W.H.WILLIAMS (spennymoor)

[carl_williams]

John West:
Great thread.

Love your reminiscing Carl. Great family firm.

Ceetee (Oh dear, my iPad wants to change you to cemetery!). What an interesting post. I remember Rolls going bust and John Bloom saying ‘Rolls was never a blue chip stock.’ Or something similar. I didn’t realise he had been deliberately undermined by the establishment!

At least he was trying to create something, unlike Jim Slater, of similar vintage Slater Walker, who pounced on cash poor, but asset rich companies and proceeded to strip them to enhance his and a certain Tory minister’s personal fortunes to the detriment of those who worked there.

Yes, I’m a Tory, but some people have no scruples!

John.

Hi John I remember Tallents, Bloom & Rolls well as we used to take a load of Spin Cans (For the spin dryer) from Tallents Aycliffe Factory to a Company called Middlesbrough Casements of North Ormsby near Middlesbrough each day & bring a load back galvanised. They were needed to keep production line running.

I was about 11 years old and for some reason a van returning in for the day’s load was delayed and all we had available was a Bedford CA with a luton van body on (About 450 cu ft) and it needed to do 3 loads to cover the day’s needs. The only driver was my Grandfather (Then in his 70s) & me to load & unload (Aged 11 or 120

In those days the journey was Aycliffe-Darlington-Stockton-Middlesbrough-North Ormsby and road between Darlington & Stockton all twists & turns, so not much time spare with load Aycliffe Unload M’brough Reload & unload Aycliffe 3 times. I was running into Middlesbrough casements carrying 3 spin cans when one slipped & slit my arm. They bandaged me up & we carried on but I still have the scar today

[gingerfold]

Wasn’t Andrew Flatley another 1950s entrepreneur in similar vein to John Bloom? Flatley produced and sold cheap twin tub washing machines and had a disused cotton spinning mill at Stoneclough as his assembly factory. Flatley also went bust.

[ceetee]

Flatley started making clothes dryers at first. These were nothing more than a steel cabinet with a mesh covered heating element in the base and wooden slats in the top over which you hung your clothes. On top of the cabinet was placed a lid.
The dryer was sold with a five year guarantee…Not much good if your house burned down first!!

[carl_williams]

The mention of Martin’s Bank Spwnnymoor before it became Barclays in Spennymoor Past & Present brought back a memory to me.
Throughout my life I always remember we always had a small van The first I really remember was a 1957 Bedford CA with a luton van body which sadly I was too young ever to drive, but when I passed my test we had this 1961 Ford Thames 15cwt van which I seemed to spend all my school holidays driving.
One job that was really unusual, and nowadays be very risky was carrying cash for Martin’s Bank Spennymoor.
All banks needed change and Martin’s had not got a ready supply at Spennymoor. However two nearby branches did. Sedgefield, although not a busy branch had two bus operators banking with them. Wilkinson’s of Sedgefield and Scurrs of Stillington. and Bishop Auckland has OK Motor Services. In those days all bus fares were paid cash in small change, so at least once or more each week we were hired to go to Martin’s bank Spennymoor and pick up a bank clerk and go to either Sedgefield or Bishop Auckland branch with two or three thousand pounds in notes and bring back bags of silver & copper coins.
In those days before high inflation reduced the value of money this was very valuable load & we needed security, so the bank clerk carried a truncheon. I remember having a laugh over this whilst in our journey agreeing if we were stopped by criminals the truncheon would have been dropped as we ran away shouting ‘Take the lot’ We had probably been doing this since the 1920’s and it carried on even after Barclays bought out Martin’s bank & Securicor took over.
The biggest laugh was we used to park outside Meikle’s Solicitors office & carry the cash across the Main road, propping open the Banks doors with a bag of coins until we had carried all the load across, Britain must have been much more honest in those days.

