look you have to have two weekly rests in two consecitve fixed weeks so the time is 1 pm sunday
i bet i will be banging my head on the table when i find out the answer 
delboytwo:
look you have to have two weekly rests in two consecitve fixed weeks so the time is 1 pm sunday
I can sense your frustration Del when you start a sentence off with.“look” !!! 
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
look you have to have two weekly rests in two consecitve fixed weeks so the time is 1 pm sundayI can sense your frustration Del when you start a sentence off with.“look” !!!
frustration the wife left me two hours ago 
delboytwo:
i bet i will be banging my head on the table when i find out the answer
Ok, i’m going to almost give you the answer, all you got to do is to say the time
You have to have weekly rest periods. They are something that happen every week. They can start in one and finish in another. So in the second week i mentioned there is only one way to get a weekly rest in that same week. And that is to be finished by…what time?
midnight sat
delboytwo:
midnight sat
No Del. It will have to start in the same week but does not have to finish in that week. Have another go !! Think about it logically and literally. When is the latest you can leave it to to be included in that week.
Mike-C:
Think about it logically and literally. When is the latest you can leave it to to be included in that week.
And remembering the tacho doesn’t deal in seconds.
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
midnight satNo Del. It will have to start in the same week but does not have to finish in that week. Have another go !! Think about it logically and literally. When is the latest you can leave it to to be included in that week.
23 59 sun
delboytwo:
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
midnight satNo Del. It will have to start in the same week but does not have to finish in that week. Have another go !! Think about it logically and literally. When is the latest you can leave it to to be included in that week.
23 59 sun
A Trucknet UK MUG and Pencil is on its way to you !!!
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
midnight satNo Del. It will have to start in the same week but does not have to finish in that week. Have another go !! Think about it logically and literally. When is the latest you can leave it to to be included in that week.
23 59 sun
A Trucknet UK MUG and Pencil is on its way to you !!!
can you tell my the why bit please and i think i cant take all the credit cos i think Rog as said that time
Coffeeholic:
In the same way it says nothing about 144 hours.
True, but mathematics is an exact science - 6 X 24 = 144 - cannot argue with that 
A little like there is nothing written about a max 15 hour shift but there is a requirement for a minimum 9 hour rest so 24 - 9 = 15
delboytwo:
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
Mike-C:
delboytwo:
midnight satNo Del. It will have to start in the same week but does not have to finish in that week. Have another go !! Think about it logically and literally. When is the latest you can leave it to to be included in that week.
23 59 sun
A Trucknet UK MUG and Pencil is on its way to you !!!
can you tell my the why bit please and i think i cant take all the credit cos i think Rog as said that time
Well the first week you worked and you started a weekly rest at 10pm on the Saturday. This continued until Tuesday. So we have had our rest and now we start off another weeks work on Tuesday. We are going to need a weekly break in this week (in every week you need a break), the only way to get it in this week is to start it in this week. As the Meercat says.“simples” !!!
thanks Mike
that was good fun if a bit frustrating
any more quiz for us keeps my brain working as it going slow at the mo
start - finish
mon 9:00 - 00:00
tues 9:00 - 00:00
wed 9:00 - 00:00
thurs 9:00 - 22:00
fri 9:00 - 22:00
sat 9:00 - 22:00
sun
mon
tues 13:00 - 04:00
wed 13:00 - 04:00
thurs 13:00 - 0400
fri 13:00 - 02:00
sat 13:00 - 02:00
sun 13:00 - 02:00
your next weekly rest is due to start before 13:00 on monday as this is the end of the 6th 24hr period following your last weekly rest
if you finish at 02:00 on monday, your weekly rest will start at 02:00 on monday because you cant start another shift until you have a full weekly rest
ROG:
Coffeeholic:
In the same way it says nothing about 144 hours.True, but mathematics is an exact science - 6 X 24 = 144 - cannot argue with that
Yes, six periods of 24 hours is indeed 144 hours but a 24-hour period can be less than 24 hours and six of them can therefore be less than 144 hours
ROG:
A little like there is nothing written about a max 15 hour shift but there is a requirement for a minimum 9 hour rest so 24 - 9 = 15
And there is a requirement for a weekly rest after 6x24 hour periods, and the rules tell us when a 24 hour period begins and ends, it begins when you end a rest period and it ends when you begin one, even if the time between those two marks is less than 24 hours.
205:
start - finish
mon 9:00 - 00:00
tues 9:00 - 00:00
wed 9:00 - 00:00
thurs 9:00 - 22:00
fri 9:00 - 22:00
sat 9:00 - 22:00
sun
mon
tues 13:00 - 04:00
wed 13:00 - 04:00
thurs 13:00 - 0400
fri 13:00 - 02:00
sat 13:00 - 02:00
sun 13:00 - 02:00your next weekly rest is due to start before 13:00 on monday as this is the end of the 6th 24hr period following your last weekly rest
if you finish at 02:00 on monday, your weekly rest will start at 02:00 on monday because you cant start another shift until you have a full weekly rest
You do not have a rest period in the second week in your example and each week must have a rest period applying to it, the rest period which finished at 13:00 on Tuesday is for week 1. Week 2 needs a rest period as well and by going beyond 23:59 there is no rest period for that week.
