OVLOV JAY:
George Osborne is on lbc right now saying they have no plans for brexit. What a responsible government we have in power
He hasn’t had much of a plan for the last six years anyway.
Realistic answer is if the vote goes leaves way he won’t be in his job much longer so it’s not his problem I guess
kr79:
OVLOV JAY:
George Osborne is on lbc right now saying they have no plans for brexit. What a responsible government we have in powerHe hasn’t had much of a plan for the last six years anyway.
Realistic answer is if the vote goes leaves way he won’t be in his job much longer so it’s not his problem I guess
My thoughts on it too mate, but he doesn’t need to worry now. Between the misguided youth votes, scared of Armageddon fence sitters and now the sympathy voters doing it for Jo Cox, they’ve whipped up enough support for remain. I just hope both Cameron and Osborn do the decent thing and go either way. All they’ve done is bully and scare people for votes, while talking down the uk and its economy. We knew the campaign would be biased due to its funding and supporters, but it’s been totally reprehensible. Cameron has hoodwinked the country yet again. The man isn’t fit enough to lead a Salvation Army band
George Osbourne MUST say he “has no plans”. The whole idea of his threats is that “I will make it happen if we do Brexit”
He’s promising to dither. He’s telling us he’ll do nothing to smooth the passage into independence. He faithlessly agrees to drag his feet to make things as bad for us as possible.
Which of course is why with a large enough Brexit mandate (I suggest 2:1 majority over Remain) - He’s toast by dinner time Friday.
The pair of clowns will try to resist resignation - but the rest of the party would have them gone without having to have a snap general election if possible. And will happy 1922 committee them out the door - if need be as well. 
Just annoys me that people have been fooled by the whole campaign. But when people have a mindset that anyone who opposes an open door immigration policy is a xenophobic racist, there aren’t many cells to overpower 
Carryfast:
Munchkin:
How about an answer to justice the simple question Nation v Federation which do you support.Bearing in mind neutral is a bs non option.Are you rewriting the referendum question then or just your usual totalitarian view of agree with me or be damned?
If it came to that I think damned would be a blessed relief !!!Funny how the World’s most successful economy so far is a federation don’t you think? Must work a bit OK!
I assume you mean this ‘Federation’.
thetnm.org/a_word_on_the_uk_ … from_texas
But great you’re just about the first Federalist here who’s been prepared to admit you’re one and that obviously wants to sign your country away to Juncker’s zb pile on Thursday.
Oh CF, I despair, really I do!
Linking to a right wing agenda within a right wing state really gives us a balanced view does it ?
Anyway I did not say I’m a federalist just merely pointed out that the US is and have been successful as such.
OVLOV JAY:
Just annoys me that people have been fooled by the whole campaign. But when people have a mindset that anyone who opposes an open door immigration policy is a xenophobic racist, there aren’t many cells to overpower
THIS!
Its even been on the tv to prove its happening.
Mr romainian comes an dosses in uk for a few months signs on doll. Goes home brings mrs an 5 kids turns up at council asking for house gets put in hostel overnight. The romainian embassy say what are you doing theres no houses you shouldnt be doing it. Goes back to council turns out being on jsa counts as working so they get 5 bedroom house within 2 weeks. Few months later he still not working.
How is that right, can one if the 72 who want to stay explain it and why does it make me a racist for not wanting my hard earned cash to fund it. When most of my generation struggle to get housed or afford to rent or buy.
Oh and to add to it they even turned up with the school transfers allready signed from the romainian school. Talk about taking the ■■■■.
Just annoys me that people have been fooled by the whole campaign. Brexit just seem to bang on about immigration as it seems they have nothing else to scare people with. As a country we need immigration, we are getting older, having less kids and need a supply of younger immigrants to pay the taxes and therefore our pensions should we live that long.
Ask yourselves why immigrants come here. The same reason they go to New York, L.A., Singapore, because the economy is successful and vibrant. Without people coming into the workforce bringing fresh energy and fresh ideas the economy would stagnate. Look forward 20-30 years and see how many of todays immigrants will have built successful careers and businesses, they’re not coming here to doss around and do nothing, they could do that at home!
As for the spurious argument that the unemployed could do a lot of unskilled work, veg picking, packing etc. The whole reason the foreign labour started to be used was that native workers stopped wanting to do those jobs, NOT the other way around. You’ve no chance of getting anyone off unemployment into veg picking for min wage, end of! You also can’t pay them more to do it as that would make the product uncompetitive and you’d have no business.