[carl_williams]

Bedford 'O ’ Model. We had 6 'O 'models in our fleet. This one an OB (Passenger chassis) which stupidly my dad & grandfather had fitted with a standard cab instead have spending the extra and having an integral pantechnicon built. Registered in 1948 JUP was also in error painted the wrong colour by the body builders (Youngs Ford dealers at their Sunderland body shop) Our orriginal colours were stone & brown but in 1935 my dad then 14 got them changed to cream & brown, & my Grandfather who was colour blind got it painted Stone & brown in error

The engine side cover is removed as they appear to be dipping the oil & checking the battery which was located under the passenger seat I seem to remember

Orriginally JUP was built with a straight through floor which proved high at the rear, Ramps hadn’t been thought of those days so in about 1952 it had a major refit with the body dropped & whee boxes put in. Dad wanted a drop well but this was going to be too expensive. The luton which was dropping due to Young’s poor body building was re enforced and it was re painted cream & brown. It looked a nice van then I remember. Our last Bedford again an OB (LPT 1950 reg) was replaced by a SB in 1961

The Bedford ‘OB’ was the first passenger chassis that became very popular for pantechnicon bodies because of the chassis length & led the way for the massively popular SB

[carl_williams]

Carl Williams:
Bedford 'O ’ Model. We had 6 'O 'models in our fleet. This one an OB (Passenger chassis) which stupidly my dad & grandfather had fitted with a standard cab instead have spending the extra and having an integral pantechnicon built. Registered in 1948 JUP was also in error painted the wrong colour by the body builders (Youngs Ford dealers at their Sunderland body shop) Our orriginal colours were stone & brown but in 1935 my dad then 14 got them changed to cream & brown, & my Grandfather who was colour blind got it painted Stone & brown in error

The engine side cover is removed as they appear to be dipping the oil & checking the battery which was located under the passenger seat I seem to remember

Orriginally JUP was built with a straight through floor which proved high at the rear, Ramps hadn’t been thought of those days so in about 1952 it had a major refit with the body dropped & whee boxes put in. Dad wanted a drop well but this was going to be too expensive. The luton which was dropping due to Young’s poor body building was re enforced and it was re painted cream & brown. It looked a nice van then I remember. Our last Bedford again an OB (LPT 1950 reg) was replaced by a SB in 1961

The Bedford ‘OB’ was the first passenger chassis that became very popular for pantechnicon bodies because of the chassis length & led the way for the massively popular SB

Bedford supplied the OB as a chassis/scuttle together with Chrome wheel discs & the chrome overiders that are fixed (on this photo) to the front bumper. These were designed to make coaches look better (The OB chassis scuttle had been designed for coach use) I remember the overiders were hung in our stores area at Marmaduke Street when I was young & till we moved out when they went with so many old Bedford parts into a skip.They were taken off in its very early life to make it like the other commercial chassis O models we ran. My family did not like things ‘Tarted up’

[carl_williams]

Just heard Tony Crooks has died. He worked for us a number of years & I remember him best from 1971 when we bought a new Leyland Mastiff tractor unit which he drove for about 3 years

[carl_williams]

Just been for a run up to Bob Harold’s paint shop at Sacriston near Durham where Paul, my son has a new 8 wheeler Renault tipper having additional painting done for a client. He was going to check how it was progressing as he needed it back at Rainton for PDI so it was ready for the new registration 1 Sept.

I have known Bob who is now semi retired since he was a teenager.

He was serving his time as a vehicle painter at Anthony Carrymore trailers at Stanley Co. Durham in the late 60s when Peter Butler used t sign write our vans, which he did till 1986. Before Peter it used to take sign writers 3 days but Peter used to start about 10.00AM (He was never an early riser) but he continued till he finished sometimes after midnight. Which sometimes was frustrating when we were based at Marmaduke Street, before we moved to Green Lane Industrial Estate, as often I had to wait to lock up. (our security at Green lane saw to that).
Eventually Peter used to get Bob to come along to help. The W.H.Williams on front back & sides was in very big block lettering , particularly along the sides & in white which needed two coats. Peter used to do the outlines leaving Bob to fill in and second coat.

Bob, himself was an excellent brush painter, which I suppose is an endangered species like sign writers in this day of spraying and nasty vinyl stickers. I always remember that dad was dissatisfied at the standard of paint on our newly built offices at Green Lane so he asked bob to paint them, who protested that he was not a decorator. ‘I want them mirror finnish’ dad told Bob. And when he’d finnished after scoopting the paint onto the doors and brushing till perfect finnish, I defy anyone to think they had been hand painted wood.

