OK, I have used a tacho before ,but seeing as it was rare for me to even be at work for more than 4 1/2 hours a day at the time , I just set it to the cross hammers and left it at that.
Now, when I start a new driving job I dont think I will be that lucky.
Hypothetical day here, dont know if this is a typical day or not so bear with me.
Start work at 6am ,mess about for 1/2 hour finding vehicle ,checking it over
6.30 Get in lorry ready to leave depot ,put tacho in(crossed hammers).
Drive for an hour ,end up at Blackwall Tunnel, theres been an accident and I am stationary for 30 minutes (just to make it easier)
Now its 8 am when I start moving, drive for 2 hours, then decide I need a break ,so stop for 30 min.
Drive for one more hour.Do I need to take the other 15 minute break? Or does the 30 minutes stuck at the Blackwall Tunnel count as other work?
Hypothetical situation 2
Driven for 4 hours , arrived at destination , been loaded or unloaded . My route out will put me onto the motorway within 5 minutes ,its rush hour , motorway may be busy ,nearest services 20 miles away. Do I just stop before getting onto motorway and take my break, so I can then drive for another 4 1/2 hours? What if I go for it ,and the motorway is jammed solid and Im there for 3/4 of an hour,before I can pull over?
And how do you calculate driving time? use a stop watch?
SalTheWop:
Hypothetical day here, dont know if this is a typical day or not so bear with me.
Start work at 6am ,mess about for 1/2 hour finding vehicle ,checking it over
6.30 Get in lorry ready to leave depot ,put tacho in(crossed hammers).
Drive for an hour ,end up at Blackwall Tunnel, theres been an accident and I am stationary for 30 minutes (just to make it easier)
Now its 8 am when I start moving, drive for 2 hours, then decide I need a break ,so stop for 30 min.
Drive for one more hour.Do I need to take the other 15 minute break? Or does the 30 minutes stuck at the Blackwall Tunnel count as other work?
The time spent in the traffic jam is not break so you will need the other 15 minutes. The 30 minutes at the tunnel is driving time, unless you have been sitting there with the engine off and not moving at all when you could say it was Other Work. Trying to claim it as break would be stretching the point, although if the truck doesnât move it would be hard to prove later that it wasnât a break. I have claimed break when stuck in traffic though. In Germany once, a truck went over a couple of hundred metres in front of me and completely blocked the 2 lane Autobahn. It was 04:00 and the police came along the line of traffic telling us we wouldnât be moving for around 3 hours so we should go to sleep if we wanted to, I did and as far as I was concerned that was a break. Yes, they did come along waking us up when it was time to move.
SalTheWop:
Hypothetical situation 2
Driven for 4 hours , arrived at destination , been loaded or unloaded . My route out will put me onto the motorway within 5 minutes ,its rush hour , motorway may be busy ,nearest services 20 miles away. Do I just stop before getting onto motorway and take my break, so I can then drive for another 4 1/2 hours? What if I go for it ,and the motorway is jammed solid and Im there for 3/4 of an hour,before I can pull over?
If you know that because of the time of day you are more than likely to be delayed in getting to the services you should take your break before getting on the motorway. There is an allowance in the regulations where you can exceed the driving time to reach a parking place when you are delayed due to unforeseen circumstances, an accident for example. The fact the motorway is busy because it is the rush hour isnât unforeseen. If you are not doing the loading or unloading and are in the cab, or canteen, you can use that as break time.
SalTheWop:
And how do you calculate driving time? use a stop watch?
Scraps of paper, stop watch, big kitchen timer, Daveyâs Hours Guard are all popular methods. It is harder on multi drop than on distance work to keep track of your times, so it can depend on your type of work as to the method you choose to use.
Start work at 6am ,mess about for 1/2 hour finding vehicle ,checking it over
6.30 Get in lorry ready to leave depot ,put tacho in(crossed hammers).
You need to put tacho in straight away! Checking vehicle is âother workâ and will look suspect if you are stopped and there is none - authorities will wonder if you did your checks.
