Longest curtainsider in Uk

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:
So a small country that has busy road conditions and a road system and operating conditions which aren’t much different to Britain doesn’t make some hysterical bs issue about an 8 wheeler rigid pulling a 45 ft drawbar trailer .Maybe that’s because they’re clever enough to know that even that,let alone a 6 wheeler rigid,is a better option than artic outfits with 50 foot + semi trailers.

Carryfast:
The last time I went to Holland was years ago when I was about 11

The last time I went was … week before last and I’ll be going again in a week or so. I can therefore once again say “you are wrong”

The roads are infinitely quieter and the infrastructure far more suited. Parking places much bigger, forecourts more spacious etc etc.
I go over with the trailer stretched to just over 15.5 meters, running 3.5m wide and I can categorically say that driving it, fueling it and parking it over there is a lot less hassle compared to this country

Now unlike you I’m not adding in fabricated stories to suit, that is the truth. There’s a lot of folks on here who know it and have seen me. Or have a look in the Where am I forum, plenty of my pics in there too

[davepenn54]

Carryfast:

davepenn54:
You’re not wrong Luke mate, this particular thread could have been of real interest to any of the guy’s who might have been coming across these new length trailers but what happens ‘crazyhorse’ goes off on one with his mad ideas and the whole thread gets dismissed, but you shouldn’t encourage him however good it feels

Regards
Dave Penn;

So you think that the issue of looking into the relative merits and advantages,of the possible drawbar alternatives,to the drawbacks of using a 50 + foot trailer artic outfit,isn’t relevant to this thread.BS.

No because this thread was about the new length trls; being rolled out with some operators not about your crazy one sided limited real world experience ideas of how transport should be run

Every thread you get involved in goes down the same road and gets derailed into ‘crazyheads’ fantasy, most of us live in the real world and like to discuss things about the real world not your stupid ‘how it should be’ according to me keyboard warrior world

You definetly need to find a new outlet for your ‘Transport for the Future’ manifesto because as I’m sure you are acutely aware (then again maybe not) you have no taker’s on here.
Crazyhorse you are a troll who loses credibility every time you hijack a thread with the same old tosh OMG I’m falling into the trap myself now

Oh and BTW I also find your bigoted views very distasteful and always find it amazing that fella’s younger than me who hold the same kind of prejudice’s feel comfortable with themselves in todays’ society. But there you go it’s what life is about eh, live and let live, never judge someone, would you be the one to throw the first stone, WTF am I waffling about

Regards
Dave Penn;

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:
As he said it would have taken around the same line even if it had been a 45 foot trailer.The different geometry and delays of all the different turning and pivot points of a draw bar outfit have absolutely no connection whatsoever with the way in which an artic outfit turns.

Yes they have It’s doing EXACTLY what a driver in a unit would do, the exact same line, the exact same swing, the exact same tail swing

The fact is he managed to take that whole almost 80 foot outfit through that turn using a tighter line than if it had been an artic outfit pulling just a 45 foot trailer.In just the same way that a standard length draw bar outfit can be taken through a turn using less room than you’d need for an artic even though it’s longer overall and it provides more load space.You’re trying to re invent the wheel.

We’re not talking about the whole outfit though were talking about the back 45 plus foot of it and like it or not physics is physics

[davepenn54]

Saturday night is always good for some beer posting Crack on to Special Brew then give us rang

Regrads
Dvea Pnemn;

[billybigrig]

Nothing malicious from us though, we even bought Crazyfast a book…

[davepenn54]

i’m sure he will find that one good reading for his next onslaught into the world of Multi-Modal, Intercontinental Overland Vehicle logistics with maximum size allowed road going freight moving driver controlled vehicles
I wait with baited breath but with an empty glass so it’s goodnight from me and goodnight from him

Regards
Dave Penn;

[carryfast]

billybigrig:

Carryfast:
As he said it would have taken around the same line even if it had been a 45 foot trailer.The different geometry and delays of all the different turning and pivot points of a draw bar outfit have absolutely no connection whatsoever with the way in which an artic outfit turns.

Yes they have It’s doing EXACTLY what a driver in a unit would do, the exact same line, the exact same swing, the exact same tail swing

The fact is he managed to take that whole almost 80 foot outfit through that turn using a tighter line than if it had been an artic outfit pulling just a 45 foot trailer.In just the same way that a standard length draw bar outfit can be taken through a turn using less room than you’d need for an artic even though it’s longer overall and it provides more load space.You’re trying to re invent the wheel.

We’re not talking about the whole outfit though were talking about the back 45 plus foot of it and like it or not physics is physics

That’s the flaw in your engineering master plan.

