who covers northern ireland?(is that north west?)
i’m guessing it isn’t.
jj72:
not the people colin was meaning it’s not
I’m not sure who Colin meant, as he’s having a go at everyone, however, my point is that the amount of UK hauliers flagging could have only been made possible due to European integration.
Let’s not forget that the WTD is acually the European Working Time Directive.
It’s important to know which piece of legislation does what.
Dazza:
jj72:
not the people colin was meaning it’s notI’m not sure who Colin meant, as he’s having a go at everyone, however, my point is that the amount of UK hauliers flagging could have only been made possible due to European integration.
Let’s not forget that the WTD is acually the European Working Time Directive.
It’s important to know which piece of legislation does what.
Hi dazza im just trying to make clear that when the TC does a good job and takes the operator licence from the company there seems to be no back up response when the haulier goes about his work on another licence be it by any european state or on another brittish one bought in the trucking press or of a friend!! Granted they go and flag out because of eu integration but surely that same integration should give the TC the power to inform the other country to strip the operator licence of the naughty haulier??
Mike-C:
pecjam23:
Mr B:
i won’t knock her because it’s a job that needs doing, far too many people regulary break the rules which puts additional pressure on firms who run straight. but wasn’t it beverly belle that witnessed a driver breaking the law so she set about prosecuting him with herself as the only witness, judge and jury. she does seem a bit power crazyWhat i heard of that story was she was on a day off at an MSA for what ever reason, she saw a truck driver doing something naughty
as they was driving out of the MSA they contiuned doing the naughty thing
I dont know what they were doing or wether there is any truth to this story or may be its another myth someone on here will know
Nearly there !!! The correct story is she was behind a truck tanking along at 60mph plus and asked for the companies tachos to be looked at, that then opened a whole can of worms!!
Thats good, but it’s not right. RoadtTransport from last October
How come some people on here moan about bent European and English hauliers, then moan when bent hauliers get closed down? All the TC is doing is making it fair for EVERYONE! If you don’t want to be shutdown then don’t break the law each and everyday.
Colingl:
Mike-C:
pecjam23:
Mr B:
i won’t knock her because it’s a job that needs doing, far too many people regulary break the rules which puts additional pressure on firms who run straight. but wasn’t it beverly belle that witnessed a driver breaking the law so she set about prosecuting him with herself as the only witness, judge and jury. she does seem a bit power crazyWhat i heard of that story was she was on a day off at an MSA for what ever reason, she saw a truck driver doing something naughty
I dont know what they were doing or wether there is any truth to this story or may be its another myth someone on here will know
Nearly there !!! The correct story is she was behind a truck tanking along at 60mph plus and asked for the companies tachos to be looked at, that then opened a whole can of worms!!
Thats good, but it’s not right. RoadtTransport from last October
Reading that report is that one of those cases where i think the saying is ‘absolute power corrupts absolutely’ 
“because i can” attitude
toby1234abc:
Ever noticed the poses for the photo shoot of a Traffic Commisioner in any truck magazine.Seems to be allways shots of a pen poised in hand,hands on desk,all official looking and looking like we are something the cat dragged in,like im the big boss and others are inferior to me and my Traffic powers.Thought the money for an operating licence,is funds to update computer systems data,so we actually pay for that.
Toby, what do you expect? A picture of her lounging on the beach on her holidays? Maybe she could dress up as a clown for her official photo? 
wrecktech100:
who covers northern ireland?(is that north west?)
i’m guessing it isn’t.
There are no TC’s in Northern Ireland, And there is no intention of putting any there.
limeyphil:
wrecktech100:
who covers northern ireland?(is that north west?)
i’m guessing it isn’t.There are no TC’s in Northern Ireland, And there is no intention of putting any there.
But because of this!
Both Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland have long been criticised for poor transport standards. The Freight Transport Association (FTA) told the Northern Ireland DoE last week that the three worst countries for truck safety in Europe were the Republic of Ireland, Northern Ireland and Romania.
It has led to this! doeni.gov.uk/rs_document-2.pdf
and this!
roadtransport.com/Articles/2 … unced.html
It made interesting reading.
colin.f.whitetrans:
Granted they go and flag out because of eu integration but surely that same integration should give the TC the power to inform the other country to strip the operator licence of the naughty haulier??
That’s my point. This is the reality of European integration. There isn’t such a thing as a “level playing field”.
It would be too easy to say that we play by the rules and they all cheat, but that’s not far off the mark.
Do you think the police in mainland Europe treat British hauliers in the same kid-gloves way our police deal with foreigners? I think not.