Do I need to take the other 15 minute break? Or does the 30 minutes stuck at the Blackwall Tunnel count as other work?
You still need to take the rest of your break, you were not resting stuck in the traffic, and other work is not resting either.
Driven for 4 hours , arrived at destination , been loaded or unloaded . My route out will put me onto the motorway within 5 minutes ,its rush hour , motorway may be busy ,nearest services 20 miles away. Do I just stop before getting onto motorway and take my break, so I can then drive for another 4 1/2 hours? What if I go for it ,and the motorway is jammed solid and Im there for 3/4 of an hour,before I can pull over?
Better to have taken your break first, then yes, your driving time starts again. If you get caught out and there really is absolutely no way you can pull up within time, stop asap and make a note of reason on back of tacho.
Use a kitchen timer if youâve got one, otherwise make a note of the time.
So the 30 minutes stuck at the tunnel, I dont move.Switch engine off.Would I be expected to claim that as rest by the company I am working for? Even though Iâm not really resting am I? It could 30 min or it could be 10 min, I may not know in advance?
Am I wrong in expecting a rest period to be my own time when I can do what I want? Go get something to eat etc?
As I understand it ,firms do not pay for breaks? So why would I want to claim it as a break?
If ,on the other hand, I claim it as âother workâ ,then I still get my rest period when I am free to do what I want AND it means that I can be behind the wheel for 5 hours before needing to take ALL my rest, because the 30 mins is âother workâ?
Would I be expected to claim that as rest by the company I am working for?
No - since there is nothing else you can do but stay with the wagon so it isnât BREAK (as opposed to rest). If it looks like I will be stuck for a good while I would put it on POA, of course strictly speaking you would need to know that you were going to be stuck for half an hour to do that !!!
Am I wrong in expecting a rest period to be my own time when I can do what I want? Go get something to eat etc?
To qualify as BREAK (rest is what you do at the end of the day - unless you have split rest) you need to be free to do what you want.
You need to hold on to them for the current week +15 days anyway - normally I would return them to the agency in your case, although I would ask the client if they want to take a copy of them first. If you are with a client long term then I return them back to the client direct, but tell the agency !!
Also I take a scan of any that I am going to post back in case the mail manage to lose / damage them/
You have to have the current tachos and those
used during the previous 15 days with you. Then
you give them to the agency who check them then
give them to the client. The company you do the
work for sometimes take a photocopy but you keep
the tachos. A good idea also is to make a copy of the
tachos for yourself I scan them or photocopy them.
Work day starts at 6am
Manually record the 15 min âother workâ until
6.15am Find lorry,insert tacho , do my daily checks
6.30am I start driving.
7.45am 15 min break
8.00am Drive for 2 hrs
10.00 am Reach destination, âother workâ for 15 minutes while finding out how long till Im unloaded.
10.15 POA for 1 hour
11.15 Other work ,whilst unloading
12.45pm Driving
1.15pm Break for 15 min (WTD)
1.30pm Drive
2.15pm Break
2.30 New 4/12 driving period starts
Also ,whilst in a customers yard,you are driving round looking for your bay. Are you âdrivingâ? or is it other work,as it is private property.
Work day starts at 6am
Manually record the 15 min âother workâ until
6.15am Find lorry,insert tacho , do my daily checks
6.30am I start driving.
7.45am 15 min break
8.00am Drive for 2 hrs
10.00 am Reach destination, âother workâ for 15 minutes while finding out how long till Im unloaded.
10.15 POA for 1 hour
11.15 Other work ,whilst unloading
12.45pm Driving
1.15pm Break for 15 min (WTD)
1.30pm Drive
2.15pm Break
2.30 New 4/12 driving period starts
Your new 4.5 hr drive started at 1115 not 1430. Whenever you complete 45 minutes of break (rest or POA) you start a fresh 4.5 hr drive.