Cut in is actually the difference between the line taken by the ‘steer axle’ of the tractor unit or the prime mover and the trailer axles and by ‘steer axle’ we’re not talking about the the rear axle/bogie of a tractor unit or the axles of the dolly/turntable of a drawbar outfit which are the last link in the steering chain.As I’ve said the reason why a drawbar outfit can turn a longer overall length,through a 90 degree turn,with less cut in,is all to do with the differences between the geometry and turning delays in the chain of steering between an artic and a drawbar.For example as it starts turning the tail sweep of the prime mover actually applies some opposite lock to the dolly/turntable axles while the prime mover is already facing in the direction it’s going in (try doing that with an artic ) and from then on things just start getting even better in comparison with what an artic would be doing at the same points through the same turn because of the difference in the angles which the two points of articulation of the drawbar allow between the prime mover and the trailer.

Which effectively means that while the drawbar outfit prime mover is turning the corner the trailer it’s pulling is still going straight on.Wheareas with an artic as soon as the tractor unit starts to turn the corner it also drags most of the front part of the trailer across the road in the direction that the tractor unit is going in.In which case the only way that you can reduce that effect is by making the pin to trailer axle/s measurement smaller in which case the extra length put behind the axle/s swings around that axis where it gets turned into tail sweep instead and therefore gets pulled across the road in the opposite direction.

In this case you’re right they are both the same 45 foot trailers but you’ve forgotten about the fact that the drawbar outfit also has a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity with the benefit of less cut in and the same tail sweep.

[carryfast]

billybigrig:
Nothing malicious from us though, we even bought Crazyfast a book…

I think that would be far better suited to you as you obviously need the education and that seems to be about your level at the moment.

[switchlogic]

Carryfast:

billybigrig:
Nothing malicious from us though, we even bought Crazyfast a book…

I think that would be far better suited to you as you obviously need the education and that seems to be about your level at the moment.

Pot, kettle, black anyone?

[switchlogic]

I suppose the thing is why care about this issue so much? The fact of the matter is most of us are drivers and if our company buys some new longer trailers we are just going to pick them up and drive them, no amount of moaning or ■■■■■■■■ on a forum about them is going to change the governments position. And Carryfast thinking his worldly ‘advice’ may change an operators mind is just laughable. I nearly spat out my tea when I read it. Rant on about your 25m outfits as much as you like Carry, your just ■■■■■■■ into the wind and wasting your life. Ask the average driver still working and I reckon like me they just don’t have any strong feelings about longer trailers either way because they have the sense to know they’ll just have to get on with it. Life is too short to get uptight about such things. So Carry calm down, it’s not like your even going to get to drive the new trailers let alone your contraption.

[happydaze]

switchlogic:
I suppose the thing is why care about this issue so much? The fact of the matter is most of us are drivers and if our company buys some new longer trailers we are just going to pick them up and drive them, no amount of moaning or ■■■■■■■■ on a forum about them is going to change the governments position. And Carryfast thinking his worldly ‘advice’ may change an operators mind is just laughable. I nearly spat out my tea when I read it. Rant on about your 25m outfits as much as you like Carry, your just ■■■■■■■ into the wind and wasting your life. Ask the average driver still working and I reckon like me they just don’t have any strong feelings about longer trailers either way because they have the sense to know they’ll just have to get on with it. Life is too short to get uptight about such things. So Carry calm down, it’s not like your even going to get to drive the new trailers let alone your contraption.

If we’d had them a few years ago I could have got a third tractor and even more sheet steel in under the lambs… Gutted

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:
In this case you’re right they are both the same 45 foot trailers

Exactly
Have you read what you’ve just written ■■?
You’ve argued yourself around in a circle again

but you’ve forgotten about the fact that the drawbar outfit also has a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity with the benefit of less cut in and the same tail sweep.

Not forgotten at all, just not relevant to a discussion on turning circles of a 45 foot trailer
Also to be fair you’re the only one than seems to give a rats ■■■ about it. The rest of us are interested in what we have right now. Not what there is anywhere else or what makes you ■■■■■

You’ve still not answered any of the infrastructure questions posed by many of too ■■?

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:

billybigrig:
Nothing malicious from us though, we even bought Crazyfast a book…

I think that would be far better suited to you as you obviously need the education and that seems to be about your level at the moment.

Not at all old boy, I’ve done more already than could have ever have hoped to and I’m still going

In fact in the next couple of years I’ll be heading to yet another continent This should kinda be my retirement move but I’ll probably still do a bit for the hell of it. They have roadtrains , I’ll send you some pictures and give you some realistic opinions based on actually driving them

[carryfast]

billybigrig:

Carryfast:
In this case you’re right they are both the same 45 foot trailers

Exactly
Have you read what you’ve just written ■■?
You’ve argued yourself around in a circle again

but you’ve forgotten about the fact that the drawbar outfit also has a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity with the benefit of less cut in and the same tail sweep.

