Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.
It’s understandable in the case of anyone who doesn’t recognise the idea of National borders and National government v the Supra National Collective.
hi orys, before i make a response are you now a british citizen…?
blue estate:
Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.May be it’s the fact the EU gravy train is starting to squeal to a halt
A 2,000 page surrender document ( Lisbon Treaty in all but name ) says that the gravy train isn’t squealing to a halt any time soon from our point of view.
It’s the same type of sell out as when Heath took us into it and Major signed us up to Maastricht.
Here’s a clue phone Paccar head office on Monday morning and ask them if you can order an 18 speed Fuller with the MX in a new XF or even legally retro fit one in an older one.Or import a batch of Australian made KW’s and if not why not.The answer will say everything about Bozo’s bs ‘deal’.
Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.
In fairness, this is true.
I have been to Poland dozens, possibly up to a hundred times. Adding it all together a few days at a time I’ve probably spent several months there.
Poland is a lovely country and to be honest I could live there. However, if I did I would always regard myself as a guest and would not presume to tell the Polish people what their position should be on abortion, for example (this is currently a “hot topic” in Poland.
blue estate:
Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.May be it’s the fact the EU gravy train is starting to squeal to a halt
Sent from my truck
Well yes there is now a rather large hole in the EU finances that needs to be filled. They can either ask the likes of Poland to pay more or simply return them less money.
Alternativly they could bully Greece into paying more! 
Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.
Is it fascinating to you that people want to learn and understand?
blue estate:
May be it’s the fact the EU gravy train is starting to squeal to a halt
Nah, not really. Especially that it won’t change that much for Poland, as this is what I think you mean. We had our ride, it was nice that EU helped us up when we needed a hand, now there are people in more need - Bulgaria, Rumunia, but also Portugal for example, we overtook them in many aspects. We knew that this day will come and we’re not surprised. Ask yourself: would you rather be a beggar, living off the handouts of the richer people? Or would you rather be rich enough yourself to be able to help others?
Carryfast:
It’s understandable in the case of anyone who doesn’t recognise the idea of National borders and National government v the Supra National Collective.
Hi Carryfast, nice to see you after all those years, please DON’T MENTION THE WAR! 
m.a.n rules:
hi orys, before i make a response are you now a british citizen…?
Can’t see how that’s relevant? I am not telling you what you should decide. I am just trying to learn why it is you decided what you decided and see if you’re happy with that, and why. I still have my EU citizenship, so I am not even that much affected myself… I am actually the one here, who will eath cookie either way: if Britain goes through the roof, then I am already here, ready to enjoy benefits of Brexit. If it won’t, I still have 27 other countries to choose from.
It’s pure curiosity on my part.
Harry Monk:
Poland is a lovely country and to be honest I could live there. However, if I did I would always regard myself as a guest and would not presume to tell the Polish people what their position should be on abortion, for example (this is currently a “hot topic” in Poland.
But I guess, you could have your view on abortion yourself. You could even share it with them if they asked. And then sit with your friends and say to them “well, it’s their country, it’s their decission, but I don’t understand why they decided like that, perhaps I would try to ask them why?” and then go, and ask them “If you don’t mind me asking, tell me: why did you decided like that? What were your reasons? What are benefits of that decission, you think? Are you happy that you decided that way? Can you help me understand?”
Would that be wrong thing to do? Or is it acceptable?
msgyorkie:
Well yes there is now a rather large hole in the EU finances that needs to be filled.
I don’t want to go too much into discussion, but it is not that big as you think. First, you have remember that of all the money Brtiain was paying in, some not-unsignificant-money were coming back here - to Wales, Cornwall, Scotland, farmers… That won’t be happening either. So the EU does not looses ALL of money BRtiain was paying in. The shortage will be all that Britain was paying in MINUS what will still have to pay for the access to various EU services it opted in MINUS what was paid back to Brtiain.
Secondly, all those Eastern European countries, perhaps apart fom Bulgaria and Romania, obviously, are doing much better nowadays. They dont’ need that much help as they needed those 15 years ago, and they are able to pay much more into the jar than they were 15 years ago. So, while it will be a throwback, it won’t be that bad. Some estimates say EU will be able to spent as much as 10 years ago. It wasn’t exactly poor 10 years ago, and it won’t have to spent that much on infrastructural funds for the new members as it had to 10 years ago… So if you hope to see the EU going bankrupt because of lack of British money, I would not hold my breath if I was you…
Stanley Johnson has applied for a French passport, will that mean he can travel throughout Europe freely?
