Franglais:
.
Edit to add.
C.F. where I’ve worked we don’t get told to ‘park up early’ or whatever. We aren’t given start times. We’re given a job, that may have timed drops on it. We then decide how to do it.
Some prefer late start / late finish; some prefer early start / early finish.
Those who want a very late start and a very early finish don’t get a Christmas card from the boss!
Ok call it start time or drop/collection time.Let’s say a last drop time for 15.00-16.00 and no other job can be found until a first collection for let’s say 14.00-15.00 next day.It’s neither customer’s problem.While even if you want to make it so then which one are you going to hit with the driver’s waiting time bill and what if that customer says no way he isn’t paying for a driver’s wages to go nowhere.Just as the customer doesn’t pay anything it’s his or part of a load that just happens to get caught out for a night out with a driver out of hours.
albion:
Dunno Carry, I was just pointing out what we did. Our customer never said no thanks.
Same happened with my previous two employers. Paid (a day rate) from leaving depot until return.
Current employer we rarely sit for long, but since we’re salaried we don’t loose out if we have to wait.
.
Book it as rest (which it is) rather than duty or poa and it makes life easier.
No counting up odd minutes or quibbling about coffee breaks.
I trust my boss to pay me.
He trusts me not to skive off.
May not work at big outfits, but it should at smaller ones.
.
Edit to add.
C.F. where I’ve worked we don’t get told to ‘park up early’ or whatever. We aren’t given start times. We’re given a job, that may have timed drops on it. We then decide how to do it.
Some prefer late start / late finish; some prefer early start / early finish.
Those who want a very late start and a very early finish don’t get a Christmas card from the boss!
Don’t bother with him, he hasn’t got a clue what he’s talking about. Really, he just copy/pastes the same irrelevant drivel over and over again.
I agree with your comment though, I work for a company where we ( well, me at least ) are given a job, and if relevant, a booking time. The rest is up to me. It suits me, because I prefer a later start, and like to run into the evening before parking up. The old “park up outside the gates ready for the morning” thing. If you know what I mean…
Franglais:
C.F. where I’ve worked we don’t get told to ‘park up early’ or whatever. We aren’t given start times. We’re given a job, that may have timed drops on it. We then decide how to do it.
Some prefer late start / late finish; some prefer early start / early finish.
Those who want a very late start and a very early finish don’t get a Christmas card from the boss!
Don’t bother with him, he hasn’t got a clue what he’s talking about. Really, he just copy/pastes the same irrelevant drivel over and over again.
I agree with your comment though, I work for a company where we ( well, me at least ) are given a job, and if relevant, a booking time. The rest is up to me. It suits me, because I prefer a later start, and like to run into the evening before parking up. The old “park up outside the gates ready for the morning” thing. If you know what I mean…
Let me guess you also throw your toys out of the pram if you don’t get paid from parking up for the night to driving through the gates in the morning.While how can you guarantee a late start when you’ve said that your start time is governed by the time booked for the first drop of the day which in most cases is the customer’s call not yours.
albion:
Dunno Carry, I was just pointing out what we did. Our customer never said no thanks.
Same happened with my previous two employers. Paid (a day rate) from leaving depot until return.
Current employer we rarely sit for long, but since we’re salaried we don’t loose out if we have to wait.
.
Book it as rest (which it is) rather than duty or poa and it makes life easier.
No counting up odd minutes or quibbling about coffee breaks.
I trust my boss to pay me.
He trusts me not to skive off.
May not work at big outfits, but it should at smaller ones.
.
Edit to add.
C.F. where I’ve worked we don’t get told to ‘park up early’ or whatever. We aren’t given start times. We’re given a job, that may have timed drops on it. We then decide how to do it.
Some prefer late start / late finish; some prefer early start / early finish.
Those who want a very late start and a very early finish don’t get a Christmas card from the boss!
Don’t bother with him, he hasn’t got a clue what he’s talking about. Really, he just copy/pastes the same irrelevant drivel over and over again.
I agree with your comment though, I work for a company where we ( well, me at least ) are given a job, and if relevant, a booking time. The rest is up to me. It suits me, because I prefer a later start, and like to run into the evening before parking up. The old “park up outside the gates ready for the morning” thing. If you know what I mean…
(The OP has had a good set of replies, mostly in agreement, so a wee diversion here won’t do much harm?)