Eventually Bob & Peter went into partnership and opened a paintshop, with Peter partly financing, I believe and doing the sign writing. When we wanted our two vintage Bedfords painting , Bob & Peter did them between them in their paintshop, as we knew their work would be perfect. Possibly not the best recommendation for our own paint shop that painted a lot of our own vehicles plus outside work for the likes of United Carriers & Black & Decker.

When Eldis Transport was established I know Peter lettered all their vehicles until sadly he suffered a stroke and was paralised on this right hand side. By this time we had finished so I only have hear-say but I know he taught himself to write using his left hand, but I understand he lost the speed he was rightly famous for.

Unfortunately Bob was not there this morning & Paul was unable to wait 30 min for him to arrive, but I hope to go with Paul Wednesday to collect the Renault, as it had factory painted cab in light blue to the owners colour scheme and aluminium body so only needed the black wings & ods & ends including a chrome painted grill So looking forward to see it finished & meeting Bob again after all these years
Attached is a photo of a body written by Peter, not yet dry & if you look closely under & above our name you can still see Peter’s chalk lines

[carl_williams]

We had a regular signwriter calling himself Professor Norton from 1930s until he died in 1953.He lived in Crook Co.Durham and was an excellent writer. In fact he wrote a van for dad late 1952 and as he finished he said to dad.‘Well Harry, I’m putting my brushes away for the last time’.& it was the last signwriting he did as he died just a few months later. We then had several vans written by a chap named Pedlar Palmer from Bishop Auckland and he was far from perfect.Then in the early 60s Temp. Newton who also had a decorators shop in Spennymoor & was a decorator did about four or five. He used to come along with two apprentices and took two or three days but in fairness he was running a business with several employees to see to.He also wrote for Dents Transport Spennymoor, and his work was perfect, and he went onto decorating inc gold leaf writing & marblelising in Palaces in the Middle East. Then in 1965 we needed a good sign writer & there were a few about who were far from good but dad said he’d met an excellent chap from Washington doing some lettering in Adams & Gibbons at Durham (THe Bedford agents),and aong came Peter Butler. Peter was without doubt perfect. No-one could ever find fault in his work and he was so quick. He must have painted well over 200 vehicles for us over the next 20 years.Sometimes three in a week, but with us nearly twice a week for several years.

[carl_williams]

A recent quote on Truccknet about the pneumatic governor on BMC FGs reminded me of our first FG which was a Morris, (Others we got later were either BMC or Leyland) a 2 Tonner, which had 3.8:itre 4 cylinder BMC diesel with crash gearbox & no power steering, of course,
It was supplied new by the then Sunderland Morris agents Turveys, as a chassis scuttle and put into Marsden Coachbuilders Warrington and a pantechnicon body about 800cu ft fitted . Reg no DPT100B In A licence days you could only replace within a small amount of the unladen weight without an enquiry & as it replaced a 15cwt Bedford CA Luton, it just qualified.
All our other vans were over 4 ton unladen and I think at that time it was up to 3 ton unladen you could drive at 17 (Even in pre HGV licence days) So I think my dad had me in mind when it was ordered. However timing was out as I was too young to drive when it first came,I was staying on at school for A levels and so a driver was allocated it.
I did drive it a few times when I was 16 and learning to drive on L plates.I found it a bit of a pig, and wished like my friends I could go to a driving school & learn on a normal car. I even took ny test on my 17th birthday present, a Rover2000 which was not the ideal size for 3 point turns, but my father said I had to be ale to drive anything. Then during my school holidays the driver was sick for a few weeks so during that time I had the pleasure of driving it. It would cruise up hill & down dale at 50Mph but that was it and one of the jobs it did twice a week was taking a load of pajamas from a Co. Durham Clothing factory to Banner Textiles Altringham. It was a job I particularly didn’t like because I needed to leave Spennymoor at 5-00AM t get to Altringham for about 9.00 as it took them about 3 hours to unload and they started at 9.00 & needed to be first or I’d have to wait for them unloading anyone before me.
So it was on a bright Summers day 1965 I was crossing the Pennines at Standedge heading for Manchester in DPT100B when I came upon about 3 HGVs doing about 25 & saw the two lane road going into a three lane The FG was maintaining its 50Mph as I started to pass, but as it neared to peak, it started to struggle so I changed down to 3rd and the governor immediately cut my speed down to 20. I could see the road going back into two lane & could see the eyes of the first of a long line of HGVs approaching and I can imagine the cursing I got as I had no alternative but cut in on the final wagon I was passing.
When operators licencing came in it was easier for us to increase the size of our fleet but the restriction was the size of our premises. It took two years of negotiating with planners to build our new depot where we eventually had parking for almost 200 vehicles but our old premises in the centre of Spennymoor were at bursting point and so we bought 3 FGs 30 cwt like the one in the picture as they were O licence exempt & didn’t count in our total. We had 3.8 Litre engine in these & they were about as big as you could get a 3.5 ton GVW in those days, certainly bigger than the two Transits & one Bedford CF we had Marsdens build for us,
All in all the FGs were good vehicles DPT100B did 12 years with us as did the other 3 Marsdens. We also had a 350 platform truck which we fitted a compressor to & it was used by our tyre fitter. We also inherited a 3 Tonner with 1,000 cu ft luton when we opened our Wellingborough depot and we brought it back to Spennymoor, reconditioned it and used it on Local removals.
Our last FG which we bought new about 1982 was another 30 cwt & we put a lightweight largish boxvan body & ran it along with a 1,000 cu ft TK out of our Wellingborough depot,
As I said all in all strangely for British Leyland the FGs were good vehicles & their 3,8 litre 4 cylinder diesel was a good engine