orys:
I don’t want to go too much into discussion, but it is not that big as you think. First, you have remember that of all the money Brtiain was paying in, some not-unsignificant-money were coming back here - to Wales, Cornwall, Scotland, farmers… That won’t be happening either. So the EU does not looses ALL of money BRtiain was paying in. The shortage will be all that Britain was paying in MINUS what will still have to pay for the access to various EU services it opted in MINUS what was paid back to Brtiain.Secondly, all those Eastern European countries, perhaps apart fom Bulgaria and Romania, obviously, are doing much better nowadays. They dont’ need that much help as they needed those 15 years ago, and they are able to pay much more into the jar than they were 15 years ago. So, while it will be a throwback, it won’t be that bad. Some estimates say EU will be able to spent as much as 10 years ago. It wasn’t exactly poor 10 years ago, and it won’t have to spent that much on infrastructural funds for the new members as it had to 10 years ago… So if you hope to see the EU going bankrupt because of lack of British money, I would not hold my breath if I was you…
I have never said that the EU wil become bankrupt but rather that there is now an 8 Billion Euros per YEAR missing from the budget. This is NET or in other words with all the rebates and agriculture subsidies already deducted. Our bill per year was 18 Billion Euros then we had Maggies rebate and all the subsidies and infrastructure subsidies leaving a final bill of 8 Billion euro per year.
So going forward we have a free trade agreement and we also get to keep the 8 billion per year…or in Boris language…having our cake and eating it.
Now this 8 billion per year has to be filled somehow. Poland has been sucking on the teat for a long time and I cannot see your political masters gladly accepting a reduction of monies paid to them.
msgyorkie:
orys:
I don’t want to go too much into discussion, but it is not that big as you think. First, you have remember that of all the money Brtiain was paying in, some not-unsignificant-money were coming back here - to Wales, Cornwall, Scotland, farmers… That won’t be happening either. So the EU does not looses ALL of money BRtiain was paying in. The shortage will be all that Britain was paying in MINUS what will still have to pay for the access to various EU services it opted in MINUS what was paid back to Brtiain.Secondly, all those Eastern European countries, perhaps apart fom Bulgaria and Romania, obviously, are doing much better nowadays. They dont’ need that much help as they needed those 15 years ago, and they are able to pay much more into the jar than they were 15 years ago. So, while it will be a throwback, it won’t be that bad. Some estimates say EU will be able to spent as much as 10 years ago. It wasn’t exactly poor 10 years ago, and it won’t have to spent that much on infrastructural funds for the new members as it had to 10 years ago… So if you hope to see the EU going bankrupt because of lack of British money, I would not hold my breath if I was you…
I have never said that the EU wil become bankrupt but rather that there is now an 8 Billion Euros per YEAR missing from the budget. This is NET or in other words with all the rebates and agriculture subsidies already deducted. Our bill per year was 18 Billion Euros then we had Maggies rebate and all the subsidies and infrastructure subsidies leaving a final bill of 8 Billion euro per year.
So going forward we have a free trade agreement and we also get to keep the 8 billion per year…or in Boris language…having our cake and eating it.
Now this 8 billion per year has to be filled somehow. Poland has been sucking on the teat for a long time and I cannot see your political masters gladly accepting a reduction of monies paid to them.
HMRC say £7.5billion every year in extra red tape.
independent.co.uk/news/uk/p … 67557.html
£500m per annum then?
Brexit has already cost the UK £130 billion in lost growth since 2016, research by Bloomberg found.
Brexit is on course to cost the UK more than its combined total of payments to the European Union budget over the past 47 years, Bloomberg Economics found.
Bloomberg said the cost of the UK’s vote to leave the EU had already reached £130 billion.
A further £70 billion is likely to be added by the end of 2020, the economist Dan Hanson found.
Business confidence and investment in the UK has dipped significantly since the 2016 vote.
Now, FullFact examined Bloomberg`s claims, and found them a bit over the top, then.
fullfact.org/europe/online-cost … ributions/
But although the exact amount is unsure surely an estimate of £100bn is reasonable?
That half a billion “extra cake” has been lost 200 times over already.
msgyorkie:
Darkside:
Even supposedly unbiased news sources like the BBC have been so pro Brexit, and pro Government over the years.Look at the amount of time they give Farage when he couldn’t even make it as an MP in seven attempts, most appearances on QT I think.
Now you are having a laugh. The BBC was ridiculously pro Remain. Civitas: Institute for the Study of Civil Society Pro-Brexit voices drowned out in BBC news programmes, new analysis shows
And regarding Farage having airtime, well he was an MEP for UKIP as well as their leader.
Are you saying that the BBC should not have given the leader of a major political party airtime?
That link is interesting, but makes a poor case for BBC bias.
“For instance, of 4,275 guests talking about the EU on BBC Radio 4’s flagship Today programme between 2005 and 2015, only 132 (3.2 per cent) were supporters of the UK’s withdrawal from the EU.”
So what? 4,000 doctors say being overweight is bad for you, should you look for 4,000 Docs who say it is good for you?
“In 274 hours of monitored BBC EU coverage between 2002 and 2017, only 14 speakers (0.2 per cent of the total) were left-wing advocates for leaving the EU”
So, how many were right wing advocates for Brexit? This looks likesub dividing figures to get a result: cherry picking.
