Yes but at least we can ■■■■ them off after 4 yrs, can’t do that with the Elitist Un’s
Munchkin:
If Brexit happens then Dave’s position becomes untenable so it’ll be a leadership election for which Boris will have positioned himself rather well!
Don’t say you weren’t warned.
+1
Id rather remain in the EU than have Boris as PM!
anon84679660:
one more things regarding immigration.
Last week I heard on BBC 4 that in 2014 or 15 immigration from outside the EU was greater than from inside the EU.
The figures from 2015 are approx 180,000 EU nationals and 180,000 NON EU nationals
However that is a little misleading, 47% of NON EU nationals are coming here to study (as opposed to 9% from the EU), we have some of the finest universities in the world, they are paying serious money into our universities, most will return home after graduating, some may not but as they have graduated through our universities then they are welcome in my book.
So in reality the 2015 figures show closer to two thirds of migrants are from the rest of the EU.
Bluey Circles:
anon84679660:
one more things regarding immigration.
Last week I heard on BBC 4 that in 2014 or 15 immigration from outside the EU was greater than from inside the EU.The figures from 2015 are approx 180,000 EU nationals and 180,000 NON EU nationals
However that is a little misleading, 47% of NON EU nationals are coming here to study (as opposed to 9% from the EU), we have some of the finest universities in the world, they are paying serious money into our universities, most will return home after graduating, some may not but as they have graduated through our universities then they are welcome in my book.
So in reality the 2015 figures show closer to two thirds of migrants are from the rest of the EU.
Amongst those numbers how many are bogus students studying at bogus collages
And it has been going on for years Exposed: the language schools that give visas to bogus students
Many come here to work for peanuts and pay no taxes and try to remain here illegally by overstaying
Tommy T, Brexit will change this how exactly?
By the way collage is an art form !
Sent from my X17 using Tapatalk
anon84679660:
How has this thread not been brought down by mods as all pro remain threads have been I don’t know.
I guess mods think lorry drivers are too stupid and can’t think for themselves and they can only be allow to be exposed to the only accepted party line of leaving the EU.OK, so when we leave:
- We’ll have to beg Germans, French, Eastern Europeans for years to let us trade with them, fact
- We’ll have to pay money into the EU as other rich European countries that are outside of EU have to do, so forget about Boris; idea of saving millions for NHS, lol, lol, fact
- WE’ll have to allow free movement of people as it is the case with other rich European countries outside of EU, so anybody from EU will be able to come in and stay and live in this country as it has been till now, fact
- Only thanks to EU we are being protected from exploitation and are being defended by 48 hrs a week average. If EU goes haulage companies will be trying to remove this inconvenience. Turkeys voting for Christmas?
- Some here suggest that we are very attractive to other EU countries because we have a large trading deficit.
So following this line of thinking we will have to have this trading deficit for ever to make us attractive to other countries, which will lead to the UK going bankrupt as it is with anybody borrowing money to buy goods and not being able to produce himself enough to sell and have enough to buy goods from others.
So, I understand brexiters are OK with the UK going bust? Strange reasoning.- Some say that if we leave we are going to spared when the cabotage rules are going to be relaxed, lol, wishful thinking.
Cabotage rules are going to be part of any new trade agreement and we will have to accept them as part of any trade deal that is going to be offered to us.- Canada took 7 years of negotiations to agree some trade agreement with EU and it is only part of the process, many years still to come, and even canadians are saying they had to accept whatever EU offered them and have nothing to say on how these laws are being shaped.
- Trump is happy to see us out, lol, he has issues with Cameron , so he would love to see Cameron fail.
- Putin is a great brexit supporter, so that’s about the only world leader advising us to leave, lol.
- There is a new free trade deal being discussed between EU, over a 400 million consumers market and the US.
Anyone who follows it, or has any idea of what americans want us to accept, will know that only because we are in the EU and part of over 400 million people market we have a chance of not being shafted by americans.
When we leave the EU as a small country we will have to take whatever US proposes us , or get nothing.- EU citizens that are here already will be staying anyway, even brexit leaders accept it and say remainers are trying to scare EU citizens that are living here, and that no one in their right mind will try to expel EU citizens from the UK.
- Scots have been saying for a long time, they want to remain in the UE, and if UK decides to leave they will leave the UK.
So, since we have established here and on other threads that leaving the EU would change nothing and only make things worst for ourselves, can anyone remind me the REAL reasons why some on this forum want us to leave?
Brexiters want this country to become a basket case and a new european banana republic.
I actualy have a lot of respect for Cameron, he tried his best, try to negotiate a better deal, but UE refused, as you can not allow some to be in the EU on better conditions that others and it is fair.
