Are Agency drivers as bad as this at other places?

[truckman020]

truckyboy:
Like we often say…there are drivers…and there are screwdrivers…the good drivers like myself, dont worry if its a new job…if its in the dark or light…if its a new delivery or not…most of mine are anyway, and i never hit anything…because i care about the vehicle i drive, and because i care about other peoples property…if im not sure, or cant see it..i get out and look..why dont others ■■ At my last big company..the agency drivers came up trumps..it was the regulars doing the damage, of course there are accidents ` yet this firm had assesors…who failed drivers before they started…but the firm still employed them…damage a truck severely…no problem…give em another one…thats bad management…and so is whats happened at the ops company…if you like…i will come up there and sort it out.

truckyboy,shouldn’t say I never hit anything,famous last words and all that.

[james_908]

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

Is the test easier now than in 1975 when I passed ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[andrewg]

James.908:

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

Is the test easier now than in 1975 when I passed ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Yes, we had a proper gearbox and clutch to contend with What should happen is the same as the car test, pass in an auto and you get an ‘A’ on your licence ie auto only. Plenty of older trucks with a proper manual box around which driving schools could use…

[james_908]

AndrewG:

James.908:

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

Is the test easier now than in 1975 when I passed ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Yes, we had a proper gearbox and clutch to contend with

Fair point…

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[robroy]

I took mine in a Dodge, with a badly worn gearbox with a splitter button. It resembled a stick in a bucket , and the splitter button kept slipping around the lever. It wasn’t so much gear selection more hope for the best.

[muckles]

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

The driving test is and always has been a basic level of competence, remembering what I had to do to get my various licenses and what the have to do know I don’t think it has got worse, however with my bike I was fortunate enough to be stopped by a bike copper who gave me a right bollocking and then a load of timely advice instead of a ticket, but where are the experienced traffic officers these days? As for my HGV’s I was again fortunate enough to spend a few days double manning a truck with my brother and he had learned from the old boys he started working with when he started as a warehouse lad and used to go out in the trucks with them, I was also able to get advice from the experienced drivers at the haulage company I worked for, it was just working out which drivers were worth listening to and which to nod in agreement with and then ignore, there were BS merchants back then as well.
I believe this is what’s missing, lack of a police presence on the road, the cut backs in traffic police have been savage and we now seem to have a situation provided you don’t exceed the posted speed limit and your vehicle is taxed, Mot’d and insured you can drive as you like with very little chance of getting stopped and lack of on the job training for new HGV drivers, from reading the new driver section, many of whom will get their start with an agency and turn up somewhere be given a truck and told to get in with it.

[muckles]

AndrewG:

James.908:

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

Is the test easier now than in 1975 when I passed ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Yes, we had a proper gearbox and clutch to contend with What should happen is the same as the car test, pass in an auto and you get an ‘A’ on your licence ie auto only. Plenty of older trucks with a proper manual box around which driving schools could use…

But why would that help road safety or doing the job properly?
I learned in a manual truck the gearbox it had bore no relationship to gearboxes in the trucks I then went onto drive, the truck was also a Ford Cargo pulling a 30ft flatbed trailer again which bore no relationship, except being a truck, with the trucks I went onto drive or the trailers I was pulling with them.
i believe now they have to have full length solid sided trailers, so no using the rear window to reverse and the trailer has to have some weight in it.
Most companies seem to have auto trucks, even the smaller ones, if they have manuals, ,except for people like Punchy Dan, they’ll be synchro boxes and easy enough to use with a bit of instruction for anybody who has used a manual car.

[james_908]

robroy:
I took mine in a Dodge, with a badly worn gearbox with a splitter button. It resembled a stick in a bucket , and the splitter button kept slipping around the lever. It wasn’t so much gear selection more hope for the best.

I remember the gear change exercise…1st to 5th…5th back down to 1st. …

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[lancsdriver70]

I am not saying, and never have claimed, that ALL agency drivers are poor.

We have around a dozen guys (mainly Polish) who are agency drivers that have worked for the Firm for 3-6 years.
These guys are good drivers who have been offered permanent contracts with us many times, but for their own
reasons they prefer to stay working for us as an agency driver. This dozen or so guys are just as good, or in some cases
better than most of the permanent drivers.

I believe that the main issue is that all of our permanent drivers…and these long-term agency guys, had to pass
a rigorous driving assessment, written tests and receive several days training prior to starting work at our place.

Whereas this current crop of agency temps (who are only here until Xmas), have never had to pass any kind of
assessment or test, and haven’t been given any kind of proper training by the Firm. In most cases, they have just been
given the keys and the paperwork from day one…and told to just crack on with the job.

