Companies running old junk

[switchlogic]

Sumsmeister:

Priest:

IndigoJo:
They should teach you about reversing round a corner and into a parking bay at a service station.

+1

Wish I’d had a bit more manoeuvering in my training - I started my first class one job last week (night-shift) and am with other drivers for a week and a bit so the first reverse in between two parked trailers took me 20 mins (on my own - the driver I was with wanted a coffee) - I got out to look so many times to check I felt like a yoyo. (No room to get the trailer straight, so I had to bend it in and all the drivers think it’s too dark in the storage yard. That’s what I’m telling myself, anyway…). The unloading bays are wider of course, so that only took 8 minutes, bending it in again…
Still, upward and onward.

I concur. My reversing was terrible at first, but I could reverse into a painted box and line a white stick on back of trailer with a line on the road ok!

[bluey_circles]

Sumsmeister:

Priest:

IndigoJo:
They should teach you about reversing round a corner and into a parking bay at a service station.

+1

Wish I’d had a bit more manoeuvering in my training - I started my first class one job last week (night-shift) and am with other drivers for a week and a bit so the first reverse in between two parked trailers took me 20 mins (on my own - the driver I was with wanted a coffee) - I got out to look so many times to check I felt like a yoyo. (No room to get the trailer straight, so I had to bend it in and all the drivers think it’s too dark in the storage yard. That’s what I’m telling myself, anyway…). The unloading bays are wider of course, so that only took 8 minutes, bending it in again…
Still, upward and onward.

what do you mean by “bend it in” ? do you mean go beyond the 90 degrees and sort of jack knife it

[sumsmeister]

Bluey Circles:
what do you mean by “bend it in” ? do you mean go beyond the 90 degrees and sort of jack knife it

In an absolutely ideal universe, you would want to get the unit and trailer in a position where you could simply drive straight backwards into a parking slot, having done the hard(er) work first by lining yourself first. Yeah, that “ideal” word - you’re in the real world now, so you will 90% of the time have some sort of angle between the unit, the trailer and the parking slot, because you probably haven’t physically got the space in front of the slot. Never having done it before, you have no experience to draw on, just what you’ve learnt from asking and watching other drivers, so it’s a case of get on and try it, learning how the trailer moves differently with different angles between the unit and trailer and being aware when you’re off-course and liable to hit something. Hence why I felt like a yoyo, cos I felt I needed to see how close my trailer was to the trailer on my blind-side.

[juddian]

Reversing only comes with practice and it varies between people how quickly they master it, i was lucky because i’d driven large vans and 7.5 tonners for several years before going for me artic ticket, also was into banger racing so did many miles towing before getting a lorry that bent, still was big shock just how long an artic is when i got one mind.

It’s not as easy nowadays, yes you have power steering and vastly better mirrors (especially for keeping an eye of the nearside bumper/step/tank area) but you are saddled generally with automated clutch transmissions of varying levels of (in)competence, these will never be as good as a manual clutch or a proper torque converted clutch as fitted to Terberg Tugmasters and the like for infinitely controllable transmission take up needed for precise maneuvering, Volvo and Scania are streets ahead of arsetronic with its on/off switch clutch engagement, however others say they are now improved, but at the end of the day the automated clutch is always going to be a balancing act comparable with one person operating the throttle and someone else engaging the clutch.
For what its worth i never use the hill hold function either, i’ve known people to rely too much on the thing leading to all sorts of things happening including a runaway, to my thinking only one thing is on control pof that vehicle and thats the bod behind the wheel.

Also something else thats made life far more difficult now, when i started almost all tractor unit were day cabs, with windows all round, these made blind side reverses a doddle, indeed in a good day cab tractor is often easier to blind it in that go in on your own side.

As i always say to new drivers that i speak to who struggle to take advantage of any chances to practice and do it every day at least once or twice, if you are going up the motorway pop into the service area or decent lorry park, select a reverse in where you can’t possibly hit anything if you balls it up and spend 5 minutes reversing in, all angles that is and find which method suits you, if you’re stopping for a break don’t go in the easy drive in/out bays, reverse into one that needs a bit of care.
These are ideal places to practice your blind siders if you select a marked bay where even if you ■■■■■■■■ it right up you can’t do any damage.
Much better to perfect your reverses like this, than when you get to some bloody tight delivery point and have the mother of all awkward spots between two shiny lorries on a blind sider.
Always always get out and have a poke nose, i’d rather (and do sometimes) get out half a dozen times than hit something, nothing clever in being one shunt johnnie who does £20ks worth of damage in his haste to show his hexpertise.