You are right N.D. but I wonder about any newbies coming upon threads such as this? If a point is made that isn’t answered, although the majority of us here, may see why it may not be valid, a newbie may not?
Someone skimreading and just reading the last posts may believe an “unanswerable” point has been made.
That’s why I do tend to go on a bit too much sometimes*.
.
.
I say ‘sometimes’, others may hold other views.
[emoji53]
Franglais:
C.F. where I’ve worked we don’t get told to ‘park up early’ or whatever. We aren’t given start times. We’re given a job, that may have timed drops on it. We then decide how to do it.
Some prefer late start / late finish; some prefer early start / early finish.
Those who want a very late start and a very early finish don’t get a Christmas card from the boss!
Don’t bother with him, he hasn’t got a clue what he’s talking about. Really, he just copy/pastes the same irrelevant drivel over and over again.
I agree with your comment though, I work for a company where we ( well, me at least ) are given a job, and if relevant, a booking time. The rest is up to me. It suits me, because I prefer a later start, and like to run into the evening before parking up. The old “park up outside the gates ready for the morning” thing. If you know what I mean…
Let me guess you also throw your toys out of the pram if you don’t get paid from parking up for the night to driving through the gates in the morning.While how can you guarantee a late start when you’ve said that your start time is governed by the time booked for the first drop of the day which in most cases is the customer’s call not yours.
I’ve been driving trucks for nearly 30 years. I can’t be bothered to list the different trucks I’ve driven, the countries I’ve actually been to, or the governments I’ve voted for, but let me put it this way. I’m happy what I’m doing. Things are not perfect, but then, they never are. You make the best of what live throws you, or you become bitter. You, however, are a keyboard warrior. And bitter. And that makes me happy.
the nodding donkey:
I’ve been driving trucks for nearly 30 years.Things are not perfect, but then, they never are. You make the best of what live throws you
Great.So in that case you’d obviously agree with me that not many guvnors are going to pay you anything like your wages,if at all,for an extended daily rest period of 24 hours.Either because there is no load for the truck during that period.Or there is a 24 hour gap,between the booking in times of the 2nd and 3rd drops,of a 3 drop run.Assuming that the 3rd drop is not close enough to the yard to park it up there and go home.Feel free to disagree with that,just as I am allowed to under the forum rules.
the nodding donkey:
I’ve been driving trucks for nearly 30 years.Things are not perfect, but then, they never are. You make the best of what live throws you
Great.So in that case you’d obviously agree with me that not many guvnors are going to pay you anything like your wages,if at all,for an extended daily rest period of 24 hours.Either because there is no load for the truck during that period.Or there is a 24 hour gap,between the booking in times of the 2nd and 3rd drops,of a 3 drop run.Assuming that the 3rd drop is not close enough to the yard to park it up there and go home.Feel free to disagree with that,just as I am allowed to under the forum rules.
It’s not unreasonable to expect a payment for stood down time even if it’s a standard 8/9hr as it’s no fault of the employee who wasn’t made aware of this.
It’s a tight boss trying it on.
Last year I sat in Thetford truck sitting for three days while a group pf people emptied a shop out. I got paid 12hrs daily with night out payments. I wasn’t expected to drive, move or assist with loading. It as priced into the job and the end user agreed to it. Had it been unpaid then my lot know not to.waste their breath asking.
the nodding donkey:
I’ve been driving trucks for nearly 30 years.Things are not perfect, but then, they never are. You make the best of what live throws you
Great.So in that case you’d obviously agree with me that not many guvnors are going to pay you anything like your wages,if at all,for an extended daily rest period of 24 hours.Either because there is no load for the truck during that period.Or there is a 24 hour gap,between the booking in times of the 2nd and 3rd drops,of a 3 drop run.Assuming that the 3rd drop is not close enough to the yard to park it up there and go home.Feel free to disagree with that,just as I am allowed to under the forum rules.
It’s not unreasonable to expect a payment for stood down time even if it’s a standard 8/9hr as it’s no fault of the employee who wasn’t made aware of this.
It’s a tight boss trying it on.
Last year I sat in Thetford truck sitting for three days while a group pf people emptied a shop out. I got paid 12hrs daily with night out payments. I wasn’t expected to drive, move or assist with loading. It as priced into the job and the end user agreed to it. Had it been unpaid then my lot know not to.waste their breath asking.