This is not 40 years ago this is now and that’s the reality of the world.
Munchkin:
Just annoys me that people have been fooled by the whole campaign. Brexit just seem to bang on about immigration as it seems they have nothing else to scare people with.
Exactly they dont need to scare people the truth is there for all to see. Unlike the remain camp were the whole motto seams to be scaremongering.
Please tell how the que of people the other side of the channel will help are economy. Whose going to house them, what schools have loads of spaces an what healthcare facilitys.
Winseer:
Herbert1561:
If we leave the EU, truck drivers’ wages will be lower, not higher. It’s complicated how this works (it isn’t as simple as Nigel Farage’s “this then that” logic), but it is the truth. Wages will be lower, not higher. There will be fewer jobs for British people, not more.Don’t listen to the Sun and other Murdoch newspapers. Rupert Murdoch wants us to leave, and he and other members of the plutocracy are engaging in a (very successful) effort to convince poor people that this is good for them. It is not unlike their efforts with the Tea Party in the US, where they convinced the working classes that a low-tax-low-spend economic model was somehow in their best interests.
Seriously. Listen to the trade unions. This will be very bad for us, and for our children, and for our grandchildren. This cannot be undone in 5 years if we make a mistake. This is permanent.
Why are the trade Unions right about this, when they were wrong about the coal mines, wrong in 1979, and wrong allowing any reforms over the years for examples?
Wages can only be lower if there are a glut of MORE people chasing FEWER jobs. Brexit will surely stop any more newcomers straight away, and eventually discourage those already here to go home again - at least under a more right-shifting Tory government post-Brexit. Eg. “Cut benefits for all immigrants” which we cannot do at present, as it’s against EU law.
Jobs disappear? - I don’t work for Brussels. I cart food about for a firm that’s ultimately owned by an american multinational. People will still eat after Brexit, and belts won’t get tightened unless jobs go. Jobs won’t go unless belts get tightened… Get it? It takes a lot more than you might think to break the economic cycle - especially in the relatively “Recession Proof” industries…There will be less foreign trucks coming here with their produce as well -unless the EU give us a palatable deal to be going on with. If they DON’T, then they’d be cutting off their OWN trade profit, whilst we can send merchant shipping anywhere in the world that’s got produce and a port - and make “alternative arrangements”. That’s LESS FOREIGN TRUCKS rather than “less of ours” on the roads.
Is there anyone on here who’s British, drives only within the UK, and their job is ONLY fetching imported stuff from ports, and then delivering it around the UK? - There will be a lot more jobs like this - I suggest.
If Johnny Foreigner isn’t bringing it in by ferry any more - it comes in by ship, and WE go and get it!Wages will be higher - and that might stoke inflation. THAT is the “risk” here.
The demand won’t go down - because we won’t suddenly be losing all those millions already here overnight…
Financial markets will have a dip, and then a bounce - as is usual in these “upheaval” situations.I suggest that Brexit will be non more of an upheaval than it was in 1997 when we finally decided at that time to “chuck the Tories, and take a chance on New Labour”…
Winseer, what you are proposing consists of your own economic theory.
It is possible that you are correct.
But wouldn’t you want to be more sure about it? Wouldn’t you want to check to see if the majority of economists agree with your theory? Or if other independent outsiders (people from other countries like the US, Japan etc, not in the EU) agree?
If you honestly look into it, you will see that they don’t agree with you. In fact, there is NEAR UNANIMOUS agreement among economists regarding what will happen to the economy, and to wages, in Britain when we leave. There are a couple of lone voices disagreeing with them, just like there are with the climate change debate. It is always possible to find the occasional lone voice disagreeing with anything (there are even scientists who firmly believe that the world was created in 6 days). You can find the odd economist who says that Britain will be better off outside the EU. But ALMOST ALL of them say the opposite. It is the closest thing to a complete consensus on a topic that has ever existed in economics.
Here are just two examples of polls of HUNDREDS of leading economists: ft.com/cms/s/2/1a86ab36-afbe … z4BgW4QgVp.
Given all of this, will you change your mind, or will you continue to believe that your economic theory is correct and that all of the experts are wrong?
In order for an economy to prosper it has to develop infrastructure as it expands obviously. In this area the government have been ■■■■ poor for a long time. They tell us how good the economy is doing but don’t invest in bricks and mortar.