Not forgotten at all, just not relevant to a discussion on turning circles of a 45 foot trailer

You’ve still not answered any of the infrastructure questions posed by many of too ■■?

There’s no way that it can possibly be ‘a discussion on turning circles of a 45 foot trailer’ because there’s no way that a 45 foot trailer can take itself anywhere.

For the purposes of this discussion it’s the fact that a 6 wheeler rigid can pull the same 45 foot trailer on a dolly with less cut in and the same tail sweep as pulling the thing with a tractor unit would.All that with the added benefit,as I’ve said,of a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity.

So why the zb would anyone see any sense in extending that 45 foot trailer to more than 50 feet,especially when that added length has been put on each end to keep the cut in the same at the expense of increasing the tail sweep.

I have answered your questions about infrastructure because there’s not many,if any,places where a 6 wheeler pulling a 45 foot drawbar wouldn’t be able to go that an existing length artic would let alone this extended one pulling a 50 + foot semi trailer.

[carryfast]

billybigrig:

Carryfast:

billybigrig:
Nothing malicious from us though, we even bought Crazyfast a book…

I think that would be far better suited to you as you obviously need the education and that seems to be about your level at the moment.

Not at all old boy, I’ve done more already than could have ever have hoped to and I’m still going

In fact in the next couple of years I’ll be heading to yet another continent This should kinda be my retirement move but I’ll probably still do a bit for the hell of it. They have roadtrains , I’ll send you some pictures and give you some realistic opinions based on actually driving them

Before you start driving those ‘road trains’ you’d better start trying to understand the difference between them and B trains first in case some switched on guvnor out there,who knows the difference,asks you a few questions first before he gives you the job.But don’t,whatever you do,tell him that you’ve only got up to page 10 in that book so far.

[happydaze]

Carryfast:

billybigrig:

Carryfast:

billybigrig:
Nothing malicious from us though, we even bought Crazyfast a book…

I think that would be far better suited to you as you obviously need the education and that seems to be about your level at the moment.

Not at all old boy, I’ve done more already than could have ever have hoped to and I’m still going

In fact in the next couple of years I’ll be heading to yet another continent This should kinda be my retirement move but I’ll probably still do a bit for the hell of it. They have roadtrains , I’ll send you some pictures and give you some realistic opinions based on actually driving them

Before you start driving those ‘road trains’ you’d better start trying to understand the difference between them and B trains first in case some switched on guvnor out there,who knows the difference,asks you a few questions first before he gives you the job.But don’t,whatever you do,tell him that you’ve only got up to page 10 in that book so far.

Jealous, much?

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:
There’s no way that it can possibly be ‘a discussion on turning circles of a 45 foot trailer’ because there’s no way that a 45 foot trailer can take itself anywhere.

Oh come now, flippancy can’t gloss over the fact that you lost you’re own argument

For the purposes of this discussion it’s the fact that a 6 wheeler rigid can pull the same 45 foot trailer on a dolly with less cut in and the same tail sweep as pulling the thing with a tractor unit would.All that with the added benefit,as I’ve said,of a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity.

As the picture, physics and experience show though you’re talking nonsense. The dolly does exactly what a tractor unit would. The “eye” doing what a steer axle would and the dolly axles what a drive axle would. QED the nose and tail swings of the same 45’ trailer would be nigh on identical because the trailer is still the same physical dimensions and turning on the same 2 fulcra i.e. the pin and bogey.

So why the zb would anyone see any sense in extending that 45 foot trailer to more than 50 feet,especially when that added length has been put on each end to keep the cut in the same at the expense of increasing the tail sweep.

Who cares ■■ Apparently only the great and wise oracle of transportation that is Captain Crazyfast ■■?
Perhaps because pulling a trailer like that is really not difficult ■■
Equipment utilisation flexibility ■■
As it faired better in extensive trials at Millbrook than any other combination ■■
Perhaps it’s a conspiracy ■■ The men in black have colluded with British rail, the Masons and The British 5th wheel manufacturers association in a foul plot to eliminate the wagon and drag and corner the market in commercial couplings You could well be the hero of the hour here Carryfast. Do you feel compelled to buy copies of Catcher in the Rye ■■? Quick pop your tinfoil hart on and check above your house for black helicopters

I have answered your questions about infrastructure because there’s not many,if any,places where a 6 wheeler pulling a 45 foot drawbar wouldn’t be able to go that an existing length artic would let alone this extended one pulling a 50 + foot semi trailer.