Might be a tight boss trying it on; for some it’s the difference between measly profit and loss.
As there are drivers willing to work for £9.00 an hour, there are firms willing to run for 20% less than they should.
People are stupid or desperate or dreamers whether they are drivers or operators.
albion:
Might be a tight boss trying it on; for some it’s the difference between measly profit and loss.
As there are drivers willing to work for £9.00 an hour, there are firms willing to run for 20% less than they should.
People are stupid or desperate or dreamers whether they are drivers or operators.
In which case which of the three customers in this case does he charge for the driver’s downtime.Is it the first two for wanting their stuff 24 hours too soon.Or the 3rd for wanting their stuff delivered 24 hours later ?.
Then what happens if/when all or any of them say that the downtime spent between the respective delivery bookings isn’t all or any of their problems they ain’t paying it and/or the 3rd customer at least uses another operator who can do the job with no need for any downtime in his schedule.Then vice versa.Great there’s now not enough work for either operator and what work there is requires more drops done in a shift rather than parking up early.What next do drivers then say that they want a minimum guaranteed wage based on maxing out their legal available hours every week and every day ?.What could possibly go wrong.
the nodding donkey:
I’ve been driving trucks for nearly 30 years.Things are not perfect, but then, they never are. You make the best of what live throws you
Great.So in that case you’d obviously agree with me that not many guvnors are going to pay you anything like your wages,if at all,for an extended daily rest period of 24 hours.Either because there is no load for the truck during that period.Or there is a 24 hour gap,between the booking in times of the 2nd and 3rd drops,of a 3 drop run.Assuming that the 3rd drop is not close enough to the yard to park it up there and go home.Feel free to disagree with that,just as I am allowed to under the forum rules.
I fail to see your argument. I am paid a salary. I get paid from the moment I drive into the gate on day one, until I drive out of the gate on day four.
Oh, and I get paid the same when I go on holiday.
Mostly long distance, single drop jobs. A bit like your desired employment. But mine is real.
albion:
Might be a tight boss trying it on; for some it’s the difference between measly profit and loss.
As there are drivers willing to work for £9.00 an hour, there are firms willing to run for 20% less than they should.
People are stupid or desperate or dreamers whether they are drivers or operators.
In which case which of the three customers in this case does he charge for the driver’s downtime.Is it the first two for wanting their stuff 24 hours too soon.Or the 3rd for wanting their stuff delivered 24 hours later ?.
Then what happens if/when all or any of them say that the downtime spent between the respective delivery bookings isn’t all or any of their problems they ain’t paying it and/or the 3rd customer at least uses another operator who can do the job with no need for any downtime in his schedule.Then vice versa.Great there’s now not enough work for either operator and what work there is requires more drops done in a shift rather than parking up early.What next do drivers then say that they want a minimum guaranteed wage based on maxing out their legal available hours every week and every day ?.What could possibly go wrong.
How on earth would I know, I’m not privy to the OP’ boss’s business plan.
I was, since you missed it, responding to toonsy’s comment about it being a tight boss, not specifics.
All I can do is refer back to my experience and say that we never would expect a driver to be under our instruction and not get paid.
nurglets:
Sorry if this has been covered already but I’m on mobile and at work so not easy for me to search up.
I was sent away for a 3-delivery run recently where I had to do the 1st two drops, then wait almost 24hrs before doing the 3rd drop and returning to the yard.
This isn’t a regular run at all but the wait was known in advance, I was ok with it as a different weekly run has a similar wait period, and there’s a payment the driver gets for it, not a full day’s wages but a reasonable amount.
My problem is now ive been told I’m not getting paid the waiting amount, as I was essentially on a long daily. I still had my weekly 45hr break as well so I’ve essentially lost a days wages because they don’t feel like paying for the wait.
Before I get emotional with them about it, is there a working time rule about known delays that I’ve missed that says a driver should be paid for them if in the lorry?