This is a UK government issue, the same government we’d have if we Brexit.
The vote is EU in or out.
The vote on the ■■■■ poor government was last year remember?
Sent from my X17 using Tapatalk
Put another way;
If you go on hols and the hotel hasn’t enough sunbeds.
Do you blame the hotel?
Or yourself as if you weren’t there, there would be enough sunbeds?
Sent from my X17 using Tapatalk
Can’t anybody see the coincidences, right back to Heaths time? Every government as ■■■■ poor as the one before, with the status quo remaining with every general election. Chipping away at the working man, the very footsoldiers that keep them there. It’s all down to the eu, which doesn’t allow change.
The so called experts are the ones who stand to lose out, not the working man. It’s not shutting the door to Europe, it’s opening the door to the world. Something the establishment don’t want, as there’s no sweetners.
We can revert to the wto, meaning no trade agreement required with the eu. Small nations don’t need one anyway. We can replace any lost exports by immediately becoming more competitive to foreign markets, ie free trade deals for the commonwealth and emerging markets, which already receive the bulk of our exports.
The worse it will likely be to us in the street, is a 5% tariff on imports, which means a 5% hike on a quarter of our weekly shops (unless you shop at lidl or aldi which will result in the hike on 75%). The 100000 lost jobs in the city, why? We will still clear the usd, ausd, sufc, yen and many others, so why not the euro? We’re not in the euro anyway, so it will make little difference.
A vote for remain is a vote for status quo, quite literally like the band, was tolerable at first but no good anymore. We need a vote for brexit, a chance for hope. A chance to give our government a platform of self governance and accountability. Only then can we have true democracy.
Yes we need immigrants, but not all. We need to cherry pick; Carers, doctors, teachers etc.
What we don’t want are the sort who litter our high streets, playing awful accordion music, begging and selling the Big Issue. We also don’t need half the truck drivers over here, all they do is prop up the worst companies ensuring these firms never need to mend their ways. Ever noticed that the crappest jobs advertised will ask for someone with “an understanding of English”?
Just been on the news that David Beckham has decided to vote remain. Quite why the ramblings of a man who’s IQ begins with a decimal point deserve to be aired on mainstream news is beyond me!
He did say that he wants to stay “cos there’s some really good foreign footballers” however. Bless him
the maoster:
He did say that he wants to stay “cos there’s some really good foreign footballers” however. Bless him
Yet the bellend would quite probably say next week that we need to focus more on home grown talent if we ever want to win a major championship. In fact, i’m fairly sure he has in the past! 
Herbert1561:
Winseer:
Herbert1561:
If we leave the EU, truck drivers’ wages will be lower, not higher. It’s complicated how this works (it isn’t as simple as Nigel Farage’s “this then that” logic), but it is the truth. Wages will be lower, not higher. There will be fewer jobs for British people, not more.Don’t listen to the Sun and other Murdoch newspapers. Rupert Murdoch wants us to leave, and he and other members of the plutocracy are engaging in a (very successful) effort to convince poor people that this is good for them. It is not unlike their efforts with the Tea Party in the US, where they convinced the working classes that a low-tax-low-spend economic model was somehow in their best interests.
Seriously. Listen to the trade unions. This will be very bad for us, and for our children, and for our grandchildren. This cannot be undone in 5 years if we make a mistake. This is permanent.
Why are the trade Unions right about this, when they were wrong about the coal mines, wrong in 1979, and wrong allowing any reforms over the years for examples?
Wages can only be lower if there are a glut of MORE people chasing FEWER jobs. Brexit will surely stop any more newcomers straight away, and eventually discourage those already here to go home again - at least under a more right-shifting Tory government post-Brexit. Eg. “Cut benefits for all immigrants” which we cannot do at present, as it’s against EU law.
Jobs disappear? - I don’t work for Brussels. I cart food about for a firm that’s ultimately owned by an american multinational. People will still eat after Brexit, and belts won’t get tightened unless jobs go. Jobs won’t go unless belts get tightened… Get it? It takes a lot more than you might think to break the economic cycle - especially in the relatively “Recession Proof” industries…There will be less foreign trucks coming here with their produce as well -unless the EU give us a palatable deal to be going on with. If they DON’T, then they’d be cutting off their OWN trade profit, whilst we can send merchant shipping anywhere in the world that’s got produce and a port - and make “alternative arrangements”. That’s LESS FOREIGN TRUCKS rather than “less of ours” on the roads.