[carl_williams]

Two Bedfords both with Vanplan Bodies Boxvan & integral pantechnicon Both Bedford KF 12.5 ton GVW with Bedford 466 Engines from the cab back bodies are identical same length. Full Roller shutter rear with Radcliffe taillifts but that’s where the similarity ends because drive each and they bear no resemblance and as an operator that’s when we found the difference as drivers loved the integral Bedfords and took more care & stayed with us, whereas standard Lutons & boxvans never had that appeal
It was 1967 we got our last SB Marsden Pantechnicon VPT828F and a few months later we got our first TK Marsden Pantechnicon BUP312F. The reason for the demise of the SB was Plating & Testing and with every effort we made we could not increase the plated weight of 9.5 ton GVW, meaning in reality they could only carry 4.5 ton, which was unbelievable as the SB was based on what Bedford called ‘The Big Bedford’ S type 7 tonner and we had been running them with up to 8 ton loads on for up to 14 years. The changeover was quite expensive as we kept a well stocked Stores department of SB spares. Infact even Wallace Arnold as well as running buses were Bedford agents at Leeds and they sent many to us to buy SB spares as the chassis although still produced had been replaced on the coach market by Bedford’s underfloor engine chassis.
The TK chassis scuttles gave us ordering problems, because whereas the SB had been a specialised product Bedford held stocks of chassis at Duple & Plaxton the two popular coachbuilders and when we ordered from Adams & Gibbon our local Bedford agents they could usually locate chassis within a matter of days. Things were so much different with the Bedford TK chassis scuttles which were the base for the Pantechnicon bodies. The other inefficiency we had was we in those days we paid cash for our vehicles and didn’t use finance so that we paid Adams & Gibbons for the chassis Scuttles when they were delivered to Marsdens at Warrington and they paid Marsden for the bodywork on completion but it was not unusual for them to take 6 months & sometimes longer to build the vehicle and we had money ■■■■■■■ in new vehicles & earning no profit until they were on the road.
Something happened, however that solved our problem, but in no way would we ever wish to happen. Old Mr Marsden (Ken & Geoff’s father) who my dad had dealt with since the nineteen fifties died and he left his estate to his wife. In these days property left to a spouse is exempt from death duties but that was not the case early 1960s and so death duties were payable but sadly within two or three years the mother died and death duties were due again, and sadly the two brothers had no alternative to sell the business. Although they kept their positions & were allowed to continue more or less as normal the owners were The Baird Group, who also owned Garlick, Burrell and Edwards, who had several Bedford Franchises in the Liverpool area. This meant that Marsden through there new owner could supply us the complete vehicle and when we collected we took along a cheque in payment for chassis and body. We managed to get them to give us the same 20% discount off the Bedford chassis and if anything it speeded up delivery times as they would be pressurised to complete quicker. The other factor was that Marsden discovered that there was profit to be made out of stripping new chassis cabs down to chassis scuttles selling windscreen, doors, wings & engine doors etc in GBE’s parts department which saved delivery times as always there were TK chassis cabs in stock.
When Gerry Crow and Arthur Rathbone left Marsdens to form Vanplan they made similar arrangements with a Bedford dealership and could match on price. Both had worked all their working life at Marsdens and we had known them years in fact I was with my dad at Marsdens in 1964 when Gerry had just been promoted to foreman. Arthur had been their only foreman for many years & was the type who did things himself rather than tell others, but was a very clever man. Having been trained by Mr Marsden senior. It was difficult because we liked Ken Marsden & Arthur & Gerry, but at first wondered how on earth Marsdens would manage without them, but they did & still did some good designs. Price & quality of work was no difference so we tended to use who ever gave us quickest delivery.

