There’s only 2 places localish for the lessons ect this one was actually 200 dearer than the other I chose these though as had geared lorry’s the others didn’t and I didn’t want to not know gears if I managed to pass and get a job 
think I was just unlucky
Ryan101:
There’s only 2 places localish for the lessons ect this one was actually 200 dearer than the other I chose these though as had geared lorry’s the others didn’t and I didn’t want to not know gears if I managed to pass and get a job
As I said I was making no assumptions about what you paid, just that the cost should be near the bottom of the priorities list when doing something as expensive and important to your future career path 
I do hope you get a full refund and then take lessons with another training school, don’t let these cowboys put you off 
Is this a problem within the training industry, or are circumstances like this rare, I’ll be pretty shocked if its regular
Be prepared to be shocked then!! These precise circumstances are not common. But being messed about is not uncommon. I’ve booked someone today who had been shouted at and de-moralised at TWO other schools. Spent £4k now to get CE. The customer was amazed at the quality, specification and cleanliness of the training vehicle. Then the discovery of our own private test centre was almost too much! I was told, after a 1 hour assessment, that I had taught more than had been taught on 2 prior courses.
The general standards of training, vehicle, facilities and general customer service within the training industry are dreadful.
This is why it makes sense to go to a DVSA Accredited Training Centre. There’s reasons why a few trainers are accredited and hundreds of others aren’t. Just ask the question, why aren’t they? It probably starts with them, personally, not being registered instructors - as they also are few and far between.
My greatest wish is that the DVSA would regulate the industry properly instead of the voluntary accreditation system currently in place. But they have made it clear that this isn’t about to happen. They don’t even intend changing the rules to make instructor registration compulsory. So what you’re left with, dear customer, is pot luck.
Time and time again, folks come into my training centre and are blown away by the obvious differences. Sadly, it’s often after they’ve wasted a small fortune trying to save a couple of hundred pounds to start with.
Buyer beware. (yes there are perfectly good trainers out there - - but who knows who they are??)
Pete 
I’ve just had a look at the webiste and they claim to be an accredited DSA training centre. I’ve then looked at the Direct.gov website where they are not listed.
Get a screenshot of this claim on the website and I’d also be reporting them for trading using this as an enticement when it’s false.
This needs reporting to the Advertising Standards Authority. Stupidly, the DVSA aren’t interested.
As in my signature, we are the ONLY DVSA Accredited LGV Training Centre between Luton and Carlisle.
Pete
eddie snax:
Ryan101:
There’s only 2 places localish for the lessons ect this one was actually 200 dearer than the other I chose these though as had geared lorry’s the others didn’t and I didn’t want to not know gears if I managed to pass and get a jobAs I said I was making no assumptions about what you paid, just that the cost should be near the bottom of the priorities list when doing something as expensive and important to your future career path
I do hope you get a full refund and then take lessons with another training school, don’t let these cowboys put you off
Ahhh I know you weren’t mate I was just saying that people looking for trainers automatically think if there’s a few to choose from the more expensive will be better (actually that was the wife) so I would do some research next time HOPEFULLY anyway
" the more expensive will be better (actually that was the wife) " I don’t agree mate.
I got mine off ebay. Left it right until the last minute and threw a tenner bid in.
Turns out she is quite a bargain. Within an hour she said " I love you long time mister ". Quite sweet really.
eagerbeaver:
" the more expensive will be better (actually that was the wife) " I don’t agree mate.I got mine off ebay. Left it right until the last minute and threw a tenner bid in.
Turns out she is quite a bargain. Within an hour she said " I love you long time mister ". Quite sweet really.
eagerbeaver:
" the more expensive will be better (actually that was the wife) " I don’t agree mate.I got mine off ebay. Left it right until the last minute and threw a tenner bid in.
Turns out she is quite a bargain. Within an hour she said " I love you long time mister ". Quite sweet really.
If she speaks I’d send her back as defective!
Peter Smythe:
Is this a problem within the training industry, or are circumstances like this rare, I’ll be pretty shocked if its regular
Be prepared to be shocked then!! These precise circumstances are not common. But being messed about is not uncommon. I’ve booked someone today who had been shouted at and de-moralised at TWO other schools. Spent £4k now to get CE. The customer was amazed at the quality, specification and cleanliness of the training vehicle. Then the discovery of our own private test centre was almost too much! I was told, after a 1 hour assessment, that I had taught more than had been taught on 2 prior courses.
The general standards of training, vehicle, facilities and general customer service within the training industry are dreadful.
Time and time again, folks come into my training centre and are blown away by the obvious differences. Sadly, it’s often after they’ve wasted a small fortune trying to save a couple of hundred pounds to start with.
Buyer beware. (yes there are perfectly good trainers out there - - but who knows who they are??)
Pete
Blimey Pete, I am shocked. To what purpose does an instructor serve shouting at a paying customer, and where does the customer is king fit in with this mentality, does the instructor think he’s in the bloody army 
I know you sponsor this page mate, maybe you should make a short video of your faculties, and post it on Youtube with a link from here. As a sponsor I’m sure that would be fair dinkum show customers the best(back to you walking on water)so that when they visit the rest, they have a bench mark
Now that’s a challenge! 