Is there anyone on here who’s British, drives only within the UK, and their job is ONLY fetching imported stuff from ports, and then delivering it around the UK? - There will be a lot more jobs like this - I suggest.
If Johnny Foreigner isn’t bringing it in by ferry any more - it comes in by ship, and WE go and get it!Wages will be higher - and that might stoke inflation. THAT is the “risk” here.
The demand won’t go down - because we won’t suddenly be losing all those millions already here overnight…
Financial markets will have a dip, and then a bounce - as is usual in these “upheaval” situations.I suggest that Brexit will be non more of an upheaval than it was in 1997 when we finally decided at that time to “chuck the Tories, and take a chance on New Labour”…
Winseer, what you are proposing consists of your own economic theory.
It is possible that you are correct.
But wouldn’t you want to be more sure about it? Wouldn’t you want to check to see if the majority of economists agree with your theory? Or if other independent outsiders (people from other countries like the US, Japan etc, not in the EU) agree?
If you honestly look into it, you will see that they don’t agree with you. In fact, there is NEAR UNANIMOUS agreement among economists regarding what will happen to the economy, and to wages, in Britain when we leave. There are a couple of lone voices disagreeing with them, just like there are with the climate change debate. It is always possible to find the occasional lone voice disagreeing with anything (there are even scientists who firmly believe that the world was created in 6 days). You can find the odd economist who says that Britain will be better off outside the EU. But ALMOST ALL of them say the opposite. It is the closest thing to a complete consensus on a topic that has ever existed in economics.
Here are just two examples of polls of HUNDREDS of leading economists: ft.com/cms/s/2/1a86ab36-afbe … z4BgW4QgVp.
Given all of this, will you change your mind, or will you continue to believe that your economic theory is correct and that all of the experts are wrong?
When it comes to “successfully predicting the financial markets” there are “those that can - do” and “those that can’t - become analysts”.
I’m somewhere in between. No official qualifications in anything “economic”, but some years of experience of trading many of the different markets, officially designating me as “intermediate” investor.
Anyone who thinks they KNOW what will happen overnight Thursday - will be betting substantial amounts of money upon “that view”.
Among trading circles it’s said that “Nothing gives you a right to your opinion quite like putting your money where your mouth is.”
or…
“If you don’t back your own judgement - you don’t really believe it yourself, and can therefore be reliably ignored”.
OF all those so-called “Economic experts” then - filter off those who “don’t have any of their own money riding upon the referendum outcome” - and those that are left? - Let’s watch what they do.
I’ve reason to believe for example, that George Soros has BOUGHT a large sterling position in the market. He’ll lose heavily if we now do Brexit - assuming of course that Brexit will make the market FALL as the “experts” predict!
The Bank of England has a massive long position in Euros - the ECB have been ordering them to “prop up the Eurocurrency” for years now. If we saw a devaluation of the pound, the Bank of England would be able to re-patriate those Euros at a MUCH improved exchange rate, which would soften the blow of Brexit - assuming again that “Sterling falls upon Brexit”.
My instincts tell me that whilst the financial markets will be very volatile - they’ll eventually settle down imo at a level not far away from current prices.
This applies to Sterling, FTSE, and the bond markets. All three of the important ones then. I don’t think anyone gives a toss about what happens to Coffee, Sugar & Cocoa somehow.
I’ve got money riding on “Turnout being over 80%” which as long as the ballot is free and fair - it should easily do. I’ve also got money at huge odds on “Remain get less than 40% of the poll” (40-1)
If Brexit manage to win - it will HAVE to be by a 60/40 margin or better I am thinking - and if Brexit gets over the 60% line easily - then I’m quids in on the bet on the converse as I have done it.
I predict that the markets will start making sharp moves for each minute that goes past midnight thereabouts - and there is no apparent “leading pattern” in the results that have come in by that point.
If it becomes evident early on that it is very “one sided” - then the markets will rally. If they keep running neck and neck until 5am… There will be HUGE swings on the overnight markets, which being electronic - are subject to flash crashes as well!
Here’s a couple of links if you fancy watching these markets yourself…
IG index is actually market prices turned into betting odds - IG make their own price about the futures price during trading hours, and by themselves out of hours. You can buy the FTSE on this market when the FTSE itself is closed for example.
