I have work for a few years in a drivers/mate combination now I have been teamed up with another drive making us double manned
My manager has told us as a double man vehicle there is no need to show a break on the tacho (breaks are to be taken in the passenger seat (card in slot 2 default POA) IE the first driver drives for 4.30hrs then we swop cards and continue driving and then repeat
so he is saying don’t need to stop for breaks
Question;
Do we need to show a tacho break after we have both used our first 4.30hrs of driving?
When I am the passenger in the vehicle (card in Slot 2 which defaults to POA) My Manager has said that “I will not be paid of the hours showing POA”
Question two;
Must a worker be paid for periods of availability - even if these periods do not count towards the working time limits under these Regulations?
i would be telling the boss that you saw for poa.
or i don’t do poa!
plus most insurance co need you to be paid or will not cover you in moving vehicle
I have work for a few years in a drivers/mate combination now I have been teamed up with another drive making us double manned
My manager has told us as a double man vehicle there is no need to show a break on the tacho (breaks are to be taken in the passenger seat (card in slot 2 default POA) IE the first driver drives for 4.30hrs then we swop cards and continue driving and then repeat
so he is saying don’t need to stop for breaks
Question;
Do we need to show a tacho break after we have both used our first 4.30hrs of driving?
On a multi-manning journey while a driver is sat in the passenger seat with his card in slot 2 the first 45 minutes of POA will be counted as break.
It’s perfectly legal to have a beak in a moving vehicle.
When I am the passenger in the vehicle (card in Slot 2 which defaults to POA) My Manager has said that “I will not be paid of the hours showing POA”
Personally I wouldn’t do any job I wasn’t getting paid for.
Question two;
Must a worker be paid for periods of availability - even if these periods do not count towards the working time limits under these Regulations?
You don’t legally have to paid for any time regardless of what the activity is, it’s between you and your boss but I don’t see how an employer can reasonably expect a driver to do multi-manning if he’s not getting paid for the time spent in the passenger seat.
Whether you are paid for POA while sat in the passenger seat (or even for working while sat in the driver’s seat) is totally between you and your employer. If you’re not happy to sit there unpaid, take your time elsewhere…
And as for the suggestion that you won’t be covered by insurance if you are not being paid - Hogwash.
If you are double driving then the obvious conclusion is that there will be more than ten hours’ driving as part of the day’s work. Split that between you and the other guy and he will be doing at least five hours, which means five hours’ unpaid POA for you.
As has been said, it’s up to you and your employer to sort out, but I have a fair idea what most people (me included) would do if they were expected to spend five hours or more at work unpaid. Yet another example of Two Bit Haulage Ltd. The sooner these outfits who take advantage of drivers are put out of the industry, the better. If you’re at work you should be paid for your time, end of.
its quite simple really set your card to poa for 45 mins in the second slot to comply with your requirement for a break then set it to other work for the remainder of the time your in the passenger seat.
personally i would do it like this other work for the first 4 hrs while driver one is driving then take 1/2 break i.e set the tacho to poa for the last 1/2 before you drive, then this will cover you for break requirements for the rtd, you can then drive for 4.5 hrs (because otherwise you would of worked for 9hrs without a rtd break. 1/2hr required for working between 6 and 9hrs)
driver one should set his card to break(poa) for the first 15 mins when you take over, then go back to other work, that will cover him for the requirements for a break under rtd rules, then when you get to 4hrs driving driver one should go back onto break(poa) to complete his tacho and rtd break requirement before he takes back over from you,
that way you will be paid for your time, the poa will be your breaks so the only thing you wont be paid for is your breaks then.
now this is all under the assumption that you are both continually driving, i will probably get told this is wrong by someone
but doing this way you should be compliant with both regulations hope it helps
as a professional driver don’t put up with these terms, I know we all need to work but there must be something out there, that you will get paid for the hours you do and respect your skill.
wildfire:
its quite simple really set your card to poa for 45 mins in the second slot to comply with your requirement for a break then set it to other work for the remainder of the time your in the passenger seat.