Oh and if you see any blokes near other lorries laughing at you whilst you practice be assured they aint lorry drivers and never will be so long as they have a hole in their arse, any proper lorry driver will give a a metaphorical nod of approval for using you brain.
I still select an offset blind side by choice when i stop for a break in the services, doesn’t matter how long you’ve been doing the job you never know it all and you never stop learning and you have to keep practicing, still shocks me just how bloody big the lorry is when i get back in after a couple weeks off…

[sumsmeister]

Thanks, juddian that’s encouraging and I like the idea of the services park-trial thing. We only go to some hubs and a port, so the majority of reverses for me will be kind of “samey”, so a bit of variety sounds like the way ahead. Down Hanger Lane tonight, so looking forward to that…

[juddian]

Hanger Lane and looking forward in the same sentence■■? are you mad or is there some good totty spotting round there these days…

[bluey_circles]

Sumsmeister:

Bluey Circles:
what do you mean by “bend it in” ? do you mean go beyond the 90 degrees and sort of jack knife it

In an absolutely ideal universe, you would want to get the unit and trailer in a position where you could simply drive straight backwards into a parking slot, having done the hard(er) work first by lining yourself first. Yeah, that “ideal” word - you’re in the real world now, so you will 90% of the time have some sort of angle between the unit, the trailer and the parking slot, because you probably haven’t physically got the space in front of the slot. Never having done it before, you have no experience to draw on, just what you’ve learnt from asking and watching other drivers, so it’s a case of get on and try it, learning how the trailer moves differently with different angles between the unit and trailer and being aware when you’re off-course and liable to hit something. Hence why I felt like a yoyo, cos I felt I needed to see how close my trailer was to the trailer on my blind-side.

OK I understand what you are saying now, I wasn’t sure if by “bending it” you meant (what I used to call) “Jacknifing it” I think as Judian says the more practice is you get the better and considering the vast amount of damage you could easily do the more careful you atre the better.
I was lucky in that I used to work on farms quite a bit so reversing with trailers was something I learned when I was quite young. Although the biggest mess I got myself into with reversing was; working on a farm towing a semi trailer mounted on a dolly and all pulled with a drawbar, I sort of got the hang of it, but it must have completely fried my brain as I then found I was incapable of reversing anything LOL

[sumsmeister]

Juddian:
Hanger Lane and looking forward in the same sentence■■? are you mad or is there some good totty spotting round there these days…

I wasn’t being carsastic at all…
I’ll let the other driver drive up there, so I’ll have a good example, er an example to follow on the way back
Totty, eh? Guess the eyes in the back of my head will come in useful tonight…

[sumsmeister]

Bluey Circles:
Although the biggest mess I got myself into with reversing was; working on a farm towing a semi trailer mounted on a dolly and all pulled with a drawbar, I sort of got the hang of it, but it must have completely fried my brain as I then found I was incapable of reversing anything LOL

I used to tow a tri-axle, 7.5metre, 3.5 ton trailer around the UK and on a couple of occasions over to Holland with a Land-Cruiser and that could be fun. We also had an 8.5metre drawbar two-axle horror as well… Trying to push the thing up a hill was fraught with peril, as the bloody things draw-bar was very short so it was easy to lose the thing and have smash the front of the vehicle you were using. I fitted a front tow-bar, but I remember going into a Truck-stop to check out the possibility of keeping a trailer in there semi-permanently. I thought I’d try reversing the thing into a parking slot and it took me 5 mins. Popeye forearms were the result, but it would have taken just as long to unhitch, rehitch etc… At least, that’s what I told my gullible self.

[carryfast]

Sumsmeister:
We also had an 8.5metre drawbar two-axle horror as well… Trying to push the thing up a hill was fraught with peril, as the bloody things draw-bar was very short so it was easy to lose the thing and have smash the front of the vehicle you were using. I fitted a front tow-bar, but I remember going into a Truck-stop to check out the possibility of keeping a trailer in there semi-permanently. I thought I’d try reversing the thing into a parking slot and it took me 5 mins.

youtube.com/watch?v=k9G2XYNsuEo

[newmercman]

That Van der Wal truck is going to be a lot easier to reverse than a traditional A frame wagon and drag, first it has a full length trailer and a triaxle at that, then a tandem dolly at the front, a nice long A frame, all of which slows down the rate at which it gets out of shape and the prime mover was empty allowing the tag to lift giving more tail swing.

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk

[sumsmeister]

CF, I think he’s done that more than once…! Good work. Thing to realise, as I did eventually, the position of the end of the hitch relative to the front of the box is what you should focus on. Longer drawbar is a God-send, gives you more control. I’d need (and do need!) lots of practice.

[robroy]

newmercman:
That Van der Wal truck is going to be a lot easier to reverse than a traditional

If I’m learning to reverse, …yeh maybe, it’s gonna be the one that saves me, cos after all, it’s a Van der Wal.

[newmercman]

robroy:

newmercman:
That Van der Wal truck is going to be a lot easier to reverse than a traditional

If I’m learning to reverse, …yeh maybe, it’s gonna be the one that saves me, cos after all, it’s a Van der Wal.

[emoji1] [emoji1] [emoji1]

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk

[robroy]

Thank you very much…I’m here all week.