[carl_williams]

Carl Williams:
Two Bedfords both with Vanplan Bodies Boxvan & integral pantechnicon Both Bedford KF 12.5 ton GVW with Bedford 466 Engines from the cab back bodies are identical same length. Full Roller shutter rear with Radcliffe taillifts but that’s where the similarity ends because drive each and they bear no resemblance and as an operator that’s when we found the difference as drivers loved the integral Bedfords and took more care & stayed with us, whereas standard Lutons & boxvans never had that appeal
It was 1967 we got our last SB Marsden Pantechnicon VPT828F and a few months later we got our first TK Marsden Pantechnicon BUP312F. The reason for the demise of the SB was Plating & Testing and with every effort we made we could not increase the plated weight of 9.5 ton GVW, meaning in reality they could only carry 4.5 ton, which was unbelievable as the SB was based on what Bedford called ‘The Big Bedford’ S type 7 tonner and we had been running them with up to 8 ton loads on for up to 14 years. The changeover was quite expensive as we kept a well stocked Stores department of SB spares. Infact even Wallace Arnold as well as running buses were Bedford agents at Leeds and they sent many to us to buy SB spares as the chassis although still produced had been replaced on the coach market by Bedford’s underfloor engine chassis.
The TK chassis scuttles gave us ordering problems, because whereas the SB had been a specialised product Bedford held stocks of chassis at Duple & Plaxton the two popular coachbuilders and when we ordered from Adams & Gibbon our local Bedford agents they could usually locate chassis within a matter of days. Things were so much different with the Bedford TK chassis scuttles which were the base for the Pantechnicon bodies. The other inefficiency we had was we in those days we paid cash for our vehicles and didn’t use finance so that we paid Adams & Gibbons for the chassis Scuttles when they were delivered to Marsdens at Warrington and they paid Marsden for the bodywork on completion but it was not unusual for them to take 6 months & sometimes longer to build the vehicle and we had money ■■■■■■■ in new vehicles & earning no profit until they were on the road.
Something happened, however that solved our problem, but in no way would we ever wish to happen. Old Mr Marsden (Ken & Geoff’s father) who my dad had dealt with since the nineteen fifties died and he left his estate to his wife. In these days property left to a spouse is exempt from death duties but that was not the case early 1960s and so death duties were payable but sadly within two or three years the mother died and death duties were due again, and sadly the two brothers had no alternative to sell the business. Although they kept their positions & were allowed to continue more or less as normal the owners were The Baird Group, who also owned Garlick, Burrell and Edwards, who had several Bedford Franchises in the Liverpool area. This meant that Marsden through there new owner could supply us the complete vehicle and when we collected we took along a cheque in payment for chassis and body. We managed to get them to give us the same 20% discount off the Bedford chassis and if anything it speeded up delivery times as they would be pressurised to complete quicker. The other factor was that Marsden discovered that there was profit to be made out of stripping new chassis cabs down to chassis scuttles selling windscreen, doors, wings & engine doors etc in GBE’s parts department which saved delivery times as always there were TK chassis cabs in stock.
When Gerry Crow and Arthur Rathbone left Marsdens to form Vanplan they made similar arrangements with a Bedford dealership and could match on price. Both had worked all their working life at Marsdens and we had known them years in fact I was with my dad at Marsdens in 1964 when Gerry had just been promoted to foreman. Arthur had been their only foreman for many years & was the type who did things himself rather than tell others, but was a very clever man. Having been trained by Mr Marsden senior. It was difficult because we liked Ken Marsden & Arthur & Gerry, but at first wondered how on earth Marsdens would manage without them, but they did & still did some good designs. Price & quality of work was no difference so we tended to use who ever gave us quickest delivery.