Cameron didn’t get ■■■■■■ off, knowing he didn’t gain much he is still supporting us to stay in the EU as the only sense making choice.Brexiters want to make us a beggars and a laughing stock all over the world, and I definitely don’t want to be part of that.
Are we really that stupid?
-
Let me guess you’re another of those who thinks the EU will put a tarrif on their ‘exports’ to us to ‘punish’ us.
-
Why will we ‘have’ to pay money to the EU for anything.Let me guess fear of 1.
3.Why will we ‘have’ to allow free movement.Let me guess see 1 again.
4.Only thanks to the EU have the British unions been smashed starting with Europhile Callaghan giving UK jobs to German workers and forcing those left to accept less pay for more work than Germans.Then Europhile Thatcher effectively removing the right to strike in the form of secondary action.
5.We’ve had a trade deficit with the EU since we joined it v a trade surplus before.How does staying in the EU change that situation as opposed to the proven example of being out of it.
6.Exactly which information states that the EU has no intention of lifting cabotage restrictions.But it’s great to see that the in campaign on here actually ‘supports’ the idea because that will help the case for out at least in the case of the indigenous driver pool with any sense.
7.Great if the Germans want to wait 7 years before we discuss letting them import any more German cars here then bring it on.
8.Trump is actually the better choice given the other one is yet more rule by pseudo Socialists like Obama.
9.Putin knows that the EU is all about it causing aggro with Russia in the form of expansion into Ukraine. Feel free to invade Russia to go for ‘regime change’ there so long as you’re in front in the lead tank.A Leopard with German markings would be great from that point of view.Luckily I’m too old for the call up although if I was I’d probably desert and join the Russians in that case.
10.TTIP is actually ‘supported’ by the EU which is why people like Kate Hoey are on the leave side not remain.
11.If it was me I’d make closing the door apply retrospectively just as the US has done in the case of Mexico under Obama’s administration ironically.To stop the obvious rush of East Euro and Merkel’s Asian immigrant ‘community’ that will take place when the EU try to stall our exit for time.
12.Why are the Scottish so keen on so called ‘Nationalism’ in the case of the UK but not the EU.Let me guess Global Warmist believer Sturgeon wants to ship all of Scotland’s oil to the EU to be burnt there while putting the Scottish on bicycles and she’s got more in common with Socialists like Merkel and Juncker.Than she has with Farage who would probably give her Scottish independence if he’s got any sense.
On that note the idea of leaving the EU making matters worse is obviously all in the heads of the remainers who are zb scared that their Federalist dream is about to be smashed.Although look on the bright side if we don’t manage to do it now hopefully others will later.
tommy t:
Munchkin:
Do the Brexit supporters not realise that their leader Boris is argueing so vociferously as this is in effect his C.V. for Tory leadership?Sent from my X17 using Tapatalk
After brexit , it’s would be a good time to call a general election and Boris and co couldn’t run a bath,The problem is this what are the alternatives to a tory government ? they are all as bad as each other
A co alition between a Hoey led Labour and Farage and David Davis led Conservative administration would be as good as it gets and a lot better than anything we’ve had since 1973. 
tommy t:
Bluey Circles:
anon84679660:
one more things regarding immigration.
Last week I heard on BBC 4 that in 2014 or 15 immigration from outside the EU was greater than from inside the EU.The figures from 2015 are approx 180,000 EU nationals and 180,000 NON EU nationals
However that is a little misleading, 47% of NON EU nationals are coming here to study (as opposed to 9% from the EU), we have some of the finest universities in the world, they are paying serious money into our universities, most will return home after graduating, some may not but as they have graduated through our universities then they are welcome in my book.
So in reality the 2015 figures show closer to two thirds of migrants are from the rest of the EU.
Amongst those numbers how many are bogus students studying at bogus collages
Britain's bogus foreign students work illegally and claim benefits | Daily Mail Online
Thousands of ‘fake’ students at UK's new higher education colleges | Students | The Guardian
And it has been going on for years Exposed: the language schools that give visas to bogus students
Many come here to work for peanuts and pay no taxes and try to remain here illegally by overstaying
I don’t dispute that, however a great deal are genuine - I was simply disputing the figures being spouted off by the STAYinners that EU immigration is less prevalent than it is - from my reckoning may be over 2/3rds of migration is through the EU open door. I don’t quite know how we can reduce the NON EU migration, that is a discussion for the future, it is the EU migration that is relative to the vote in a few weeks time.
tommy t:
Bluey Circles:
anon84679660:
one more things regarding immigration.