[carryfast]

newmercman:
That Van der Wal truck is going to be a lot easier to reverse than a traditional A frame wagon and drag, first it has a full length trailer and a triaxle at that, then a tandem dolly at the front, a nice long A frame, all of which slows down the rate at which it gets out of shape and the prime mover was empty allowing the tag to lift giving more tail swing.

It’s a contradiction but it’s spot on in that the extra lengths all actually make it easier.That design seems to be about as good as it gets in creating the best combination of payload and manouverability.

On that note a tight L shaped turn,to put a standard trailer under a demount box is probably more of a challenge in the real world.Ironically I always kept the tag down on the standard 3 + 2 outfit for that reason.In that it acts as a brake in slowing down the rate of swing at the bar and thereby the rate at which the shorter trailer turns.While if we’re eventually going to get the change to LHV’s in the longer term Brit C + E training is probably going to put Brit drivers at a disadvantage v their German counterparts in that regard.In that close coupled outfits don’t prepare them for neither artics or drawbars.

youtube.com/watch?v=ebz9Z3EMWLM

[terry_t]

IndigoJo:
Anyway, I got it out to Gloucester, swapped over with the full trailer, then started back and about a quarter of the way up Birdlip Hill it overheated, and it put a “STOP” warning up on the dashboard, so I pulled over and put my hazards on

Absolute rookie mistake here mate. What you should’ve done was go up and down Birdlip until the engine exploded. Then they’ll have to give you a better truck

[bald]

Carryfast:

newmercman:
That Van der Wal truck is going to be a lot easier to reverse than a traditional A frame wagon and drag, first it has a full length trailer and a triaxle at that, then a tandem dolly at the front, a nice long A frame, all of which slows down the rate at which it gets out of shape and the prime mover was empty allowing the tag to lift giving more tail swing.

It’s a contradiction but it’s spot on in that the extra lengths all actually make it easier.That design seems to be about as good as it gets in creating the best combination of payload and manouverability.

On that note a tight L shaped turn,to put a standard trailer under a demount box is probably more of a challenge in the real world.Ironically I always kept the tag down on the standard 3 + 2 outfit for that reason.In that it acts as a brake in slowing down the rate of swing at the bar and thereby the rate at which the shorter trailer turns.While if we’re eventually going to get the change to LHV’s in the longer term Brit C + E training is probably going to put Brit drivers at a disadvantage v their German counterparts in that regard.In that close coupled outfits don’t prepare them for neither artics or drawbars.

youtube.com/watch?v=ebz9Z3EMWLM

A close coupled outfit , reverses just the same as an artic, so where is the disadvantage ?
The a frames are a bit harder to reverse.
The Dutch and their LZV have normal a -frame drawbars, only a bit longer as a normal one, as the Van der Wal truck,
but the fun starts with these:
youtube.com/watch?v=kRM2fnU7EvA
or these:
youtube.com/watch?v=hvO3DVP8KDc

In Germany they started as well with the LZV, altough they are still limited to 40 tons on 8 axels,
youtube.com/watch?v=dxvmQKEkeYI
While the Dutch and Scandinavians go for far higher gross weights.

[carryfast]

bald:
A close coupled outfit , reverses just the same as an artic, so where is the disadvantage ?
The a frames are a bit harder to reverse.
The Dutch and their LZV have normal a -frame drawbars, only a bit longer as a normal one, as the Van der Wal truck,
but the fun starts with these:
youtube.com/watch?v=kRM2fnU7EvA
or these:
youtube.com/watch?v=hvO3DVP8KDc

In Germany they started as well with the LZV, altough they are still limited to 40 tons on 8 axels,
youtube.com/watch?v=dxvmQKEkeYI
While the Dutch and Scandinavians go for far higher gross weights.

The close coupled outfit is the worst of all worlds to instruct new drivers because it doesn’t have either the extra complication of A frames,which will obviously be essential if we eventually do join the LHV programme, when reversing.Nor the characteristics of artics going forward at least.With C + E providing the possibility now,which class 1 should arguably always have been,along the lines of if someone can reverse a standard A frame outfit they can probably reverse anything and artics are just then a case of allowing for the differences in cut in characteristics.Which I’d guess is the logical idea which the C + E category was/is actually taken for granted as being,in terms of the training regime,at least in Germany etc.With the difference in that C + E training regime being obvious in examples like these as opposed to here.In which Brit new drivers are being let down by that regime v their German counterparts.

youtube.com/watch?v=0ReE4M2FHfM

youtube.com/watch?v=vbbGexPL3sI

As for Germany staying with 40 t gross on an 8 axle LHV I didn’t know that. Unless that’s maybe only for road trials unless/until they finally adopt them.

[the-snowman]

robroy:

newmercman:
That Van der Wal truck is going to be a lot easier to reverse than a traditional

If I’m learning to reverse, …yeh maybe, it’s gonna be the one that saves me, cos after all, it’s a Van der Wal.

Groan
Right thats it Rob, sin bin for you