The Russian site is a bootleg of actual live prices of many different markets - live and totally free.
Currencies and the American markets trade up until 10pm at night, close for one hour - then re-open at 23:00 hours.
Trading wise - buy low and sell high. If the price has already gone sky high, and you were looking to buy - don’t! - Look for the next upward spike to get SHORT this market. Traders don’t predict the long term direction - that’s for fund managers to do. They are only trying to find the high and low of today’s range, and trade within those boundaries. “Outside Days” present the opportunity to make the best profits - BUT also work against you if you get the market wrong. Traders also tend to “get in on the Rumour, get out when it’s confirmed as fact”.
Munchkin:
Carryfast:
Munchkin:
How about an answer to justice the simple question Nation v Federation which do you support.Bearing in mind neutral is a bs non option.Are you rewriting the referendum question then or just your usual totalitarian view of agree with me or be damned?
If it came to that I think damned would be a blessed relief !!!Funny how the World’s most successful economy so far is a federation don’t you think? Must work a bit OK!
I assume you mean this ‘Federation’.
thetnm.org/a_word_on_the_uk_ … from_texas
But great you’re just about the first Federalist here who’s been prepared to admit you’re one and that obviously wants to sign your country away to Juncker’s zb pile on Thursday.
Oh CF, I despair, really I do!
Linking to a right wing agenda within a right wing state really gives us a balanced view does it ?Anyway I did not say I’m a federalist just merely pointed out that the US is and have been successful as such.
For someone who’s supposedly not a Federalist you’re doing a good enough job of promoting the federalist cause over nation and throwing your own country away in the process.As for right wing you’d first need to define your view of left.Let me guess left can only mean no borders anti nation state Socialism in your view with the Socialists as usual thinking that only they have the monopoly on what’s good for the working class.
As for the US being ‘successful’ obviously the case and the figures,put up there relating to the economic and political reasons for Texas to secede,had to be conveniently ignored in your Socialist so called ‘left’ wing crusade.But since when did Socialists ever give a zb about debt just so long as other people’s money is used to pay for it let alone tell the truth about their real agenda.
As for ‘right wing state’ you do know that 50 states have petitions filed by their electorates for secession.In which case the definition of ‘United’ in this case means unanimity among the people not a majority vote in favour of Federal government.While obviously inconveniently for your bs ideology but not suprisingly you haven’t got it.Probably because US voters are bright enough to realise that Socialism and its spin off of Federalism,just as in the case of the Soviet Union,isn’t actually good for the working class at all.Depending on your definition of Left.
Munchkin:
Put another way;
If you go on hols and the hotel hasn’t enough sunbeds.
Do you blame the hotel?
Or yourself as if you weren’t there, there would be enough sunbeds?
How does any of that bs fit the choice between Federation v Nation.
Munchkin:
Just annoys me that people have been fooled by the whole campaign. Brexit just seem to bang on about immigration as it seems they have nothing else to scare people with. As a country we need immigration, we are getting older, having less kids and need a supply of younger immigrants to pay the taxes and therefore our pensions should we live that long.
Ask yourselves why immigrants come here. The same reason they go to New York, L.A., Singapore, because the economy is successful and vibrant. Without people coming into the workforce bringing fresh energy and fresh ideas the economy would stagnate. Look forward 20-30 years and see how many of todays immigrants will have built successful careers and businesses, they’re not coming here to doss around and do nothing, they could do that at home!
As for the spurious argument that the unemployed could do a lot of unskilled work, veg picking, packing etc. The whole reason the foreign labour started to be used was that native workers stopped wanting to do those jobs, NOT the other way around. You’ve no chance of getting anyone off unemployment into veg picking for min wage, end of! You also can’t pay them more to do it as that would make the product uncompetitive and you’d have no business.
This is not 40 years ago this is now and that’s the reality of the world.
If these immigrants are supposedly so good at what they do,then why are their own countries such diabolical zb holes that they want to leave and what makes the Anglo Saxon based countries so good and attractive.
While are you seriously trying to suggest that at more than 60 million people this country has a too low population to sustain itself.Strange how it managed to do that for more than a thousand years without mass third world totally alien immigration.
As for sustaining an ageing population what makes you think that your obviously intended Socialist voting immigrant hordes are immune from ageing and who looks after that ageing population.
It really is time to tell these deranged Socialist zb wits to zb off.