military attache were keeping things low key I still saw a lot of them. We were just chatting about nothing in particular when we heard muffled explosions in the distance. Not to loud but it was something out of the ordinary. We looked in the direction of the explosions and saw white puffs of smoke in the sky. It went on for three or four minutes, maybe longer. Then it stopped. We looked at one another, kinda shrugged our shoulders and carried on as before.

It wasn’t until next day that I heard what had happened. I have in my last post mentioned that the old airport situated in the north west suburbs of Baghdad was hosting the aircraft and other large military items that couldn’t be accommodated in the fairground. But it wasn’t all about displaying military equipment. Some other friendly arab states had been invited to attend with some of there own hardware. One of the friendly states was Egypt who sent some of their fighter aircraft to the show. However, the airfield being used was in the suburbs and the flight paths came very close to some of the Iraqi ministries. A couple of days before an aircraft coming in to land didn’t follow the very precise flight path and flew over one of the ministry buildings. Now there were ack ack guns protecting these building but none of them took any action so some Iraqi bigwig officer decided they needed to be taught a lesson. Most of the poor Iraqi’s manning the guns were arrested and thrown in Abu Greib prison whilst some of the officers, so the story goes, were executed. It seems what the commercial secretary and I saw was an attack on another aircraft which, like the one a day or so before, was not following the flight plan and had strayed near the ministry buildings. Of course the poor Iraqis manning the guns didn’t want to end up in prison or face execution so all the guns started blazing away. Unfortunately, the aircraft belonged to the Egyptian Air Force and Egypt was a staunch supporter of Iraq but by pure luck the ack ack boys managed to hit it. The pilot was injured but managed to eject from his stricken aircraft which then proceeded to spiral down to earth where it crashed on top of a minibus transporting Yugoslav workers killing a number of them. It didn’t take long for the Iraqi’s to realise they had a major diplomatic incident on their hands and the first thing they did was scoop up the pilot and rush him off to the Irish ‘Park Group’ hospital where he was patched up by the lovely Irish nurses. I don’t think the nurses could do much for the Yugo workers though as they were too far gone to be resuscitated.

The exhibition was dubbed a success by the Iraqis and the British Group seemed pleased to have participated but as most business negotiations happened behind closed doors nobody made any startling disclosures. Everything was hush hush. BAE or as it was then British Aerospace had high hopes of selling its Hawk jet trainers and it looked like a done deal but politics came into it and later Maggie stepped in and vetoed the deal.

Matrix Churchill, who of course were largely Iraqi owned, continued as before selling their machine tools into the Iraqi market but they were used only for peaceful purposes. What a load of balls that was. They had a large contingent of UK workers in Baghdad looking after the machines. All these men were sworn to secrecy and told not to discuss company business but that didn’t stop them informing us that the machines were turning out round casings that fitted into tubes or hinted that they made loud noises if you hit a cap on the end. Of course we all knew they were turning out artillery shells by the thousand every day. I had to laugh when a few years later the ‘Scott Enquirey’ was set up in 93 to look at the arms to Iraq story. A statement was made by, I think Maggie, that ‘our intelligence failed to pick up warnings that Matrix Churchill machine tools were going to Iraq munitions factories’. They didn’t know!!! Every ex pat and visitor to Iraq knew. Paul Henderson, Matrix Churchill’s managing director knew and he worked for MI6 for eleven years!!! But our intelligence services didn’t know. Hmmm. Worrying aint it. Lets hope they’ve improved.

For Promotor it was also a successful exhibition. Another one to add to the list. Time passed and the Iraq/Iran war ended. Hussein Kamel al-Majid the Iraqi tasked with setting up the exhibition and his brother Saddam Kamel, both married to Saddam Hussein’s daughters fled Iraq seeking sanctuary in Jordan. Later they were talked into returning home where they were forced to divorce their wives and three days after their return were murdered by, allegedly, their relatives in the Majid clan for dishonouring the family name.

Promotor moved on and the ‘Baghdad International Exhibition for Military Production’ was forgotten about until the ‘Scott Enquiry’ raised its ugly head. Newspapers started to make enquiries and soon found out we were the organisers of the British Group. We had many calls from both the newspapers and also the BBC Panorama team. What they were after of course was proof that the British Government was backing the participants and that the Embassy in Baghdad were involved. Rest assured they got nothing from us.