Also ,whilst in a customers yard,you are driving round looking for your bay. Are you âdrivingâ? or is it other work,as it is private property.
If youâre driving or sat at the wheel with the engine running (but not parked up) then both of those come under the âdrivingâ header. It doesnât matter whether youâre on public or private land, youâre still driving. A bunch of drivers thought theyâd try the âitâs private land, it doesnât countâ gag when driving around Felixstowe docks and VOSA nailed them.
Cheers Rob .I know it must sound kind of pathetic, all these questions , I just dont want to end up losing my licence after only just getting it
WRT breaks though, I understand that a lot of companies do not pay you whilst on break . If I am taking more breaks than say an hour,would most companies just look at this as keeping you legal and so pay you for it.I obviously want to stay legal,but I want to be paid for my time.
SalTheWop:
Cheers Rob .I know it must sound kind of pathetic, all these questions , I just dont want to end up losing my licence after only just getting it
WRT breaks though, I understand that a lot of companies do not pay you whilst on break . If I am taking more breaks than say an hour,would most companies just look at this as keeping you legal and so pay you for it.I obviously want to stay legal,but I want to be paid for my time.
Well with regards to breaks Iâm not the one to ask because Iâm basically an agency driver and agency driver law dictates that the driver should always take 3 times as many breaks as you get deducted!
If youâre working for a company full time then whatever they deduct for breaks, you take. Itâs unlikely youâd be stopped completely stationary for more than 5 minutes without moving an inch whilst out on the roads, so there should never be an issue where theyâd question it. As long as you donât take the [zb] I canât see there being a problem. Just tell them you were waiting to load/unload/get paperwork/whatever, even if you forget to put it on other work.
Your new 4.5 hr drive started at 1115 not 1430. Whenever you complete 45 minutes of break (rest or POA) you start a fresh 4.5 hr drive.
Missed that one when I read the WTD regs - so would you need your tacho to be on break for that ? Or would VOSA take a 45 minute of POA as reseting your driving time (or presumably a mixture of break and POA?) ?
Your new 4.5 hr drive started at 1115 not 1430. Whenever you complete 45 minutes of break (rest or POA) you start a fresh 4.5 hr drive.
Missed that one when I read the WTD regs - so would you need your tacho to be on break for that ? Or would VOSA take a 45 minute of POA as reseting your driving time (or presumably a mixture of break and POA?) ?
G
Well I guess depends on which [zb] for a VOSA bod you get. Perhaps Iâm not the best one to answer as I donât use the box mode. As far as Iâm concerned POA doesnât exist and was simply introduced for those that want to 300hrs work per week and those that only want to do 40hrs work per week.
My take on it is that youâre either working or youâre not. Work = hammers, break = bed. A period of availability is just some meaningless phrase. If youâre available for work then that means you can leave your wagon and go for a wonder round the shops if you want, therefore this is a break. You cannot do this at a Tesco RDC whilst youâre waiting to get on a bay or youâre on a bay waiting to be tipped, therefore this is working. A âPOAâ can only be one or other although everyone else will tell you otherwise.
Rob K:
Your new 4.5 hr drive started at 1115 not 1430. Whenever you complete 45 minutes of break (rest or POA) you start a fresh 4.5 hr drive.
Dont think that quite right is it?? the tacho head will need to show a trace of a total of 45 mins REST to reset your driving period.
Yes youâre right Rich. I should have known better than to give out wrong/misleading info , itâs just that I donât agree with this POA boIIox. Youâre either working or youâre not. Thereâs no in between.
Rob K:
Yes youâre right Rich. I should have known better than to give out wrong/misleading info , itâs just that I donât agree with this POA boIIox. Youâre either working or youâre not. Thereâs no in between.
You might want to use PoA if your employer looks at the tacho and starts whinging about how much break youâre takingâŚ
, I just set it to the cross hammers and left it at that.