A video has already been filmed and is currently being edited. I will make it available so that the difference is clear.
As I said to a visitor today, "if you can find similar anywhere in the county (Notts), I’ll give you a CAT C and CE course free of charge. " And I stand by that.
For me, I am totally fed up to to the back teeth with sorting out the problems left behind by other so-called trainers.
[/ To what purpose does an instructor serve shouting at a paying customerquote]
This is merely a demonstration of the so-called instructor’s incompetence. Because they haven’t been trained to train (this applies to the huge majority, sadly) they haven’t got a clue what the candidate is likely to do, how to deliver appropriate instruction and how to ensure the instruction translates into the desired outcome. I firmly believe that the shouting instructor is just a bag of nerves who is unable to deal with the stress of the job.
We have a strict “no shouting” policy. Breaching it would definitely result in the swift delivery of a P45. It can never, ever be justified. To belittle and intimidate anybody, let alone a paying customer, is clearly unprofessional and totally unnecessary.
We are now receiving calls EVERY day from folks who have suffered at the hands of poor so-called trainers. It’s high time folks stood up and retaliated via Trading Standards and the courts. And time that others took note and thought about where to invest in this life-changing training. In my 40+ years in the industry I have never known this problem such such epidemic proportions. I find it frustrating and upsetting. Folks are getting into debt, having domestic issues and making themselves ill as a direct result of the actions of these so-called trainers.
I have a meeting with DVSA in a fews days. I hope to have the time to check how many so-called trainers are claiming accreditation who are simply lying. There is an amazing number. Folks don’t check - and shouldn’t have to check. But if they did and found such a direct lie on the website, they might just think twice before spending thousands of pounds with them. It would certainly put me off.
Maybe it would be an interesting exercise for customers to ask for proof of accreditation. That would cause some embarrassment - though I doubt if some of these so-called trainers are capable of such an emotion.
I can do no more. I have been beating this drum for years now.
Pete
I remember having an instructor that would scream, shout and try and belittle me in front of other candidates when we stopped for a brew near to the local test centre during the first two days … then on the third day not a peep out of him, very complementary about my driving skills and completely claim with all the explanations if I did something wrong…
Even got an apology for his behavior…Must have been because I brought along a tool of my own trade…then told him what my full time employment was…must have been sacred
That was until I failed my class 1 on W&D… Not my fault the drag cables snapped, nor the fact the electrical connection box had fallen apart and the cables come lose right at the end of a perfect test …you expect the equipment to be in decent condition and yes it cost me my class one test
Looking back on it I should have refused to take it out…
Then the basterd side of the instructor come out of his box again, probably due to the fact he ended up having to drive us both back 15 mile without rear lights … all my fault
I did make a complaint but nothing came of it…nor any offered of a free retest…
So I moved on to a better company and passed
Swampey2418:
I remember having an instructor that would scream, shout and try and belittle me in front of other candidates when we stopped for a brew near to the local test centre during the first two days … then on the third day not a peep out of him, very complementary about my driving skills and completely claim with all the explanations if I did something wrong…Even got an apology for his behavior…Must have been because I brought along a tool of my own trade…then told him what my full time employment was…must have been sacred
That was until I failed my class 1 on W&D… Not my fault the drag cables snapped, nor the fact the electrical connection box had fallen apart and the cables come lose right at the end of a perfect test …you expect the equipment to be in decent condition and yes it cost me my class one test
Looking back on it I should have refused to take it out…Then the basterd side of the instructor come out of his box again, probably due to the fact he ended up having to drive us both back 15 mile without rear lights … all my fault
I did make a complaint but nothing came of it…nor any offered of a free retest…So I moved on to a better company and passed
Don’t know what your employment was, but you should have done the world favour, and put it to use on that guy
Swampey2418:
That was until I failed my class 1 on W&D…
Can you get a class 1, or C + E , that being to cover the driving of an artic, through testing with a Wag and Drag 
eddie snax:
Swampey2418:
I remember having an instructor that would scream, shout and try and belittle me in front of other candidates when we stopped for a brew near to the local test centre during the first two days … then on the third day not a peep out of him, very complementary about my driving skills and completely claim with all the explanations if I did something wrong…Even got an apology for his behavior…Must have been because I brought along a tool of my own trade…then told him what my full time employment was…must have been sacred
That was until I failed my class 1 on W&D… Not my fault the drag cables snapped, nor the fact the electrical connection box had fallen apart and the cables come lose right at the end of a perfect test …you expect the equipment to be in decent condition and yes it cost me my class one test
Looking back on it I should have refused to take it out…Then the basterd side of the instructor come out of his box again, probably due to the fact he ended up having to drive us both back 15 mile without rear lights … all my fault
I did make a complaint but nothing came of it…nor any offered of a free retest…So I moved on to a better company and passed
Don’t know what your employment was, but you should have done the world favour, and put it to use on that guy
Swampey2418:
That was until I failed my class 1 on W&D…Can you get a class 1, or C + E , that being to cover the driving of an artic, through testing with a Wag and Drag
Yes you can. Something I’ve always disagreed with but there’s no distinction on your licence as to what type of trailer, only the weight of it. (There may be a distinction on restricted parts of your licence but not in general when it comes to the +E entitlement)
m1cks:
eddie snax:
Can you get a class 1, or C + E , that being to cover the driving of an artic, through testing with a Wag and DragYes you can. Something I’ve always disagreed with but there’s no distinction on your licence as to what type of trailer, only the weight of it. (There may be a distinction on restricted parts of your licence but not in general when it comes to the +E entitlement)
Well I’m learning loads on this Newbie forum recently.