Coffeeholic:
ROG:
Coffeeholic:
In the same way it says nothing about 144 hours.True, but mathematics is an exact science - 6 X 24 = 144 - cannot argue with that
Yes, six periods of 24 hours is indeed 144 hours but a 24-hour period can be less than 24 hours and six of them can therefore be less than 144 hours
ROG:
A little like there is nothing written about a max 15 hour shift but there is a requirement for a minimum 9 hour rest so 24 - 9 = 15And there is a requirement for a weekly rest after 6x24 hour periods, and the rules tell us when a 24 hour period begins and ends, it begins when you end a rest period and it ends when you begin one, even if the time between those two marks is less than 24 hours.
I cannot believe that you seem to have fell into the same trap as I often do 
Each regulation shall be viewed as it is written and on it’s own.
If it is linked to any other regulation then it will state as much in that regulation.
You have linked two regulations together instead of taking each one on it’s own merits.
The two regulations, which happen to have the same wording within them, seem as though they should be linked but in fact are seperate. The wording, although the same, has different meanings for each.
As you have told me in the past - take each regulation and see if the requirement of that regulation has been met - if yes, then it’s legal.
Coffeeholic:
205:
start - finish
mon 9:00 - 00:00
tues 9:00 - 00:00
wed 9:00 - 00:00
thurs 9:00 - 22:00
fri 9:00 - 22:00
sat 9:00 - 22:00
sun
mon
tues 13:00 - 04:00
wed 13:00 - 04:00
thurs 13:00 - 0400
fri 13:00 - 02:00
sat 13:00 - 02:00
sun 13:00 - 02:00your next weekly rest is due to start before 13:00 on monday as this is the end of the 6th 24hr period following your last weekly rest
if you finish at 02:00 on monday, your weekly rest will start at 02:00 on monday because you cant start another shift until you have a full weekly restYou do not have a rest period in the second week in your example and each week must have a rest period applying to it, the rest period which finished at 13:00 on Tuesday is for week 1. Week 2 needs a rest period as well and by going beyond 23:59 there is no rest period for that week.
week 2 starts at 13:00 on tuesday as we are not tied to a fixed week…ie 00:00 monday until 23:59 sunday
so the weekly rest that starts at 02:00 on mon is attached to the previous 6 days
taken from rules published by VOSA
Note: An actual working week starts at the end of a weekly rest period, and finishes when another
weekly rest period is commenced, which may mean weekly rest is taken in the middle of a fixed
(Monday to Sunday) week. This is perfectly acceptable — the working week is not required to be
aligned with the ‘fixed’ week contained in the rules, provided all the relevant limits are complied with.
ROG:
Each regulation shall be viewed as it is written and on it’s own.
Although according to the actual legislation (561/2006), thats not the case as regards definitions.
CHAPTER VI
FINAL PROVISIONS
Article 26
Regulation (EEC) No 3821/85 is hereby amended as follows:
- Article 2 shall be replaced by the following:
‘Article 2
For the purpose of this Regulation the definitions set out
in Article 4 of Regulation (EC) No 561/2006 of the
European Parliament and of the Council of 15 March
2006 on the harmonisation of certain social legislation
relating to road transport and amending Council
Regulations (EEC) No 3821/85 and (EC) No 2135/98
(*) shall apply.
ROG:
If it is linked to any other regulation then it will state as much in that regulation.
Like this
- The term “day”, within the meaning of Regulation No 3820/85 on the harmonization of certain social legislation relating to road transport and of Regulation No 3821/85 on recording equipment in road transport, must be understood as equivalent to the term “period of 24 hours”, which refers to any period of that duration which commences at the time when the driver activates the tachograph following a weekly or daily rest period.
or
28 A reading of Article 8(1) of Regulation No 3820/85 shows that the expressions “day” and “period of 24 hours” are synonymous. In the first subparagraph of Article 8(1) reference is made to the “period of 24 hours”, whilst in the second the word “day” is used, the subject of both subparagraphs being the same, namely rest periods.
29 In its judgment in Van Swieten, cited above, the Court defined the expression “period of 24 hours” as meaning the period commencing at the time when the driver activates the tachograph following a weekly or daily rest period.
30 The reply to the second question should therefore be that the term “day”, within the meaning of Regulations Nos 3820/85 and 3821/85, must be understood as equivalent to the term “period of 24 hours”, which refers to any period of that duration which commences at the time when the driver activates the tachograph following a weekly or daily rest period.
ROG:
You have linked two regulations together instead of taking each one on it’s own merits.
Doh !! Just like them dumb judges did in that case !!
eur-lex.europa.eu/smartapi/cgi/s … 0394&lg=en
ROG:
The two regulations, which happen to have the same wording within them, seem as though they should be linked but in fact are seperate. The wording, although the same, has different meanings for each.
That quote i believe was Marc Michielsen and Geybels Transport Service NV (GTS) solicitors argument , but he lost his case as you can see.