With the exception of most of the parking in UK services, a lot of laybys, many fuel stations, plenty of RDCs … …

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:
There’s no way that it can possibly be ‘a discussion on turning circles of a 45 foot trailer’ because there’s no way that a 45 foot trailer can take itself anywhere.

Oh come now, flippancy can’t gloss over the fact that you lost you’re own argument

For the purposes of this discussion it’s the fact that a 6 wheeler rigid can pull the same 45 foot trailer on a dolly with less cut in and the same tail sweep as pulling the thing with a tractor unit would.All that with the added benefit,as I’ve said,of a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity.

As the picture, physics and experience show though you’re talking nonsense. The dolly does exactly what a tractor unit would. The “eye” doing what a steer axle would and the dolly axles what a drive axle would. QED the nose and tail swings of the same 45’ trailer would be nigh on identical because the trailer is still the same physical dimensions and turning on the same 2 fulcra i.e. the pin and bogey.

So why the zb would anyone see any sense in extending that 45 foot trailer to more than 50 feet,especially when that added length has been put on each end to keep the cut in the same at the expense of increasing the tail sweep.

Who cares ■■ Apparently only the great and wise oracle of transportation that is Captain Crazyfast ■■?
Perhaps because pulling a trailer like that is really not difficult ■■
Equipment utilisation flexibility ■■
As it faired better in extensive trials at Millbrook than any other combination ■■
Perhaps it’s a conspiracy ■■ The men in black have colluded with British rail, the Masons and The British 5th wheel manufacturers association in a foul plot to eliminate the wagon and drag and corner the market in commercial couplings You could well be the hero of the hour here Carryfast. Do you feel compelled to buy copies of Catcher in the Rye ■■? Quick pop your tinfoil hart on and check above your house for black helicopters

I have answered your questions about infrastructure because there’s not many,if any,places where a 6 wheeler pulling a 45 foot drawbar wouldn’t be able to go that an existing length artic would let alone this extended one pulling a 50 + foot semi trailer.

With the exception of most of the parking in UK services, a lot of laybys, many fuel stations, plenty of RDCs … …

[billybigrig]

Carryfast:
Before you start driving those ‘road trains’ you’d better start trying to understand the difference between them and B trains first in case some switched on guvnor out there,who knows the difference,asks you a few questions first before he gives you the job.But don’t,whatever you do,tell him that you’ve only got up to page 10 in that book so far.

Really I’m pretty sure having successfully pulled A’s already I’ll cope. My resume, unlike some, is pretty decent and I’ve already got several offers based on it ,ta

Happydaze:
Jealous, much?

Nah d’ya think

[carryfast]

billybigrig:

Carryfast:
There’s no way that it can possibly be ‘a discussion on turning circles of a 45 foot trailer’ because there’s no way that a 45 foot trailer can take itself anywhere.

Oh come now, flippancy can’t gloss over the fact that you lost you’re own argument

For the purposes of this discussion it’s the fact that a 6 wheeler rigid can pull the same 45 foot trailer on a dolly with less cut in and the same tail sweep as pulling the thing with a tractor unit would.All that with the added benefit,as I’ve said,of a 6 wheeler rigid’s worth of extra load space and load capacity.

As the picture, physics and experience show though you’re talking nonsense. The dolly does exactly what a tractor unit would. The “eye” doing what a steer axle would and the dolly axles what a drive axle would. QED the nose and tail swings of the same 45’ trailer would be nigh on identical because the trailer is still the same physical dimensions and turning on the same 2 fulcra i.e. the pin and bogey.

You still don’t seem to have got it yet concerning the fact that the eye of the drawbar and the dolly/turntable axles are just the final links in a longer chain of steering effects,which work in a totally different way,than those of an artic,which started when Zetorpilot started turning the steering axle of the prime mover not the eye or the dolly/drawbar turntable axles.As I said the first of those tricks being that the dolly/turntable axles were turned in the opposite direction to that which the prime mover’s steer axle and drive axle was going in and the second of them being the difference in turn angle,of the prime mover’s drive axle,relative to the trailer’s dolly/turntable axles,allowed by the first of the two points of articulation in the drawbar.

Now how the zb can a tractor unit do any of that and how does any of that have any relationship whatsoever to what happens at the tractor unit’s drive axle when the steer axle turns it .In which case as I’ve said the drawbar outfit does the trick of steering it’s trailer straight on while it’s prime mover is turning the corner and if you’d have tried to follow the same line as that drawbar ‘outfit’,with an artic ‘outfit’,pulling the same trailer you’d have steered the thing off the road.Simples.