Got to say I think that’s wrong aswell
Watched a dutch driver put an A frame Wag and Drag trailer on a bay on Tuesday, a work of art, and a completely different skill set to manouvering an Artic(semi trailer) onto the said same bay
There’s no restriction on weights because you pass on a w+d. The licence entitlement is identical. We operate w+d together with a collection of full - size artics. This gives the customer choice. I always suggest a short session on an artic for those having passed on w+d as there are differences that are better taught under controlled conditions than discovered the hard way. Having said that, plenty of folks seem to have managed without additional training but it concerns me.
The reversing is different - though a w+d driver with common sense will sort out an artic. The coupling mechanism is different (and for safety reasons should be taught IMO). Clearly the trailer on an artic will cut corners where a W+D will generally follow like a well behaved dog.
A short session of supervised driving should deliver a spoonful of confidence to face the real world.
Pete
I agree the conversion course from W&D to artic is a must especially for those who like me enter the career as total newbies, without completing the course I would of been totally lost when it came to coupling up or dropping a trailer and I found the tips and advise given by my instructor especially helpful (Cheers Dave).
Having spent many years on car transporters of all types, i wouldn’t say that W& D is any easier to drive in the real world than artic, they both have their good and bad points, especially when it comes to reversing but also in turns generally.
What the WD gains in trailer following it loses in the ultimate turning circle, and cut in, of the prime mover.
Where a WD loses out mainly is in tight reverses, you can have the trailer entering a space on a tight reverse and because you as driver sit so far away from the pivot point you can’t see the trailer past its wheels if you’re reversing in beside another lorry or a wall, so you can end up getting out going and having a look, then move a bit, several yimes before you get straight enough to see it all.
WD you can struggle with tight turns because you can’t do a jack knife as you can with an artic or you’ll foul the towing frame possibly causing serious damage.
Where WD gains for the driver is in stability, assuming the prime mover is heavier and suitably long, and because of the long wheelbase you get coach like ride.
I have no problem with WD training/testing, so long as the new driver gets some instruction and practice with an artic, and trailer (dis)connection before going out into the world.
Its the same the other way for artic drivers who often never ever get to use a WD in their driving lives, many long term artic drivers would struggle to hitch up a WD, i would, the hitch target is a lot smaller and further away than a fifth wheel/king pin…and for a while at least the change in angles for reversing would flummox them, it did me each time i changed between types for a few days.
Peter Smythe:
There’s no restriction on weights because you pass on a w+d. The licence entitlement is identical. We operate w+d together with a collection of full - size artics. This gives the customer choice. I always suggest a short session on an artic for those having passed on w+d as there are differences that are better taught under controlled conditions than discovered the hard way. Having said that, plenty of folks seem to have managed without additional training but it concerns me.The reversing is different - though a w+d driver with common sense will sort out an artic. The coupling mechanism is different (and for safety reasons should be taught IMO). Clearly the trailer on an artic will cut corners where a W+D will generally follow like a well behaved dog.
A short session of supervised driving should deliver a spoonful of confidence to face the real world.
Pete
Are your Wag and Drags A frame type with a turning front axle, or centre mounted fixed axle type
You have some very credible views on the topic of training, obviously honed through your years in the business, I’d like to suggest you for the minister for skills in Lukes cabinet, but what would be the fun in having someone who knows what theyre talking
Juddian:
Its the same the other way for artic drivers who often never ever get to use a WD in their driving lives, many long term artic drivers would struggle to hitch up a WD, i would, the hitch target is a lot smaller and further away than a fifth wheel/king pin…and for a while at least the change in angles for reversing would flummox them, it did me each time i changed between types for a few days.
Apart from the start at 18 on 7.5tonner, I’ve only driven artics since I got My class 1, 28 yrs ago, I think I best stick to what I know
We use close coupled w+d as does everyone else I know. A frame would be far too tricky for training purposes.
The references I make to the comparisons between w+d and artic are based on the training perspective though I fully understand the comments about reduced turning circles and difficulty in reversing in confined spaces with w+d. The difference is that issue is for the “real world” and, fortunately, that bit doesn’t come into the training world.
Pete