It would be too easy to say that we play by the rules and they all cheat, but that’s not far off the mark.
Whats wrong with saying it then? I have been reading this thread with from the begining and finding most of the views on it incredible. It is a fact that many of the casualties of over zealous TC’s have been international hauliers who were desperatly trying to compete with their European rivals who appear to be able to enjoy more freedom to do the job despite the fact that the laws in the EU are suposed to create a level playing field. TC’s like M’s Bell seem to take pious pride in closing down UK operators and thus helping foriegn hauliers who they have no intention of trying to police at all. (They don’t fall under our jurisdiction, sorry.)
As if the wound needed any salt rubbing into it most of the guys on here are full of congratulations for her!!!
The really incredible part is when the same guys start threads along the lines of “why is the UK haulage industry in recession”, “or where has the driver shortage gone?”
So basically what your saying Wire is that the TC’s should just turn a blind eye to hauliers who are persistently pushing the boundaries to the limits, you know what I mean when I say give them a foot and they’ll take a yard.
Sorry but it’s a sad fact that the haulage industry in the UK is in dire straights, simply because of the fact that everyone is prepared to ■■■■■ the rates to get the work even if it means cutting back on safety to do it, does the UK really need hauliers like that?
Its not the TC’s fault that johnny foreigner can fuel up cheaper outside the UK and undercut British Hauliers, it’s not the TC’s fault that Johnny Foreigner does not have to pay vehicle excise duty when using the UK’s roads, is it?
There’s no such thing as a level playing field in the UK’s transport industry because the government are happy to allow foreigners free entry into the UK transport sector.
However, If your paid to do a job and show your doing it with results, you will do it instead of turning a blind eye, it’s like a traffic warden going out for a full days work and coming back without issuing 1 ticket because they decided to turn a blind eye to the illegally parked vehicles, how long would they last in that job?.
The UK Hauliers know full well the responsibilities they have to take on when being granted an O licence, if they decide at a later date that they are not prepared to stick to that agreement then they should be out of business, it’s their choice to allow the drivers to run bent, it’s their choice to ignore warnings and therefore it’s their choice to let the TC’s close them down.
No defence for any of the TC’s is needed, the operator is where the buck stops
So basically what your saying Wire is that the TC’s should just turn a blind eye to hauliers who are persistently pushing the boundaries to the limits, you know what I mean when I say give them a foot and they’ll take a yard.
Well they effectively turn a blind eye to foriegners who persistently push the boundaries to the limits and take a foot when their given a yard.
Sorry but it’s a sad fact that the haulage industry in the UK is in dire straights, simply because of the fact that everyone is prepared to ■■■■■ the rates to get the work even if it means cutting back on safety to do it, does the UK really need hauliers like that
You are dead right about the UK haulage industry being in dire straights. The UK international haulage industry has almost disapeared all together! At the same time the East European haulage industry is stronger than ever. I apreciate that there a lot of political reasons for that but at the same time it is difficult to imagine the likes of Dutch or Irish hauliers backing their own enforcement agencies at the expense of each other.
wire:
So basically what your saying Wire is that the TC’s should just turn a blind eye to hauliers who are persistently pushing the boundaries to the limits, you know what I mean when I say give them a foot and they’ll take a yard.
Well they effectively turn a blind eye to foriegners who persistently push the boundaries to the limits and take a foot when their given a yard.
You might be getting confused here. TC’s don’t have a blind eye to turn to ‘foreigners’ as the TC’s have no control or authority over them.
If you mean ‘the authorities’ i.e. VOSA are turning a blind eye to ‘foreigners’ well that is definately not the case, infact its the complete opposite. Although they are not allowed to say they are targetting foreign vehicles, the term they have to use is they are targetting vehicles on International journeys 
You might be getting confused here. TC’s don’t have a blind eye to turn to ‘foreigners’ as the TC’s have no control or authority over them
Thats my point exactly.
They would rather see a British operator shut down for minor infringments even if it means someone doing the work who they have absolutely no authority over. Thats supposed to have improved the situation? Good job Britain!!!
If you mean ‘the authorities’ i.e. VOSA are turning a blind eye to ‘foreigners’ well that is definately not the case, infact its the complete opposite. Although they are not allowed to say they are targetting foreign vehicles, the term they have to use is they are targetting vehicles on International journeys
VOSA only have the power to prosecute for vehicle defects and look at recent driving history. They can in no way get involved in how a foreign truck is operated.
wire:
Thats my point exactly.
