According to Ms (or is it mrs) Beverly Bell - temporary senior Traffic Commisioner or whatever her title is now - as long as you can hire or borrow a vehicle at short notice then she will be happy. i think she mentioned within a day or two.
She made a point of bringing this up at a RHA seminar last week
very good presentation by Ms Bell by the way - worth seeing
Has anyone found out at first hand any info on this issue,is what Beverly bell said true ?
Thanks
Does anyone know where you can see the presentation by miss bell ? Is it on the web
My VOSA TM questionair came through the letter box today and most of it is fairly easy to follow with the guidance notes, but what’s this about from December 2011 (4th?) an operator must have access to a vehicle? I don’t operate anything these days on my licence so have no discs or vehicles specified on my O licence. Which is fully legal. (at this time)
But from this December it seems I can’t keep my licence unless I have “access” to a “UK registered truck”■■ Do I have to ‘hand back’ my O licence back, or could I stay as I am, & point the VOSA man toward my F16, ‘soon to be show truck’■■
I just don’t see where they’re going with this?
Ross.
mine came today as well and I noticed the same thing ( it’s not a problem for me)
It says
" An O-Licence can currently be held by an operator without any vehicles or any formal arrangements to have any vehicles. But from 4 December operators with standard Licenses must be able to prove they have a formal arrangement for access at all times to at least one vehicle registered or in circulation in GB.
This could be by specifying a vehicle for use under an O licence or by demonstrating on request that the licence holder has a vehicle available - so vehicles may be either wholly owned or held under a hire-purchase, hire/leasing arrangement or other type of formal arrangement.
and it says the same thing here businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/ac … ONEOFFPAGE
it would be interesting to know why this is changing ?
in the consultation document it says
Possessing vehicles
7.
Under current EC and domestic legislation, an operator’s licence can be granted or held by a person or organisation that does not possess any vehicles. This practice is no longer permitted under the new Regulation. From 4 December 2011, all existing and future goods and bus/coach
operators will be required to have at least one vehicle registered or in circulation in the UK.
8
However, the Regulation allows individual Member States to decide whether to require operators to have at least one vehicle registration mark (VRM) specified on the O-licence13. The Department does not propose to do this. Instead, it proposes that the requirements of the Regulation in this regard should be met in two ways:The O-licence application form will include a declaration that the licence-holder must be able to prove at all times that they have at least one vehicle that meets the requirements of the Regulation — i.e. that it is either wholly owned, or held under a hire-purchase, hire/leasing arrangement or other type of formal arrangement. Informal arrangements to hire or borrow a vehicle will not be sufficient.
Traffic Commissioners will be able to request proof of the arrangements in the bullet above at any time after the licence has been issued — as a part of existing compliance monitoring. Failure to prove these arrangements at any time will be considered a breach of the requirements of the Regulation and Traffic Commissioners will be able to take enforcement action.
but it still doesn’t say why this in in the legislation ■■
This is another weapon to stop the ‘O licence for hire’ gang 
I bet there are loads of people who packed in but have kept hold of their licences who are going to be a bit miffed at this. It would be interesting to know what proportion of valid licences have zero vehicles listed on them.
Paul
I got the forms last night but didn’t get a chance to look through them. I haven’t got a truck either as I had a change of plan from buying the truck in the current climate.
But it is annoying I paid the fees etc and if the right offer came along I would be ready to go. So what happens if you only hire a truck as and when you need it?
kr79:
So what happens if you only hire a truck as and when you need it?
IMHO, that’s an excellent question that needs a good answer.
IIRC, the whole idea of having a ‘margin’ on the licence was that operators could hire extra vehicles at peak times, or a single vehicle when needed.
I’ve heard of companies that have an ‘O’ licence with zero actual vehicles in possession and that’s all completely above board under the present system, so this new idea seems to be a backward step which can only heap extra difficulties and costs on operators. 
Least it’s a bit of work for someone tossing it off at their offices though… 
I imagine the criteria will change for a licence, certainly the costs of starting up again, they may change the advert format and want more money for that too. Pure speculation on my part, but I have never heard of VOSA dropping their prices to make it easier to enter the market.
My licence expired and the disc will be still stuck to a screen somewhere fading away
Whats to stop you putting a van or car reg on the licence?, it doesn’t say it has to be HGV.
Big Joe:
Whats to stop you putting a van or car reg on the licence?, it doesn’t say it has to be HGV.
When you add a vehicle to your licence you are asked when the GVW is so if you put something like your car or van on then it will be under 3500kg and will presumably come up as an error.
Paul
Would an account set up with a hire company be acceptable as access to a vehicle?
kr79:
Would an account set up with a hire company be acceptable as access to a vehicle?