Regarding this recent post I had some correspondence from Christopher Smith of Smiths Removals & Transport Hartlepool that some might find interesting & bring memories from the past back, together with my reply

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Comments
Christopher Smith
Christopher Smith I found the same,the Marsden integral cabs were superb,I had a removal and haulage company in Hartlepool for fifty years and loved these vehicles,some had the sliding doors on the cab but I preferred the standard door system but the room inside the cab was magnificent
Like · Reply · 19 hours ago
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Carl Williams
Carl Williams The sliding doors were fitted to the Bedford SBs (Passenger chassis. I’m surprised you didn’t like them as we never had any trouble & drivers would travel with them open on a hot day. (Air conditioning. Are you Smith’s Removals rom Hartlepool who during the 1950s did some work for Tin Boxes at Hartlepool?
Like · Reply · 9 hours ago
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Christopher Smith
Christopher Smith Hi Carl,yes it was my grandfather’s company,then my father’s and finally mine I had a stroke in 2010 and finished but they were very happy years and I well remember your vehicle’s they were very smart,it was a lovely industry to be in,jock who had tin boxes originally from Hartlepool was a very good friend of the family,I hope our are all well and still doing some sort of business,I remember the furniture dinner dances at the ramside hall well with old Lilly willcox.cheers and thanks for reply.
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Carl Williams
Carl Williams Thanks Christopher for the complement to our vans. I remember going over to Tin Boxes Hartlepool to load with my dad one afternoon when I was 6 or 7 & seeing one of your vans there. We used to do a lot out of their Aycliffe factory & just occasional load from Hartlepool. Dad said lots of loads to Cellartape Borhamwood. Leaving Spennymoor about 10PM down to Borehamwood to be there when they opened tip & straight back in time more work that day. (No tachos then) but our old Bedford SBs were limited to 20MPH, but cruised at 55mph & so the drivers had their eyes glued to the one mirror (On the drivers side only) & with no stop lights the police couldn’t see them slowing down if they spotted one behind, Lilly Willcox was a character with many tales of Alfred Bells (In their hay day) when they were the biggest Removal Contractors in Newcastle. I did almost 2 years as Chairman of BAR as Arthur Raine manager of Cracknells Darlington was chairman emigrated to Australia & I was vice chairman so took over & then did my full years chairmanship. Lilly knew everyone in the industry & kept me right.

Christopher Smith Very nice to hear your story Carl,I remember very well as you do the old time and mileage sheets,we used to get down to Doncaster area and tear our sheets up and start from scratch,the mileage was a bit awkward to answer to,I remember they always had a guy at the Cleveland tontine in those days and we had a few drivers pulled when according to their sheets they were at home,but I don’t think any of us really did anything horrendous.i don’t know if you remember ken pattison who had tin boxes he always wore s cravat because he was a spitfire pilot in the war and shot down in flames and was severely burned from the neck down,he was a proper character.its lovely to reminisce of the old days they were very interesting,I wouldn’t like to be doing now even the vehicles.are no longer a joy you can’t work on them without computers and I don’t think many of today’s so called mechanics could perform to life giving repairs that we had to it’s all replacement engines,gearboxes ect.i used to love the smell of the inside of the body’s on the pantechnicans when new,different era.i hope you and your family are in good health and life is being kind to you,it’s nice to put a name to some of the brilliant people who ran those companies,we at least had our customers wishes met on a daily basis.cheers carl.i am going to sort a couple of photos of our old machines out and put them on Facebook.

