Odd days:
Not interested in what anybody else wants, just what was in it for me.
So what’s in it for you that’s better compared to what you had as EU citizen?
orys:
Odd days:
Not interested in what anybody else wants, just what was in it for me.So what’s in it for you that’s better compared to what you had as EU citizen?
The Poles and Lithuanians already started moaning about the downward pressure on their wages when Romania and Bulgaria were admitted to the eu, God alone how they will cope when the likes of Albania, Ukraine, Uzbekistan etc are invited to the party to start competing with their pay level. 
Harry Monk:
orys:
Odd days:
Not interested in what anybody else wants, just what was in it for me.So what’s in it for you that’s better compared to what you had as EU citizen?
The Poles and Lithuanians already started moaning about the downward pressure on their wages when Romania and Bulgaria were admitted to the eu, God alone how they will cope when the likes of Albania, Ukraine, Uzbekistan etc are invited to the party to start competing with their pay level.
Are you actually saying “Benefit of Brexit is that Poles are moaning about something Brexit had nothing to do with?” 
> Harry Monk:
> The Poles and Lithuanians already started moaning about the downward pressure on their wages when Romania and Bulgaria were admitted to the eu, God alone how they will cope when the likes of Albania, Ukraine, Uzbekistan etc are invited to the party to start competing with their pay level.
Or us - or what’s left of the UK applies to rejoin, I hope we are not the sick man of Europe again
like we were when we joined 1st time - and when it saved us & put us back on track.
Operation Fear looks like moving into top gear of Operation reality in a few days.
Us Re-joiners are hoping we were wrong all along & you were right - unfortunately, I’m not confident enough to put any money on it
orys:
Harry Monk:
orys:
Odd days:
Not interested in what anybody else wants, just what was in it for me.So what’s in it for you that’s better compared to what you had as EU citizen?
The Poles and Lithuanians already started moaning about the downward pressure on their wages when Romania and Bulgaria were admitted to the eu, God alone how they will cope when the likes of Albania, Ukraine, Uzbekistan etc are invited to the party to start competing with their pay level.
Are you actually saying “Benefit of Brexit is that Poles are moaning about something Brexit had nothing to do with?”
No, just that our 15 years of wage stagnation in the transport industry may possibly not be further extended by the admission of such even poorer countries into the eu.
On a wider political level, if the eu does continue its eastward expansion I can see this ultimately leading to hostilities with Russia. The reason Russia annexed eastern Ukraine was to forestall any eu attempt to woo Ukraine which would result in a major loss of access to the Black Sea ports for Russia. Having already lost control of the Baltic States I think this might have been a step too far for them.
orys:
Odd days:
Not interested in what anybody else wants, just what was in it for me.So what’s in it for you that’s better compared to what you had as EU citizen?
Just as I thought you can not tell me anything that is better for me to remain. I rest my case.
Odd days:
Just as I thought you can not tell me anything that is better for me to remain. I rest my case.
Your case of what?
I asked what the benefits are. I never said I came here to convince you otherwise. Just wanted to hear about the benefits. Are you basically saying “Brexit is beneficial for me, because nobody is able (or can be arsed) to show me counterarguments”?
I have thought of one. If we had stayed we would not of had a sweaty going on asking on a New Year’s Eve what’s the benefit of leaving. We like to keep you occupied. Haha
Odd days:
I have thought of one. If we had stayed we would not of had a sweaty going on asking on a New Year’s Eve what’s the benefit of leaving. We like to keep you occupied. Haha
Ok, attempt to turn the question around, then personal attack.
I take it as a “no, I can’t think of any real benefit” then. 
(also, I asked yesterday )
orys:
If you would like to work there, move, or study, it might not be so easy though. You never wanted to, perhaps, but some might do.
And they still can if they want too
The-Snowman:
orys:
If you would like to work there, move, or study, it might not be so easy though. You never wanted to, perhaps, but some might do.And they still can if they want too
Yes, but it’s much more difficult. I know, I remember how difficult it was to move to the EU before you were a citizen. One of my best friends is Croatian, all the hoops she had to jump through to keep her job at the university in Britain was someting unreal.
But anyway, I don’t really want to discuss. I just want to hear, if anyone can name some benefits, so, I can say “Oh, I can see now, this indeed can be viewed as a benefit”.
orys:
Odd days:
I have thought of one. If we had stayed we would not of had a sweaty going on asking on a New Year’s Eve what’s the benefit of leaving. We like to keep you occupied. HahaOk, attempt to turn the question around, then personal attack.
I take it as a “no, I can’t think of any real benefit” then.
(also, I asked yesterday
You take that as an attack, blimey.
After all these years there has been nothing in it for me, so do I keep doing it just to keep people happy or throw the dice and do something different as I have nothing to loose, as nobody has told me of the benefit of staying. As far as I was aware the vote was a free choice.
orys:
Odd days:
Just as I thought you can not tell me anything that is better for me to remain. I rest my case.Your case of what?
I asked what the benefits are. I never said I came here to convince you otherwise. Just wanted to hear about the benefits. Are you basically saying “Brexit is beneficial for me, because nobody is able (or can be arsed) to show me counterarguments”?
From my point of view the ONLY benefit I was interested in was reclaiming the right to self determination, the right to determine what is best for British interests, not the interests of the collective.
I find it curious that someone who was once enslaved with the yoke of communism is so eager to embrace the yoke of EU federalism.
