boredwivdrivin:
We have an archaic voting system unlike rest of Europe . we havent had a majority elected goverment since war .
Its a situation thats 2 main parties wont change as would result in them not enjoying trappings of office again .
And the 2 main parties are pro euro
5 million peoples votes for alternative parties won just 2 seats .
In this referendum party systems wont count , so a true reflection of opinions will be heard .
Thats why we have not had 1 before
We have had an EU referendum ‘before’ and in which the Parties were more split on the issue than now.Especially the Labour Party.However it was clear from day 1 that it isn’t shouldn’t be a matter for referendum or in fact any ministerial involvement.It is in fact a constitutional national crisis involving a corrupt handover of sovereignty that should have been dealt with at Royal and Military level.Not the electoral.
BillyHunt:
I don’t care who “wins” the referendum anymore. I’m retiring next April & moving abroad, not Europe…
Hmmmm…abandoning the sinking ship, perhaps? Puzzling as to why you carry such strident opinions when you won`t be sticking around to face the consequences?
You could say that, I’m just not interested in bickering on here with people that have no idea what their on about, coupled with the the fact that, regardless of who says what nobody will change their vote &, as usual on here, it turns into a stupid game of oneupmanship. Having said all that the real reason is as follows.
A terminal cancer diagnosis, not mine, will tend to focus the mind on things deemed trivial at the moment. We are moving to a warmer climate & one of us definitely won’t be back, and probably both come to think of it.
That`s awful news Billy, and i genuinely wish you and yours all the very best come your retirement. Hope things go as well as possible for you in the near future mate.
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I didn’t vote for the Tory [zb] I never have and never will
You seemed to have skipped a few posts Dolph where was your opinions on our forgotten youth that’s been brushed aside by cheap EU economic migrants? Or are you like the rest of the Europhiles than can only see through blinkers■■?
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I didn’t skipped any posts. There is nothing to be said of the outsourcing your employer is doing. It ■■■■■, it bad, but its the free market that dictated the business attitude. You blame Poland for this situation??
You Brits have never experiences the economy collapse we did in 89, tens of thousand out of work in few hours, devaluation of currency etc. One company is outsourcing, another one is coming, UK economy performs great, I don’t see reason to be worried.
Its your Government job to protect you and your youth, not mine, not Polish, not Hungarian etc. Its competitive market, we are not living in GB imperial times, you study and compete its not like you are more then everyone else. I don’t know anything about British youth work ethic and habits, hopefully is not like their parting attitude at Black sea coast.
Again, you need to drop the imperial mentality, you live in a union with over 510 million people in 21 century.
BillyHunt:
A terminal cancer diagnosis, not mine, will tend to focus the mind on things deemed trivial at the moment. We are moving to a warmer climate & one of us definitely won’t be back, and probably both come to think of it.
Sorry to hear that.
Puts all the bickering and pointless back and forth into perspective.
Dolph:
UK Government should have fixed the benefit system long ago, so people can’t abuse it. All EU continental countries did it. You don’t work and don’t contribute for certain period of time, you don’t get benefits and is mandatory for all citizens and residents !
Thoroughly agree with this. We are our own worst enemy where the tax and benefit system is concerned and it needs a complete overhaul immediately - but it won’t get one, just tinkering at the edges.
Dolph:
UK Government should have fixed the benefit system long ago, so people can’t abuse it. All EU continental countries did it. You don’t work and don’t contribute for certain period of time, you don’t get benefits and is mandatory for all citizens and residents !
Thoroughly agree with this. We are our own worst enemy where the tax and benefit system is concerned and it needs a complete overhaul immediately - but it won’t get one, just tinkering at the edges.
I was amazed to find out that everybody in UK gets child benefits, regardless of the amount. Public housing, free school meals, healthy start,Gov paying for child care, learning allowance, tax credit etc. this benefit system is beyond the Communist benefit system we had years ago. No wonder people from all over the EU and the World abuse it.
So if I come in UK, my child in Bulgaria will receive benefits, this is freaking idiotic. gov.uk/child-benefit-move-to-uk
Dolph:
UK Government should have fixed the benefit system long ago, so people can’t abuse it. All EU continental countries did it. You don’t work and don’t contribute for certain period of time, you don’t get benefits and is mandatory for all citizens and residents !
Thoroughly agree with this. We are our own worst enemy where the tax and benefit system is concerned and it needs a complete overhaul immediately - but it won’t get one, just tinkering at the edges.
I was amazed to find out that everybody in UK gets child benefits, regardless of the amount. Public housing, free school meals, healthy start,Gov paying for child care, learning allowance, tax credit etc. this benefit system is beyond the Communist benefit system we had years ago. No wonder people from all over the EU and the World abuse it.