Last week I heard on BBC 4 that in 2014 or 15 immigration from outside the EU was greater than from inside the EU.The figures from 2015 are approx 180,000 EU nationals and 180,000 NON EU nationals
However that is a little misleading, 47% of NON EU nationals are coming here to study (as opposed to 9% from the EU), we have some of the finest universities in the world, they are paying serious money into our universities, most will return home after graduating, some may not but as they have graduated through our universities then they are welcome in my book.
So in reality the 2015 figures show closer to two thirds of migrants are from the rest of the EU.
Amongst those numbers how many are bogus students studying at bogus collages
Britain's bogus foreign students work illegally and claim benefits | Daily Mail Online
Thousands of ‘fake’ students at UK's new higher education colleges | Students | The Guardian
And it has been going on for years Exposed: the language schools that give visas to bogus students
Many come here to work for peanuts and pay no taxes and try to remain here illegally by overstaying
^ This.All helped by Euro human rights legislation that stops us deporting illegal immigrants.As for non EU immigration isn’t that exactly what Merkel has forced on Germany among others like Sweden etc and soon to be the rest.
anon84679660:
How has this thread not been brought down by mods as all pro remain threads have been I don’t know.
I guess mods think lorry drivers are too stupid and can’t think for themselves and they can only be allow to be exposed to the only accepted party line of leaving the EU.OK, so when we leave:
- We’ll have to beg Germans, French, Eastern Europeans for years to let us trade with them, fact
- We’ll have to pay money into the EU as other rich European countries that are outside of EU have to do, so forget about Boris; idea of saving millions for NHS, lol, lol, fact
- WE’ll have to allow free movement of people as it is the case with other rich European countries outside of EU, so anybody from EU will be able to come in and stay and live in this country as it has been till now, fact
- Only thanks to EU we are being protected from exploitation and are being defended by 48 hrs a week average. If EU goes haulage companies will be trying to remove this inconvenience. Turkeys voting for Christmas?
- Some here suggest that we are very attractive to other EU countries because we have a large trading deficit.
So following this line of thinking we will have to have this trading deficit for ever to make us attractive to other countries, which will lead to the UK going bankrupt as it is with anybody borrowing money to buy goods and not being able to produce himself enough to sell and have enough to buy goods from others.
So, I understand brexiters are OK with the UK going bust? Strange reasoning.- Some say that if we leave we are going to spared when the cabotage rules are going to be relaxed, lol, wishful thinking.
Cabotage rules are going to be part of any new trade agreement and we will have to accept them as part of any trade deal that is going to be offered to us.- Canada took 7 years of negotiations to agree some trade agreement with EU and it is only part of the process, many years still to come, and even canadians are saying they had to accept whatever EU offered them and have nothing to say on how these laws are being shaped.
- Trump is happy to see us out, lol, he has issues with Cameron , so he would love to see Cameron fail.
- Putin is a great brexit supporter, so that’s about the only world leader advising us to leave, lol.
- There is a new free trade deal being discussed between EU, over a 400 million consumers market and the US.
Anyone who follows it, or has any idea of what americans want us to accept, will know that only because we are in the EU and part of over 400 million people market we have a chance of not being shafted by americans.
When we leave the EU as a small country we will have to take whatever US proposes us , or get nothing.- EU citizens that are here already will be staying anyway, even brexit leaders accept it and say remainers are trying to scare EU citizens that are living here, and that no one in their right mind will try to expel EU citizens from the UK.
- Scots have been saying for a long time, they want to remain in the UE, and if UK decides to leave they will leave the UK.
So, since we have established here and on other threads that leaving the EU would change nothing and only make things worst for ourselves, can anyone remind me the REAL reasons why some on this forum want us to leave?
Brexiters want this country to become a basket case and a new european banana republic.
I actualy have a lot of respect for Cameron, he tried his best, try to negotiate a better deal, but UE refused, as you can not allow some to be in the EU on better conditions that others and it is fair.
Cameron didn’t get ■■■■■■ off, knowing he didn’t gain much he is still supporting us to stay in the EU as the only sense making choice.Brexiters want to make us a beggars and a laughing stock all over the world, and I definitely don’t want to be part of that.
Are we really that stupid?
That’s why we’re not all rich then. If we didn’t give a damn about politics before - why should people care about anything that isn’t on their own doorstep or directly affect them now?