I don’t do multi-manning so have never used slot 2, but as far as I’m aware you can’t put slot 2 on anything other than POA while the vehicle is moving.
wildfire:
its quite simple really set your card to poa for 45 mins in the second slot to comply with your requirement for a break then set it to other work for the remainder of the time your in the passenger seat.
Correct in theory - But may not work in practice. On the few occasions I’ve been double-manned, the tachos in our vehicles have defaulted to POA for Driver 2 as soon as the wheels start turning, with no way of changing it to Other Work.
wildfire:
its quite simple really set your card to poa for 45 mins in the second slot to comply with your requirement for a break then set it to other work for the remainder of the time your in the passenger seat.
Correct in theory - But may not work in practice. On the few occasions I’ve been double-manned, the tachos in our vehicles have defaulted to POA for Driver 2 as soon as the wheels start turning, with no way of changing it to Other Work.
Ditto, ours are the same. (Well everyone I’ve ever driven double manned has been)
wildfire:
its quite simple really set your card to poa for 45 mins in the second slot to comply with your requirement for a break then set it to other work for the remainder of the time your in the passenger seat.
Correct in theory - But may not work in practice. On the few occasions I’ve been double-manned, the tachos in our vehicles have defaulted to POA for Driver 2 as soon as the wheels start turning, with no way of changing it to Other Work.
you should be able to select other work, as to comply with the rules you should be on other work while sat in the passenger seat if map reading ect, i have never double manned in a digi equipped truck so not 100%
wildfire:
you should be able to select other work, as to comply with the rules you should be on other work while sat in the passenger seat if map reading ect, i have never double manned in a digi equipped truck so not 100%
You should be able to - but it simply doesn’t work that way.
wildfire:
you should be able to select other work, as to comply with the rules you should be on other work while sat in the passenger seat if map reading ect, i have never double manned in a digi equipped truck so not 100%
nope always on POA till you stop! Then you can stick it on bed for break/ rest! that’s all folks
wildfire:
you should be able to select other work, as to comply with the rules you should be on other work while sat in the passenger seat if map reading ect, i have never double manned in a digi equipped truck so not 100%
You should be able to - but it simply doesn’t work that way.
so how do double manned crews comply with the rules then?
wildfire:
you should be able to select other work, as to comply with the rules you should be on other work while sat in the passenger seat if map reading ect, i have never double manned in a digi equipped truck so not 100%
You should be able to - but it simply doesn’t work that way.
so how do double manned crews comply with the rules then?
wildfire:
its quite simple really set your card to poa for 45 mins in the second slot to comply with your requirement for a break then set it to other work for the remainder of the time your in the passenger seat.
personally i would do it like this other work for the first 4 hrs while driver one is driving then take 1/2 break i.e set the tacho to poa for the last 1/2 before you drive, then this will cover you for break requirements for the rtd, you can then drive for 4.5 hrs (because otherwise you would of worked for 9hrs without a rtd break. 1/2hr required for working between 6 and 9hrs)
driver one should set his card to break(poa) for the first 15 mins when you take over, then go back to other work, that will cover him for the requirements for a break under rtd rules, then when you get to 4hrs driving driver one should go back onto break(poa) to complete his tacho and rtd break requirement before he takes back over from you,
that way you will be paid for your time, the poa will be your breaks so the only thing you wont be paid for is your breaks then.
now this is all under the assumption that you are both continually driving, i will probably get told this is wrong by someone
but doing this way you should be compliant with both regulations hope it helps
you say its simple really you don’t have a clue how a digital tacho works do you your simple really
wildfire:
you should be able to select other work, as to comply with the rules you should be on other work while sat in the passenger seat if map reading ect, i have never double manned in a digi equipped truck so not 100%
You should be able to - but it simply doesn’t work that way.
so how do double manned crews comply with the rules then?
Manual (handwritten) entries on a chart.
so would it be legal to leave the card in while on break/poa then take it out so when you put it back in you do a manual entry for other work, then his company could not get away with not paying while on poa as the download would show other work?
you don’t have a clue how a digital tacho works do you