So if I come in UK, my child in Bulgaria will receive benefits, this is freaking idiotic. gov.uk/child-benefit-move-to-uk
Dolph:
this benefit system is beyond the Communist benefit system we had years ago. No wonder people from all over the EU and the World abuse it.
It is seriously bloated and needs restructuring so that those that pay in get out, and those who actually need it can access it . . . but not for ever and ever and . . .
Start with limiting the length of time you can claim and the brainless Housing Benefit system.
The problem is Dolph, the Tories daren’t touch it for fear of being branded as The Nasty Party, kicking people who are down whilst looking after their own, and Labour . . . well . . . they just can’t give enough benefits away.
Dolph:
this benefit system is beyond the Communist benefit system we had years ago. No wonder people from all over the EU and the World abuse it.
It is seriously bloated and needs restructuring so that those that pay in get out, and those who actually need it can access it . . . but not for ever and ever and . . .
Start with limiting the length of time you can claim and the brainless Housing Benefit system.
The problem is Dolph, the Tories daren’t touch it for fear of being branded as The Nasty Party, kicking people who are down whilst looking after their own, and Labour . . . well . . . they just can’t give enough benefits away.
Sound like the Tories in UK are like the BG Socialist party, protecting and tolerating the gypsy crimes and “way of life” in order to secure their vote.
Dolph:
this benefit system is beyond the Communist benefit system we had years ago. No wonder people from all over the EU and the World abuse it.
It is seriously bloated and needs restructuring so that those that pay in get out, and those who actually need it can access it . . . but not for ever and ever and . . .
Start with limiting the length of time you can claim and the brainless Housing Benefit system.
The problem is Dolph, the Tories daren’t touch it for fear of being branded as The Nasty Party, kicking people who are down whilst looking after their own, and Labour . . . well . . . they just can’t give enough benefits away.
Dolph obviously wants wants the worst of all worlds situation of American type social costs provision combined with East Euro wages.
While your idea is somewhere in between based on East Euro wages and a rationed Socialist type social costs provision.In which as usual some think that their ‘needs’ are more than others with each looking over their shoulder at the other.The end result still being along the lines of what Dolph is obviously all about.
When what’s needed is American type social costs provision ‘but’ with the type of wage structure needed to pay for it.In which case we won’t get that in an environment of free markets.In which the lets all work for peanuts mentality of Dolph’s lot wins out.In just the same way that you wouldn’t want to be working in America subject to Fordist Capitalist US type health care and social provision,but in a wage environment that’s now sold out to race to the bottom free markets described by Dolph and which your ideas obviously pander to.On that note be careful what you wish for.
Dolph:
this benefit system is beyond the Communist benefit system we had years ago. No wonder people from all over the EU and the World abuse it.
It is seriously bloated and needs restructuring so that those that pay in get out, and those who actually need it can access it . . . but not for ever and ever and . . .
Start with limiting the length of time you can claim and the brainless Housing Benefit system.
The problem is Dolph, the Tories daren’t touch it for fear of being branded as The Nasty Party, kicking people who are down whilst looking after their own, and Labour . . . well . . . they just can’t give enough benefits away.
Sound like the Tories in UK are like the BG Socialist party, protecting and tolerating the gypsy crimes and “way of life” in order to secure their vote.
No the Tories have always been about trying to combine the exploitative wage structure of Socialism and rationed social provision that goes with it as part of their Corrupt idea of ‘Capitalism’.Our open door immigration policy being a part of that.IE West Indian and Asian imported labour before we joined the EU now with the added bonus of yet more imported cheap labour from Eastern Europe.What your bs does prove is the catastrophic mistake which our unions have made in going for the idea of Socialism and workers of the world unite instead of nationalism and protectionism.So keep up the good work because you’re really helping the case for the latter.
Stanley Knife:
And Brits want Scandinavian style social services paid with American style personal taxes.
No they want best case Fordist Capitalist American type private provision with Fordist Capitalist type wages to pay for it.They won’t get that under our present over supplied labour market using imported cheap labour and/or exported jobs which takes advantage of cheap Communist and ex Communist exploitable downtrodden gutless workers.
What the hell, where did I say wages should be low, stop putting word in my mouth which I never said . People should and must be payed decent wage. Im not a slave master, but an ordinary man.
Except medical cost I agree what the US system/way of life. You relay on yourself, not the Government(read taxpayer) to take care of you and your kids. Benefit system that is suffocating the whole country is as worst as low/slave wages.
Taxpayer money should go to benefits for the whole society - hospitals, schools, road infrastructure, police, army, fire rescue, cheap and fast administrative services. For example in Bulgaria or UK DL renewal/exchange take 1-3 weeks, in US took me 5 minutes.