[paulycats]

Some excellent memories there from Carl and Christopher, cheered my Monday up no end, especially the cruising at 50 when restricted to 20

[carl_williams]

paulycats:
Some excellent memories there from Carl and Christopher, cheered my Monday up no end, especially the cruising at 50 when restricted to 20

Can you imagine travelling down to London 260 miles from Spennymoor at 20 mph. Couldn’t do it in your days driving hours. Although enforcement in the 50s wasn’t as strict. Particularly if you could speed a bit. Like I said no nearside mirrors & probably just one wiper clearing the drivers side, but as I said no stop lights so the police coming up behind couldn’t see your lights go on as you slowed down to 20 mph.

Then they increased the speed limit to 30mph and we got stop lights, and they had to slow down with their handbrakes.Although you must understand these were the days when the average policeman’s transport was a bicycle, so not as many police cars checking speeding & they had to follow for about quarter of a mile to take a fair reading. When we got diesels Ford first then Bedfords they could switch off the ignition to switch off the spot lights before they put their foot on the breaks.

Even as today, how many people do you know who don’t speed if they can get away with it.

[paulycats]

I hope you don’t mind me hijacking your thread for a moment Carl but in the photo is my oldest sister, Joan and my brother Ron. This would be taken about 1947 in Seaham, about the time my dad bought his first wagon. In the background is the family car and i think it was a Ford 8 (or model Y) My sister Joan (now 80 yrs old) tells the story of my dad (driver) and 4 other adults PLUS Joan and Ron travelling down to London to see some of dad’s family in this car. The journey took 7 hours, with Ron sitting on mam’s knee and Joan sitting on a “cracket” put behind and in between the 2 front seats
Joan went on to be a school teacher and Ron gave up a good job at County Hall (Durham) to drive for dad in 1960 until the business ended in 1975.
I can remember Peter Butler from my A&G days and as you say his work was always top drawer, a lovely bloke.

[carl_williams]

paulycats:
0

I hope you don’t mind me hijacking your thread for a moment Carl but in the photo is my oldest sister, Joan and my brother Ron. This would be taken about 1947 in Seaham, about the time my dad bought his first wagon. In the background is the family car and i think it was a Ford 8 (or model Y) My sister Joan (now 80 yrs old) tells the story of my dad (driver) and 4 other adults PLUS Joan and Ron travelling down to London to see some of dad’s family in this car. The journey took 7 hours, with Ron sitting on mam’s knee and Joan sitting on a “cracket” put behind and in between the 2 front seats
Joan went on to be a school teacher and Ron gave up a good job at County Hall (Durham) to drive for dad in 1960 until the business ended in 1975.
I can remember Peter Butler from my A&G days and as you say his work was always top drawer, a lovely bloke.

Reminds me of the story my dad told of him going down to London for their two day honeymoon. Although in his lifetime my Grandfather had about 30 Rover Cars since the 1920s he also used to dabble in cars and he had just bought a Morris 12 and dad had just sold his second Talbot, so decided to take this Morris 12 Part way down he had a tyre blow out then found out no spare, &so soon after the war there was still rationing and had difficulty in getting a new Tyre. I think he got offered a new John Bull tyre but had to fit it himself and as they were then running late didn’t have time to clean his hands even & headed for the Strand as they were booked into the Strand Palace Hotel, which is still there today opposite the Savoy.

Driving along the Strand he couldn’t find it & so turned round to head back towards Charring Cross when he stopped to ask someone & they pointed across the road and There was The Chrome Letters Strand Palace Hotel, but he was on the opposite side of the road. He said he’d been in Taxis in the past and all they did was put their hands out to signal right so he did the same & pulled up outside the front door on the strand.

Going into the foyer, which was Art Deco Marble & now preserved in a museum he went up to the reception desk to be told there had been a mistake & had no booking & the hotel was full. To quote him ‘I had been told if you give a 10 shilling tip to the receptionist they will make a room available; Just then I looked at my hands still black from changing the tyre & saw all these young women with immaculate manicured hands with nail varnish & I thought how am I going to get this 10 shilling note over to her? Gathering my courage I handed her the note & said this is to thank you for your help & was surprised by her reply that if we went in The Grill Room for Dinner (It was 7.00PM) & come back to see her she would have a room available’ My dad went and washed his hands & cleaned himself & he and my mother went in and had there meal, and when they went back Miss Lee the receptionist had one of the best rooms ready.