“There has been a determined reluctance to even probe the question as to whether Britain should leave the EU. Between 2005 and 2011, when UKIP had 12 seats in the European Parliament,only 20 questions about actually leaving the EU were posed in 1,073 surveyed editions of Today. So there was an average of one question on withdrawal for every 54 editions, or for every 153 programme hours”
2005 to 2011 Brexit wasn`t much reported on the BBC, but neither was it much reported elsewhere, was it? It was a minority interest. Other stuff was considered more relevant then in all spheres of the media.
“The bias has continued after the vote for Brexit. A month of the Today Programme in October and November 2017 carried 97 interviews on EU topics, but only nine were with long term supporters of Brexit.”
One month cherry picked to show alleged bias, and that is again narrowed down to “long term supporters”.
blue estate:
Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.May be it’s the fact the EU gravy train is starting to squeal to a halt
Sent from my truck
I do recognize the trigger phrase “gravy train” as I often the phrase “corrupt EU officials” too.
Would you care to give some sort of evidence for such?
Now, I do expect some cases of malfeasance to come to light, but are you saying that the EU, it`s officials and elected representatives are more corrupt than other officials and and representatives?
Are you saying that the UK MPs are much less corrupt than EU ones?
What do YOU mean by gravy train?
Franglais:
Brexit has already cost the UK £130 billion in lost growth since 2016, research by Bloomberg found.
Brexit is on course to cost the UK more than its combined total of payments to the European Union budget over the past 47 years, Bloomberg Economics found.
Bloomberg said the cost of the UK’s vote to leave the EU had already reached £130 billion.
That’ll be the Bloomberg founded by Michael Bloomberg, a man with a personal wealth exceeding $60 billion then?
Yes, I’m sure he has your best interests at heart.
Harry Monk:
Franglais:
Brexit has already cost the UK £130 billion in lost growth since 2016, research by Bloomberg found.
Brexit is on course to cost the UK more than its combined total of payments to the European Union budget over the past 47 years, Bloomberg Economics found.
Bloomberg said the cost of the UK’s vote to leave the EU had already reached £130 billion.That’ll be the Bloomberg founded by Michael Bloomberg, a man with a personal wealth exceeding $60 billion then?
Yes, I’m sure he has your best interests at heart.
If you are shown that two and two equals four.
If you are shown that two and two equals four yesterday and tomorrow, do you accept that two and two equals four?
Or do you wonder about whether the person telling you this has ulterior motives?
Many people do have hidden agendas, but if two and two make four, then that is true for everyone.
Now, leaving all of that aside for a minute, I included a link where the Bloomberg article has been analysed by FullFact, and in my own guesstimates I significantly reduced the quoted figures.
So, what is the relevance of Bloomberg`s owner? The figures have been examined by others independently.
The 130 billion lost is due to the dragging out the leaving by pro remain forces in government and the judiciary. Had we have left the day after the referendum that figure would have been a lot less.
Now however we have the future to look ahead and if covid is beaten then the future is looking healthy for UK plc.
msgyorkie:
The 130 billion lost is due to the dragging out the leaving by pro remain forces in government and the judiciary. Had we have left the day after the referendum that figure would have been a lot less.
Now however we have the future to look ahead and if covid is beaten then the future is looking healthy for UK plc.
Did you follow the link to FullFact which analyses the Bloombrg claim?
Why do you assert that £130bn is due to “pro remain forces”? Anything to back that up please?
You blame the judiciary for some of that expense?
Would you recommend living in a society where the government of the day is not subject to the rule of law?
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
The 130 billion lost is due to the dragging out the leaving by pro remain forces in government and the judiciary. Had we have left the day after the referendum that figure would have been a lot less.
Now however we have the future to look ahead and if covid is beaten then the future is looking healthy for UK plc.Did you follow the link to FullFact which analyses the Bloombrg claim?
Why do you assert that £130bn is due to “pro remain forces”? Anything to back that up please?You blame the judiciary for some of that expense?
Would you recommend living in a society where the government of the day is not subject to the rule of law?
Don’t we already?
the nodding donkey:
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
The 130 billion lost is due to the dragging out the leaving by pro remain forces in government and the judiciary. Had we have left the day after the referendum that figure would have been a lot less.
Now however we have the future to look ahead and if covid is beaten then the future is looking healthy for UK plc.Did you follow the link to FullFact which analyses the Bloombrg claim?
Why do you assert that £130bn is due to “pro remain forces”? Anything to back that up please?You blame the judiciary for some of that expense?
Would you recommend living in a society where the government of the day is not subject to the rule of law?Don’t we already?
Oh good, another Brexit bonus
Yes minister…
GasGas:
Oh good, another Brexit bonus
Remember too, that you can`t bring too much back on your hols either.
£390 per trip as I understand it. That is enough to buy my clothes for two years, or SWMBO for two weeks.
gov.uk/government/news/duty … nuary-2021