Hi Sandway, I think that there is a load of very interesting information there so thanks for taking the time to write it all down and for sharing it with us.
I presume that all the equipment that you took out and brought back to the U.K. went out on an A.T.A. Carnet so if this was the case, did you ever have any problems coming back through Zakho or Kapikule.
As a matter of interest Brian how many trucks did Promotors have and did you use subbies often or just on the odd occasion.
You asked for pictures of The National Hotel in Belgrade, well I am afraid that this is the only that I have which you have probably seen before. As you know it could get bloody cold at night parked there without a night heater and I remember one Saturday night in winter myself and another driver ending up booking a room in the hotel just to keep warm.
On a couple of occasion I had a shower in one of the rooms in the hotel which they charged me about 50 pence which I thought was well worth it at the time. They would also let you use the toilets to have a wash and it was quite common to see a table full of drivers with their washing bags and towels on the table while they were tucking into their Mixed Grill.
It often looked quite picturesque whenever it snowed at The National as it hid all the discarded Heinz baked beans cans and Campbell’s soup tins, along with all the old tea bags and the half filled condoms that lay around the parking area and in the bushes.
I am pleased to see those old photos of The National from that Italian web site that you posted as it answers a question that I asked on Trucknet many years ago.
The trailer that is parked up belonged to Mick Martin, I met Mick who was an owner driver on at least three occasions around 1980 and I remember that his company was called MayFreight from a place called Mayfield in Sussex. I.I.R.C. he had a brown M.A.N. at the time and he was one of those nice quiet types who just got on with the job. It was strange how often that you met up with somebody running back to the U.K. and then you would bump into them again about a week later, when you were on your way back out.
It looks like Mick has probably dropped his trailer at The National and gone into Belgrade to get a visa for some Middle Eastern country.

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=45945&p=968059&hilit=Mayfreight

I recognised a Davis Turner Volvo in the photo which might of belonged to David Duxbury from Chorley. In the other photo you might recognise an M.& C. Volvo from Braintree and a D.A.F. from Falcongate either from Birkenhead or their Aberdeen depot. The white D.A.F, with the brown stripe and the air con certainly rings a bell but at the moment I can’t think who it belonged to.
As regards not using the fuel station at The National to fill up, well if you had come through Hungary and filled up on The Black Market with just over a 1,000 litres of diesel, it would of cost you one Deutsch Mark for three litres when it was four D.M. to the G.B. pound, which was about G.B.P. 83 for 222 gallons.

The National Hotel, Belgrade.

Regards Steve.

Reading this about Matrix Churchill took me back, they were involved with the Super gun weren’t they? I was on part time traction for a company out of Teesport for Ferrymasters and MAT at the time and often would drop or pick up trailers from shed 5 which was used partly for customs. On that particular day went to drop trailer in shed and stopped by security " can’t go in there mate" could see that something was going on as every man and his dog was there . The load of pipes had been impounded think they were written down as oil field pipes, but they were highly polished , not your average piece of pipeline. Was on a night job a couple of days later and had a quick look at aforementioned pipes ( no security about) and having worked in the oil industry those pipe sections were special !!

jshepguis:
Reading this about Matrix Churchill took me back, they were involved with the Super gun weren’t they? I was on part time traction for a company out of Teesport for Ferrymasters and MAT at the time and often would drop or pick up trailers from shed 5 which was used partly for customs. On that particular day went to drop trailer in shed and stopped by security " can’t go in there mate" could see that something was going on as every man and his dog was there . The load of pipes had been impounded think they were written down as oil field pipes, but they were highly polished , not your average piece of pipeline. Was on a night job a couple of days later and had a quick look at aforementioned pipes ( no security about) and having worked in the oil industry those pipe sections were special !!

Hello jshepguis. Interesting you having seen those pipes close up. I don’t know if Matrix Churchill were involved with the Supergun in any way but what I do know is that a Canadian by the name of Gerald Bull was the inventor of the gun and Sheffield Forgemasters made the tubes/pipes. Bull sold the idea to Saddam Hussein and Saddam’s son in law Hussein Kamel al-Majid was heavily involved in procuring the project for Iraq. I mentioned what happened to Kamel and his brother in my last post so won’t repeat it here. The main pieces of the gun were indeed impounded at Teesport and two of the tubes ended up at a museum in Hampshire. Gerald Bull came to a sticky end himself when he was assassinated, in Belgium I think, by Mossad although that was never confirmed. All in all a murky business.

Here is one about the supergun. Interesting read.