I don’t know your age Orys, I suspect that perhaps you were born after the wall fell, but I’m pretty sure that many of your older generation are dismayed that you’ve transitioned from one form of servitude to another.
the maoster:
From my point of view the ONLY benefit I was interested in was reclaiming the right to self determination, the right to determine what is best for British interests, not the interests of the collective.
Ok, thank you. Still not really a practical benefit I was looking for, but I can see how that can be a reason.
I find it curious that someone who was once enslaved with the yoke of communism is so eager to embrace the yoke of EU federalism.
I don’t know your age Orys, I suspect that perhaps you were born after the wall fell, but I’m pretty sure that many of your older generation are dismayed that you’ve transitioned from one form of servitude to another.
Well, I was still a kid when communism fell, but I remember quite a lot of it. My very first memory is visiting my father in jail - he was an underground journalist of the samizdat paper during the Martial Law in Poland and he was caught. I would guess I know much more about it than you (also, thanks to my education, probably, as I did a degree in Central and Eastern Europe, my dissertation was on 1980’s Poland). So you can say, I remember all three: being a member of a soviet bloc, being a “sovereign country”, and being a member of the EU. All of those in recent decades, not half of century ago, when everything was different.
To satisfy your curiosity, let me quote my father, who said once “I can see only two situations when someone can compare EU with Soviet Bloc: he either never lived in the latter, or he’s a total idiot”. In other words: you might argue if EU is good or bad, you might decide that you don’t want to be part of it - like Britain did. We can disagree if Britain’s move was wise or not. But the very fact, that you can leave EU if you don’t like it should give you a hint that perhaps comparing it to being a part of Comecon and Soviet Bloc might not be the best thing to do.
Ahh, so you’re an EE not a sweaty so thought that was an attack. Haha
orys:
the maoster:
From my point of view the ONLY benefit I was interested in was reclaiming the right to self determination, the right to determine what is best for British interests, not the interests of the collective.Ok, thank you. Still not really a practical benefit I was looking for, but I can see how that can be a reason.
I find it curious that someone who was once enslaved with the yoke of communism is so eager to embrace the yoke of EU federalism.
I don’t know your age Orys, I suspect that perhaps you were born after the wall fell, but I’m pretty sure that many of your older generation are dismayed that you’ve transitioned from one form of servitude to another.Well, I was still a kid when communism fell, but I remember quite a lot of it. My very first memory is visiting my father in jail - he was an underground journalist of the samizdat paper during the Martial Law in Poland and he was caught. I would guess I know much more about it than you (also, thanks to my education, probably, as I did a degree in Central and Eastern Europe, my dissertation was on 1980’s Poland). So you can say, I remember all three: being a member of a soviet bloc, being a “sovereign country”, and being a member of the EU. All of those in recent decades, not half of century ago, when everything was different.
To satisfy your curiosity, let me quote my father, who said once “I can see only two situations when someone can compare EU with Soviet Bloc: he either never lived in the latter, or he’s a total idiot”. In other words: you might argue if EU is good or bad, you might decide that you don’t want to be part of it - like Britain did. We can disagree if Britain’s move was wise or not. But the very fact, that you can leave EU if you don’t like it should give you a hint that perhaps comparing it to being a part of Comecon and Soviet Bloc might not be the best thing to do.
Well of course a Pole will see the benefit of being in the EU when Poland has had far more money spent on its infrastructure than it has ever paid into. EU budget: Who pays most in and who gets most back? - BBC News In fact it was the biggest receiver of monies in the EU in 2019 so yes you would be an idiot to want to leave. Turkeys voting for christmas really. When the like of Albania and Turkey join then maybe Poland will be a net contibutor to the great socialist dream. Then see how bitter you will all become.
Odd days:
You take that as an attack, blimey.
Well, yes, if you take at my person instead of discussing, then it’s an attack. Even if you got me wrong.
After all these years there has been nothing in it for me, so do I keep doing it just to keep people happy or throw the dice and do something different as I have nothing to loose, as nobody has told me of the benefit of staying. As far as I was aware the vote was a free choice.
I never said it was not a free choice, I don’t want to judge you - you have full right to decide. I am not even that bothered with the effects - if Brexit turns out brilliant, then I am here, with settled status, I will benefit from it as well. If Brexit turns out to be a disaster, unlike you I am still free to move whenever I want in the EU.
So your reason is “I never saw any benefits from being in the EU, so I wanted to try if we will be better out of it”, can I put it like that?
msgyorkie:
Well of course a Pole will see the benefit of being in the EU when Poland has had far more money spent on its infrastructure than it has ever paid into. EU budget: Who pays most in and who gets most back? - BBC News In fact it was the biggest receiver of monies in the EU in 2019 so yes you would be an idiot to want to leave. Turkeys voting for christmas really. When the like of Albania and Turkey join then maybe Poland will be a net contibutor to the great socialist dream. Then see how bitter you will all become.
No, not really. For my father - and many other Europeans, not only in former Eastern Bloc countries - EU is not (or: not only) about money. This is what our radical right says “yeah, milk EU while we can, then leave it before they ask US to pay back”, but most people see EU as a community of values etc. not as the milking cow. Many people see “socialism”, think “soviet union” and associate this word with something bad. But Soviet Bloc was as socialist, as Democratic Republic of North Korea is democratic. If you think socialism, don’t think Lenin and guns of Aurora. Think Robert Owen and New Lanark mills. If you think socialist countries, don’t think “Soviet Russia” or “North Korea”. Think Finland, or Denmark.
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.
Odd days:
It’s quite fascinating someone comes from another country to Britain and is even concerned about the brexit vote. Strange.
May be it’s the fact the EU gravy train is starting to squeal to a halt
Sent from my truck