Why taxpayers in UK should pay up to 1573 pounds as benefit if student couple decide to have a baby? Its their choice, there responsibility.
Examples like this are over whelming in UK…absolute nanny state.
Dolph:
What the hell, where did I say wages should be low, stop putting word in my mouth which I never said . People should and must be payed decent wage. Im not a slave master, but an ordinary man.
Except medical cost I agree what the US system/way of life. You relay on yourself, not the Government(read taxpayer) to take care of you and your kids. Benefit system that is suffocating the whole country is as worst as low/slave wages.
Taxpayer money should go to benefits for the whole society - hospitals, schools, road infrastructure, police, army, fire rescue, cheap and fast administrative services. For example in Bulgaria or UK DL renewal/exchange take 1-3 weeks, in US took me 5 minutes.
Why taxpayers in UK should pay up to 1573 pounds as benefit if student couple decide to have a baby? Its their choice, there responsibility.
Examples like this are over whelming in UK…absolute nanny state.
If I read it right it’s you who said that we have to ‘compete’ with low wage economies.While if I’ve read it wrong then we obviously don’t want to import cheap labour from Eastern Europe with it’s low wage expectancy culture.
As for the ‘student couple’,just like anyone who chooses to leave school early their ‘choice’ is obviously to have their kids while they are young so that their kids aren’t burying their parents by the time those kids are 40 and those ‘parents’ get to see their great grand children grow up.That obviously costs money in the form of a guaranteed job when they leave school or qualify and decent wages to pay for their living costs and/or pay off their student loans.Which is what the issue is all about.Because we can’t pay civilised wages in a civilised economy when we’ve opened it up to a bunch of backward thinking communists or ex communists.
The-Snowman:
I still think we are better as part of the EU if we can get some powers back. A sort of “take what suits us” kind of thing. We need rid of the control they have regards our laws, get rid of the human rights act and get a tighter grip on immigration (All countries need immigrants but we need control of how many and what kind rather than being told to hold the door open)
If we do leave the EU then I hope im wrong but I can see Britain struggling because the EU are like a bunch of children and I can predict them chucking their toys out the pram and smothering us in red tape with regards to trade issues.
Blimey make your mind up.The EU is on an unarguable route towards a Federal European system of government which was/is already in place from the day we joined it in many respects.The trade angle was always a case of economic blackmail in that regard.
Which leaves the question what makes you think that we wouldn’t actually win a trade war with the scam in that regard.Let alone even actually benefit from one bearing in mind we’re arguing from a position of trade deficit strength.As opposed to the EU’s trade surplus weakness.However there’s no way that we can start that process so long as we remained signed up to deal that exchanges sovereignty for the right to be a net importer of EU goods and services not to mention giving them rights to our territorial fishing reserves.
My mind is made up. Im for staying in because I feel ther EU would throw a tantrum and we would suffer in a way that could take years to recover from.
All I said was it would be good to have more control over the things that matter the most and get more power over things that the EU forced on us. Nowt wrong with only wanting the good bits and sod the rest.
But when all is said and done I dont see the point in bartering back and forth on an internet forum. Dont get me wrong, I read these threads and actually find some of it quite interesting. You all carry on. But I dont see the point of trying to argue my point forcefully and trying to engage in oneupmanship because at the end of the day, its a moot point. The powers that be will do whatever the hell they want and they definitely will do it without trawling through an hgv forum to find out any of our opinions.
And its probably just as well because if they read some of the comments made thus far they’d take the right to vote away from us1
The-Snowman:
My mind is made up. Im for staying in because I feel ther EU would throw a tantrum and we would suffer in a way that could take years to recover from.
All I said was it would be good to have more control over the things that matter the most and get more power over things that the EU forced on us. Nowt wrong with only wanting the good bits and sod the rest.
But when all is said and done I dont see the point in bartering back and forth on an internet forum. Dont get me wrong, I read these threads and actually find some of it quite interesting. You all carry on. But I dont see the point of trying to argue my point forcefully and trying to engage in oneupmanship because at the end of the day, its a moot point. The powers that be will do whatever the hell they want and they definitely will do it without trawling through an hgv forum to find out any of our opinions.
And its probably just as well because if they read some of the comments made thus far they’d take the right to vote away from us1
Exactly what are these supposed ‘good bits’ and you still haven’t explained how the EU could possibly ‘throw its toys out of the pram’ in a way which could possibly harm the economy of a net contributor to the scam and net importer of its goods and services.
While it’s no surprise that an obvious supporter of our continuing EU membership would want to remove the electoral rights of those who oppose it.In which case,like Dolph,carry on because you’re making a great case for the EU membership opposition and out side of the argument.