Just then he remembered he’d left the Morris 12 was parked outside on the Strand. It was still there & so he took it round to Lex Garage in Lexicon Street in Soho & parked the car.

What would happen today if you parked a car half way along The Strand for over 2 hours?

This ten shilling tip was the best money ever spent, As whenever after that he rand Miss Lee who was the chief receptionist & she reserved rooms & that was when hotel rooms in London were in short supply. Several years later the Coronation & my Grandmother got invited to attend with a seat in Westminster Abbey. My dad rang Miss Lee and booked a room at The Strand Palace for my Grandparents. I think the hotel only has 2 or 3 with balconies overlooking The Strand & although unlike my Grandmother who was at the Coronation my grandfather was able the watch the procession with the new queen & all the horse drawn carriages pass as he sat on his balcony

[paulycats]

Hi Carl, Have you ever thought to write a book? You could end up with a best seller. Your anecdote’s are great reading mate, they really are

[jmc_jnr]

paulycats:
Hi Carl, Have you ever thought to write a book? You could end up with a best seller. Your anecdote’s are great reading mate, they really are

I will second that idea and it would be wonderfull to have the history of Williams to hand. Put me down for a copy if it comes to fruit. Jim.

[carl_williams]

jmc jnr:

paulycats:
Hi Carl, Have you ever thought to write a book? You could end up with a best seller. Your anecdote’s are great reading mate, they really are

I will second that idea and it would be wonderfull to have the history of Williams to hand. Put me down for a copy if it comes to fruit. Jim.

Thanks both of you for your kind thoughts, but I know my capabilities. I would need a Ghost writer, and would have gladly provided all the information, and not taken any proceeds from the project. One person did approach me, but wanted several thousands fees from me for his services, and then I would have to self publish. In my opinion it would be a con.

If a book were published I would want it to be a professional publication, of good quality as we did run a good quality business, priding ourselves on top quality maintenance of our vehicles. Sadly this is not possible, which is a shame because I do believe the information I would have provided would have been of interest to all Commercial vehicle & haulage enthusiasts and also interest to many people who live in County Durham & North East England. We certainly made mistakes but did a lot of things that many would be entrepreneurs could benefit from reading which would do them more good than a university degree in business studies.

So although I think there would be a market out there that would make it a viable proposition for a young writer & a speculative publisher, sadly I think it never will happen.

[carl_williams]

Again another conversation I had on Facebook with Jim Kingham from Northern Ireland about the van on the left

Carl Williams
Carl Williams Built by Boyer Brothers Congleton who changed their name to Boalloy & became famous for designing & building Tautliner curtain side trailers
Like · Reply · 1 October at 19:47
Jim Kinghan
Jim Kinghan Boalloy was also a brand name used by Abrahams on some erly integerals built by them in Manchester ■■? Carl Williams back me up here… I had one TK with Abrahams riblock alloy body and it had a pair of boalloy badges on the front panel under the windscreens and it had twin double headlights same as in the picture above I nevet took any pictures of it as i thought it was an ugly ■■■■■■■■ Then 1 day it blew the engine near a services on the M62…We parked it there and it was stolen before we could get it recovered. it was an X H&G Transport from high Wycombe, and still had their livery on it. never seen or heard of it again. Police were informed and as you would expect there was never any contact back… surprised ■■? do u think i was ■■? Nah. I think the service area sold it …that was Birtch services… buit when i contacted them they said they never seen it…

Carl Williams
Carl Williams In about 1963 Syd Abram Manchester got Marsden to build them about 10 vans which quickly sold in Commercial Motor. They then approached Marsden to build another 50 1 a week but at massive cost cuts. As Ken Marsden explained to my dad it meant they had to cut quality,but also put too many eggs in one basket, explaining that they preferred to supply many operators like us. Abram then approached Boyer Brothers Congleton who took them up & built many hundreds. They called their products even then Boalloy so you are right Jim about the badges. They were cheap & nasty. We had about 3 we inherited from a large fleet we took over & they were always in for body strengthening as they were falling to bits. We had several other vans and Tautliner trailers built by Boalloy that were well built, but these for Abram were built to a price that cut quality