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How can any employer do that to an employee and expect to get away with it
If any employer did that to me, the next time I went out I would’ve driven their truck straight into the nearest ditch
nurglets didn’t say if he asked how he’d be paid before he went, big mistake on his part methinks, or just go on the assumption that as it was a ‘similar’ job to one where driver was paid so he expected this to be paid the same. If they said before it would be paid then changed their minds after the deed was done then it’s time to get jumping up and down stamping your feet emotional but if it was never discussed before then i think a trip to the managers office with paperwork showing that previous ‘similar’ trips were paid and how is this different ?
remy:
nurglets didn’t say if he asked how he’d be paid before he went, big mistake on his part methinks, or just go on the assumption that as it was a ‘similar’ job to one where driver was paid so he expected this to be paid the same. If they said before it would be paid then changed their minds after the deed was done then it’s time to get jumping up and down stamping your feet emotional but if it was never discussed before then i think a trip to the managers office with paperwork showing that previous ‘similar’ trips were paid and how is this different ?
In a non confrontational way of course
Agree, I dont see how they can pay one driver for the same/ broadly similar, then not pay the OP.
Apparently it was a breakdown in communication between management, so i’ll be paid the waiting time payment, not a full shifts wages but a nominal amount for sitting doing nothing watching films.
Still keeping a close eye on things incase a similar thing happens again, you only need to do it a few times a year to each driver to save a decent amount of money
albion:
Might be a tight boss trying it on; for some it’s the difference between measly profit and loss.
As there are drivers willing to work for £9.00 an hour, there are firms willing to run for 20% less than they should.
People are stupid or desperate or dreamers whether they are drivers or operators.
In which case which of the three customers in this case does he charge for the driver’s downtime.Is it the first two for wanting their stuff 24 hours too soon.Or the 3rd for wanting their stuff delivered 24 hours later ?.
Then what happens if/when all or any of them say that the downtime spent between the respective delivery bookings isn’t all or any of their problems they ain’t paying it and/or the 3rd customer at least uses another operator who can do the job with no need for any downtime in his schedule.Then vice versa.Great there’s now not enough work for either operator and what work there is requires more drops done in a shift rather than parking up early.What next do drivers then say that they want a minimum guaranteed wage based on maxing out their legal available hours every week and every day ?.What could possibly go wrong.
Neither, the fault lies with the boss for poor planning, i’m sure there was other work elsewhere that could have gone on that truck instead of the 3rd load, but thats the way he planned it, so he should have to pay out of his pocket for it.
nurglets:
Apparently it was a breakdown in communication between management, so i’ll be paid the waiting time payment, not a full shifts wages but a nominal amount for sitting doing nothing watching films.
Still keeping a close eye on things incase a similar thing happens again, you only need to do it a few times a year to each driver to save a decent amount of money
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All the proper jobs i’ve had would pay ‘‘average pay’’ for such an eventuality, ie if you average £170 a day that’s what you’ll get, this also covers show jobs (where you are there as customer service) as well as extended waiting periods.
I’d be on this ‘nominal payment’ ■■■■■■■■ sharpish, speak to the top man, not in a bolshy way but setting out your points, i’ve instigated several new pay adjustments over the years by doing precisely this.
Carryfast:
While drivers don’t generally get paid for rest periods even when staying with the truck.It’s a catch 22.
I’ve never worked for (and never would) a company that doesn’t pay at least something for weekly rest periods taken on the road, including those taken while waiting for a back load. At Virginia sometimes we might wait 2/3 days for a reload in Hungary and we’d be paid a daily rate. Longest I ever waited was 5 days in Italy in August and guess what? They paid me. If they want me to take a 24 or 45 or more down road they pay me for it, after all its being done to accommodate their needs so it’s not much to ask imo
nurglets:
Apparently it was a breakdown in communication between management, so i’ll be paid the waiting time payment, not a full shifts wages but a nominal amount for sitting doing nothing watching films.
Still keeping a close eye on things incase a similar thing happens again, you only need to do it a few times a year to each driver to save a decent amount of money
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Wtf does ‘nominal amount’ payment mean?
It does not matter a ■■■■ if you were watching films or any other way of passing the time.
The fact that you were available for work and in their employment, paired with the fact that they were fully aware (if I read your o/p correctlly) of the wait prior to you doing the job, means they should pay you in full as I see it.
They’re fobbing you off…don’t roll over and let em, like I said before.
) are given a job, and if relevant, a booking time. The rest is up to me. It suits me, because I prefer a later start, and like to run into the evening before parking up. The old “park up outside the gates ready for the morning” thing. If you know what I mean… 