They would rather see a British operator shut down for minor infringments even if it means someone doing the work who they have absolutely no authority over. Thats supposed to have improved the situation? Good job Britain!!!
Wire, whilst I enjoy your posts on the EX-PATS forum, I think you’ve been “living the dream” too long out there, cause’ you seem to have lost touch with some of the realities of the UK haulage industry.
TC’s don’t shut down british operators “for minor infringements”!
Mike-C:
If you mean ‘the authorities’ i.e. VOSA are turning a blind eye to ‘foreigners’ well that is definately not the case, infact its the complete opposite. Although they are not allowed to say they are targetting foreign vehicles, the term they have to use is they are targetting vehicles on International journeys:D"
I totally agree, it’s the way they get out of the ludicrous politically correct straightjacket they’re in.
I’v seen first hand how VOSA operate, and they will get involved with a foreign haulier who’s overloaded, has a defective vehicle or where the driver is overdue a break.
The real issue here is that they are understaffed and the TC’s have no power over foreign hauliers. That’s why it looks like the authorities take a piecemeal approach to enforcement.
wire:
most of the guys on here are full of congratulations for her!!!
Canteen gossip is always going to be biased against the authorities wire, so it’s kind of refreshing to hear drivers actually recognising the situation and not condoning the actions of the cowboys who are driving our industry down.
I think many people are confused between the link of VOSA and the area TC.
VOSA do the roadside enforcement, run the testing stations and operate the UK goods vehicle and passenger transport licensing system.
The TC will only be seen or heard from in cases of licensing dispute or when you are due to have the back of your legs slapped.
Most international operators will have had almost daily contact with IRFO to apply for permits etc, but since the EU enlargement there are a lot fewer permits required. The dodgy operators could be easily filtered out through refusing or limiting permits.
So the UK can only licence their own operators, like the Germans, the French, the Austrians and even the Poles.
I have seen the efforts VOSA and the BAG etc put into enforcement and it isn’t just aimed at their own countrymen. They target all trucks and drivers who are not playing by the rules. The TC can call before them any UK licensed operator or even a driver in the case of fiddling, speeding, using mobile phones and drink driving.
VOSA will, and do contact their counterparts abroad when they come across Fritz, Pierre or Thomasz breaking the rules.
Maybe Orys will explain which department does what here. mi.gov.pl/
The reason that you haven’t got a level playing field isn’t down to the traffic commissioners picking on legal operators but down to you, when you put your thumb print in the ballot box for President Blair.
Wheel Nut:
limeyphil:
wrecktech100:
who covers northern ireland?(is that north west?)
i’m guessing it isn’t.There are no TC’s in Northern Ireland, And there is no intention of putting any there.
But because of this!
Both Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland have long been criticised for poor transport standards. The Freight Transport Association (FTA) told the Northern Ireland DoE last week that the three worst countries for truck safety in Europe were the Republic of Ireland, Northern Ireland and Romania.
It has led to this! doeni.gov.uk/rs_document-2.pdf
and this!
What it also leads to is this:
roadtransport.com/Articles/2 … ation.html
roadtransport.com/Articles/2 … cence.htmlThat’s the same Tinnelly Transport which has been granted a six-month O-licence this week. At least with the TC system, for all its faults, there is some element of regulatory oversight and a reasonably transparent system (if you take VOSA out of the equation for a moment - grrrr). But Northern Ireland? Decisions are taken without any reasons being made public. How can you possibly judge if the decision is right or wrong? It also means that the likes of Tinnelly don’t get the scruting their operation seemingly merits.
Dom Perry
Motor Transportroadtransport.com/Articles/2 … unced.html
It made interesting reading.
Dom Perry:
What it also leads to is this:
roadtransport.com/Articles/2 … ation.html
roadtransport.com/Articles/2 … cence.htmlThat’s the same Tinnelly Transport which has been granted a six-month O-licence this week. At least with the TC system, for all its faults, there is some element of regulatory oversight and a reasonably transparent system (if you take VOSA out of the equation for a moment - grrrr). But Northern Ireland? Decisions are taken without any reasons being made public. How can you possibly judge if the decision is right or wrong? It also means that the likes of Tinnelly don’t get the scruting their operation seemingly merits.
You should do a write up on TNT Dom. They managed to crush the minimum wage for German postal workers,rip off the HMRC to a tune of about £50 million and then get caught and admit to illegal acts,lost computer discs and still got a contract off the HMRC !! They make Tinnelys and Thorburns look like amateurs !!!