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=43368&p=1730512&hilit=Supergun#p1730512

Danne

Makes me laugh the stories told about those guns (2 biguns and 1 small one were built but never assembled). They reckon they could have been used against Israel! The Supergun weighed getting on for 1,500 tons. It had to be concreted in a hillside to hold it down when fired. It was so powerful it would show up on a seismograph as an earthquake would. It would hurl a missile so far it would have landed in south America. I think Israel were quite safe but that didn’t stop them bumping Bull off. Best to err on the side of caution I suppose!!!

One for Nottsnortherner or anyone else who recognises the Promotor driver. The Promotor lorry is loaded with Portakabins and I believe is on its way to Iran in 75 or 76. The reg number is GYX 761N and according to the attached fleet list the driver was Jim Conlan. There are two drivers shown in the photo. Can anyone tell me if Jim Conlan appears there and which one is he. I see that this unit has an AC unit fitted on the roof. It is the first time I have seen one fitted to a Promotor lorry.
If anyone has any other photos of this Portakabin job I would love to see them.

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Morning mushroomman. I am sure ATA Carnets weren’t recognised in Iraq. I think goods were always imported into Iraq on a temporary import basis and then your agent completed the paperwork at the destination for the permanent import. At the end of a trade fair I always had to sort out the invoices to show those goods that were sold and staying in Iraq, those that were returning to UK or any other destination and those goods that were consumed, these last items included literature, give aways, food and drink. We did use ATA Carnets in Turkey but you had to be very careful to obey the rules.

You asked how many lorries Promotor had. We were never a big company. I posted a list of drivers/units recently from 75. That list showed twelve units. The numbers did go up some in the following few years but not appreciably. We also had a number of rigids both boxes and small car transporters. We used a fair number of subbies on an as required basis. Mick Martin was one of those and of course he bought my old Scannie unit VGF 899M from Promotor in 78.

Talking of the National I have attached a photo I always thought was taken at the back of the parking area were the Dow lorries are shown parked up in the snow. But after looking at the height of the trees maybe I am wrong. Perhaps you recognise some of the drivers. I have also attached another photo of the famous schoolteacher come barber in Tartous.

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Hi Sandway, I am not sure if the Mick Martin that I am thinking of is the same Mick Martin who Micky Tremlow mentioned on page32 of this thread. I have been doing a search on Trucknet and it seems that there was another Mick Martin who subbed for Noblett and Underwood, as I think that they were from your part of the woods maybe this could be the Mick Martin who bought your Scania. :confused:
I am afraid that I don’t recall any of the faces that were shown on that photo which might of been taken at The National, the trees certainly look similar to the ones that are planted along the side of the road. At the back of my mind I have a feeling that in 1980 when I took that photo the concrete slabbed area outside the hotel was big enough to take two trucks in length and about six or eight trucks abreast. Behind this I think that it was dirt or cinder ash all the way back to the trees.
In fact I can only remember parking on the slabbed area a few times over the years as often than not this area was already filled up with trucks by the time that I had arrived and most of the time I ended up parking along the roadway. Another useless bit of information is that in over seven years of driving on the continent there was only once that I had my truck broken into and that was once when I had pulled onto The National just to have a meal.
I have no idea when the hotel was built but at a guess I would say maybe late sixties as that slabbed area to me along with those street lights, may of started off as being a coach parking area but I would suspect that when the middle east boom got underway and the hotel started getting filled up with Western European lorries the coach drivers decided to stop somewhere else but that’s just a thought.
If ever I was clearing in Belgrade down at the docks on The Danube and it was after midday, then I would go straight to The National. The customs would only do imports in the morning and exports in the afternoon so I would have an early finish then poodle down into the docks early the next morning.
As far as I can remember, they opened a new customs area around 1986/7 which was about two miles before The National Hotel. The new customs area was stuck in field in the middle of nowhere where the road from Hungary and Novi Sad joined the Zagreb to Belgrade Autoput.
I have just had a look on Google Earth and was surprised to see how all that area has now changed over the years.
If you go on Google Earth and put in
Customs office - Belgrade Terminal, Belgrade, Serbia
and
Hotel Nacional, Auto put br., Novi Beograd, Serbia

The area has certainly changed since we knew it Brian and it looks like you can’t access the hotel from the main road which is now a motorway. I remember an old middle east man called Barry Longden who I used to work with and he once told me that the first few trips that he did to Iran that the road which went past The National was still cobbled.

The New Belgrade Customs Compound.

Regards Steve.

The Scania, second from the left, is Steve Lacy’s old vehicle when he was an owner driver before joining Promotor. Didn’t realise you were an O/D Steve. What work were you doing?

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