No.
Here is what it says
The O-licence application form will include a declaration that the licence-holder must be able to prove at all times that they have at least one vehicle that meets the requirements of the Regulation — i.e. that it is either wholly owned, or held under a hire-purchase, hire/leasing arrangement or other type of formal arrangement. Informal arrangements to hire or borrow a vehicle will not be sufficient.
Traffic Commissioners will be able to request proof of the arrangements in the bullet above at any time after the licence has been issued — as a part of existing compliance monitoring. Failure to prove these arrangements at any time will be considered a breach of the requirements of the Regulation and Traffic Commissioners will be able to take enforcement action.
Regards,
Nick
ncooper:
kr79:
Would an account set up with a hire company be acceptable as access to a vehicle?No.
Here is what it saysThe O-licence application form will include a declaration that the licence-holder must be able to prove at all times that they have at least one vehicle that meets the requirements of the Regulation — i.e. that it is either wholly owned, or held under a hire-purchase, hire/leasing arrangement or other type of formal arrangement. Informal arrangements to hire or borrow a vehicle will not be sufficient.
Traffic Commissioners will be able to request proof of the arrangements in the bullet above at any time after the licence has been issued — as a part of existing compliance monitoring. Failure to prove these arrangements at any time will be considered a breach of the requirements of the Regulation and Traffic Commissioners will be able to take enforcement action.Regards,
Nick
I think it all hinges on the word “formal”, so a hire agreement with a hire company will do just fine I recon according to the wording of the form.
Ross.
I think it all hinges on this
the licence-holder must be able to prove at all times that they have at least one vehicle that meets the requirements of the Regulation — i.e. that it is either wholly owned, or held under a hire-purchase, hire/leasing arrangement or other type of formal arrangement.
It means that you must actually possess a vehicle and that just having access to a random (hire) vehicle will not do.
The vehicle will have to be specified on the licence,hardly possible if you have an account but are not currently renting one.
Regards,
Nick
ncooper:
I think it all hinges on thisthe licence-holder must be able to prove at all times that they have at least one vehicle that meets the requirements of the Regulation — i.e. that it is either wholly owned, or held under a hire-purchase, hire/leasing arrangement or other type of formal arrangement.
It means that you must actually possess a vehicle and that just having access to a random (hire) vehicle will not do.
The vehicle will have to be specified on the licence,hardly possible if you have an account but are not currently renting one.Regards,
Nick
I think you will get reasonable notice from VOSA, that they will want to see “something”, then you trott off to your local friendly truckhire company, and, for a small fee, you get a registration number, probabaly one which sits in the corner doing very little, you use that registration, and Bobs your uncle 
My local truckhire company seem to be happy with the idea, and, that`s if they come a calling at all 
Stanley Mitchell:
I think you will get reasonable notice from VOSA, that they will want to see “something”, then you trott off to your local friendly truckhire company, and, for a small fee, you get a registration number, probabaly one which sits in the corner doing very little, you use that registration, and Bobs your uncle
VOSA might get wise to that though if/when half a dozen local operators all put the same vehicle on their licence…
I don’t get why they’re doing this to be honest. I don’t see how it does any harm at all for someone to keep hold of their O-Licence when they’re not using it, after all they’ll still be paying the appropriate fees as they are on a per-licence rather than a per-vehicle basis. Also, how far will they take it? If you sell a vehicle one week but are not buying a replacement until the next you are technically breaking the rules, will they be policing this? If not where do they draw the line between that and someone keeping an empty licence for a number of years?
Paul
repton:
Stanley Mitchell:
I think you will get reasonable notice from VOSA, that they will want to see “something”, then you trott off to your local friendly truckhire company, and, for a small fee, you get a registration number, probabaly one which sits in the corner doing very little, you use that registration, and Bobs your uncleVOSA might get wise to that though if/when half a dozen local operators all put the same vehicle on their licence…
I don’t get why they’re doing this to be honest. I don’t see how it does any harm at all for someone to keep hold of their O-Licence when they’re not using it, after all they’ll still be paying the appropriate fees as they are on a per-licence rather than a per-vehicle basis. Also, how far will they take it? If you sell a vehicle one week but are not buying a replacement until the next you are technically breaking the rules, will they be policing this? If not where do they draw the line between that and someone keeping an empty licence for a number of years?
Paul
They might get wise, or we might get lucky, eitherway, it will take an age for anything to happen
I agree on the rest Paul, they aint got the manpower to police the WTD, and, at times come up short chasing John Wayne Trucking, so, Id bet those VOSA boys are thinking the same as us
Unless the desk bound junior`s are having to show something for their pay packet , IMO its been dreamed up by some spiteful euroland pen pusher 