The vast majority of us are ■■■■■■ off keeping the rich right up there, whilst the rest of us get told “there’s some reason that you need to stay where you are right now. Perhaps there’s a risk of falling further, but that’s your problem - not ours.” Remain’s fear campaign is all about “What If” rather than “What’s Likely”. They would have done better to have just been honest bullies over all this with Cameron saying to us “If we do Brexit - I’ll raise taxes by 10% across the board, and if my party backbenchers try to remove me - I’ll call a general election!”
THAT then, would at least make some sense of why Labour, Corbyn, and our Union leaders are all lining up behind this “shaft the public to keep us officials in position” tack they have been making all along.
REMAIN is about “The same or worse in the future”. “The Same” is as good as it’s ever going to get of course - unless you are one of those few who receive money directly from the EU already. 3-4m Cleggy once said. I can actually believe this figure. What about the other 64,000,000 of us though, including our kids trying to grow up in a world with no bloody real jobs - even for the top graduates coming along now…?
BREXIT is about “Rolling the dice to try and improve our lot outright”. YES It’s a gamble. YES it means upheaval.
But when your current dice roll shows a ‘three’ as total - there’s not that much downside left to be had - is there?
Now pass the damned dice - and let’s see just how much above a ‘three’ our next and last roll gets us!
The-Snowman:
Munchkin:
If Brexit happens then Dave’s position becomes untenable so it’ll be a leadership election for which Boris will have positioned himself rather well!
Don’t say you weren’t warned.+1
Id rather remain in the EU than have Boris as PM!
That’s Remain’s strongest lure! (Perhaps their only one.)
No single market access for UK after Brexit, Wolfgang Schauble says:
theguardian.com/politics/201 … auble-says
That’s what I’ve always been saying, don’t expect to be treated well when you quit the EU.
Only inside the EU together with other countries we keep germans in check.
If EU disintegrates germans will do what’s best for them only, now they are busy keeping all EU together, so they can not become as powerful as they could be on their own.
anon84679660:
No single market access for UK after Brexit, Wolfgang Schauble says:theguardian.com/politics/201 … auble-says
That’s what I’ve always been saying, don’t expect to be treated well when you quit the EU.
Only inside the EU together with other countries we keep germans in check.
If EU disintegrates germans will do what’s best for them only, now they are busy keeping all EU together, so they can not become as powerful as they could be on their own.
Great Germany wants a trade war bring it on.Third time zb losers. 
On that note what do you mean by don’t expect to be treated well when ‘you’ quit the EU.Are you saying you’re not a Brit ?.
In the utopian post Brexit world when all the economic migrants ( funny how we’re “ex-pat” when we work abroad) working in the veg fields of Linc’s, for instance, are sent home will there be buses laid on from Hull, Grimsby to ferry the previously unemployed to the newly vacant agricultural work?
Oh wait, they won’t pick cauliflower for min wage, make it £15 pH to make it worthwhile!
Can’t says farmer, imported ones will be far cheaper.
That’s OK, say the workers, cheap food is good.
Just as well it’s cheap, says farmer, 'cos there’s no work now.
Oh, that’ll be global economics what’s done us out of a job then, say the never actually worked workers. If only this were the 1930’s and we were a self sufficient island with slow or non existent trade links!
Haha, says the farmer, we weren’t! It was only the dying Empire and ultimately a war that got us out of that.
The End
Sent from my X17 using Tapatalk
Munchkin:
In the utopian post Brexit world when all the economic migrants ( funny how we’re “ex-pat” when we work abroad) working in the veg fields of Linc’s, for instance, are sent home will there be buses laid on from Hull, Grimsby to ferry the previously unemployed to the newly vacant agricultural work?
Oh wait, they won’t pick cauliflower for min wage, make it £15 pH to make it worthwhile!
Can’t says farmer, imported ones will be far cheaper.
That’s OK, say the workers, cheap food is good.
Just as well it’s cheap, says farmer, 'cos there’s no work now.
Oh, that’ll be global economics what’s done us out of a job then, say the never actually worked workers. If only this were the 1930’s and we were a self sufficient island with slow or non existent trade links!
Haha, says the farmer, we weren’t! It was only the dying Empire and ultimately a war that got us out of that.
The End
Ironically the Labour Party and the Unions support your crusade for the cheap labour economy.Yes import the cheaper food and then spend the money saved to pay for the foreign aid to send all the food back to the starving Africans etc that you’ve imported it from.
But keep going you’re at least helping to bust the myth of the EU being good for Brit workers.
Munchkin:
In the utopian post Brexit world when all the economic migrants ( funny how we’re “ex-pat” when we work abroad) working in the veg fields of Linc’s, for instance, are sent home will there be buses laid on from Hull, Grimsby to ferry the previously unemployed to the newly vacant agricultural work?
Oh wait, they won’t pick cauliflower for min wage, make it £15 pH to make it worthwhile!
Can’t says farmer, imported ones will be far cheaper.
That’s OK, say the workers, cheap food is good.
Just as well it’s cheap, says farmer, 'cos there’s no work now.
Oh, that’ll be global economics what’s done us out of a job then, say the never actually worked workers. If only this were the 1930’s and we were a self sufficient island with slow or non existent trade links!
Haha, says the farmer, we weren’t! It was only the dying Empire and ultimately a war that got us out of that.
The EndSent from my X17 using Tapatalk
I agree with what you are saying but brexiters don’t seem to care about economics. They look back to an era when we had utopian time that did not exist. They think they can turn their back on Europe then be allowed to trade with them but the rules the EU applies to every other country that wants trade but not the EU won’t apply. Every country which trades in the EU must allow free movement of people, it’s in the mission statement but they say no that won’t apply to us.
It beggars belief.
I beleive if we do leave as Boris as the new pm he will allow free movement to get the trade deal because he knows we will go bankrupt without it. But he will say we don’t have to accept their laws like maternity pay paternity pay, you know those ones nobody likes.
alicks77:
Munchkin:
In the utopian post Brexit world when all the economic migrants ( funny how we’re “ex-pat” when we work abroad) working in the veg fields of Linc’s, for instance, are sent home will there be buses laid on from Hull, Grimsby to ferry the previously unemployed to the newly vacant agricultural work?
Oh wait, they won’t pick cauliflower for min wage, make it £15 pH to make it worthwhile!
Can’t says farmer, imported ones will be far cheaper.
That’s OK, say the workers, cheap food is good.
Just as well it’s cheap, says farmer, 'cos there’s no work now.
Oh, that’ll be global economics what’s done us out of a job then, say the never actually worked workers. If only this were the 1930’s and we were a self sufficient island with slow or non existent trade links!
Haha, says the farmer, we weren’t! It was only the dying Empire and ultimately a war that got us out of that.
The EndSent from my X17 using Tapatalk
I agree with what you are saying but brexiters don’t seem to care about economics. They look back to an era when we had utopian time that did not exist. They think they can turn their back on Europe then be allowed to trade with them but the rules the EU applies to every other country that wants trade but not the EU won’t apply. Every country which trades in the EU must allow free movement of people, it’s in the mission statement but they say no that won’t apply to us.
It beggars belief.
I beleive if we do leave as Boris as the new pm he will allow free movement to get the trade deal because he knows we will go bankrupt without it. But he will say we don’t have to accept their laws like maternity pay paternity pay, you know those ones nobody likes.
If ‘every country that trades’ with Europe’ ‘has to allow free movement’ feel free to explain whether that applies to America, China or Japan or Russia.On that note you are aware of Japanese immigration policy for one example.
The only ones getting the maternity pay if we stay will be the cheap immigrant or foreign labour.Unemployed Brits don’t get maternity pay.That’s if there’s any money left to pay it after supporting all of Merkel’s immigrant invasion when she and Cameron have fast tracked Turkey’s membership.
anon84679660:
No single market access for UK after Brexit, Wolfgang Schauble says:theguardian.com/politics/201 … auble-says
That’s what I’ve always been saying, don’t expect to be treated well when you quit the EU.
Only inside the EU together with other countries we keep germans in check.
If EU disintegrates germans will do what’s best for them only, now they are busy keeping all EU together, so they can not become as powerful as they could be on their own.
The EU will soon be Germany on it’s own. There is a limit to their power - it lacks military content. Germany’s best hope for itself is to become more like Switzerland. It’s military ambitions are prevented by the checks and balances of NATO and foreign-run forces bases continuing to be present.
If we do Brexit, Frexit follows - and then there’s only Germany lending money out to all those basket case economies calling itself the rest of the EU. Soon after, those “loans” will end up being “donations”, and the German banking system collapses, it’s former investors happy that there is now the Der Grosse Insel back in play again - to move their cash to.
Now me… I’d much rather hear Britain being referred to as “The Big Island” rather than bloody “Treasure Island” is it has been these past couple of decades in particular!
If you want in common market you must allow free movement of people.
alicks77:
If you want in common market you must allow free movement of people.
That isn’t what you said.You said ‘if we want to ‘trade’ with Europe we have to allow free movement’ which is plainly total bs.So I’ll ask again exactly what free movement is there between EU and Japan and China.Bearing in mind that it’s Chinese steel imports that are helping to decimate the UK steel industry.Together with net imports of German ‘and’ Japanese manufactured goods decimating its manufacturing industry in general.