This, combined with fact that they know that they will not be working for us any more in another 6 weeks, means
that some of them probably aren’t really that bothered about looking after the kit, or doing the job properly. They
know that they will be on another agency gig somewhere else after Christmas.

[andrewg]

muckles:

AndrewG:

James.908:

Is the test easier now than in 1975 when I passed ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Yes, we had a proper gearbox and clutch to contend with What should happen is the same as the car test, pass in an auto and you get an ‘A’ on your licence ie auto only. Plenty of older trucks with a proper manual box around which driving schools could use…

But why would that help road safety or doing the job properly?
I learned in a manual truck the gearbox it had bore no relationship to gearboxes in the trucks I then went onto drive, the truck was also a Ford Cargo pulling a 30ft flatbed trailer again which bore no relationship, except being a truck, with the trucks I went onto drive or the trailers I was pulling with them.
i believe now they have to have full length solid sided trailers, so no using the rear window to reverse and the trailer has to have some weight in it.
Most companies seem to have auto trucks, even the smaller ones, if they have manuals, ,except for people like Punchy Dan, they’ll be synchro boxes and easy enough to use with a bit of instruction for anybody who has used a manual car.
[/quote]
I agree, it wouldnt help safety but would require more thought input from a driver and maybe weed out those who have havent got the extra few brain cells to work say a range change/splitter box.
I learnt to drive with old school Noel Fisher who was based at Norwich cattle market, the truck? A Bedford TM with Detroit V6, hideous thing to drive but gave an insight into the workings of everything heavy and manual hard work compared to todays easy drive stuff. The missus is driving for me this week, never driven my 16 before, 700 stallions under her right foot and reckons its as easy driving her car…

[dr_damon]

kcrussell25:

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

I think juddian’s point is whilst “any muppet” can get a licence it doesn’t mean you have to employ them.

That or invest some training in them rather than be surprised and moan when they do damage

Yes I realise that but my point is there are very few drivers worth taking on! I have TM mates and they tell me standards are appalling although I can see that most days out on the roads.

[dr_damon]

James.908:

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

Is the test easier now than in 1975 when I passed ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Nope, same basic test as someone else pointed out although now easier not having a crash gearbox and the luxury of power steering. It is a basic test, same as a car test. Basic meaning you are supposed to learn and improve after passing.
Unfortunately most do the opposite.

[harry_monk]

One agency driver at our place over-ran the pin which smashed the deflector off so he was given a replacement unit which he promptly reversed into a barrier which knocked an air tank off, all on the same shift.

I’m not slagging agency drivers off, I’m agency myself. My nickname at the firm I work for is “The bloke who isn’t Polish”.

[andrejs]

Lancsdriver70:
Just finished my night shift, went into the transport office to sign out and debrief, and all everyone is talking about
is the number of accidents we’ve had in the last few weeks involving agency drivers, and some of the subbies.

The accident list, which is pinned up in the drivers room, is the longest I’ve ever seen …anywhere!

All bar one of the 27 accidents in the last 4 weeks have involved agency drivers, and in a few cases, subbies.
Only one incident has involved one of our permanent drivers.

We’ve had;

4 bridge hits…all involving 16ft trailers hitting bridges marked at UNDER 16ft 0ins…all agency drivers

1 Roll away in the yard…which damaged the unit in question and 3 trailers…agency driver

An agency bod reversing into, and destroying a BT phone box near a store

Another agency driver completely destroying someones garden wall…whilst trying to turn around on a housing
estate (he’d apparently got lost!)

Another trailer and forklift truck, both badly damaged…when an agency guy reversed into a stationary FLT at
a store

…and numerous other scrapes and bumps.

This set of agency drivers (most provided by the same Firm) has got to be the worst set of drivers I’ve ever seen anywhere!

On top of the accidents, we’ve had cases in the last few weeks of agency drivers parking up repeatedly in front of the
onsite diesel pumps…and then clocking off and going home…in one case with the unit keys still in his pocket!

Another got to a store, and didn’t know how to operate the tailift. The Forkie at the store had to show him how to use
it

We’ve also had two agency drivers in a week set off with the legs still down, after coupling up…causing damage to
the legs…not to mention lots of peoples hearing!! In addition no less than 5 have “missed the pin”…in just the last
3 weeks alone! …and 4 have dropped trailers to their knees!

A number of these drivers are also unable to reverse into a bay…even after 10 minutes of trying! Either the shunters,
or other drivers are having to do it for them!

I’m not for a minute saying that our permanent drivers are perfect, and have never had any bumps or scrapes. Nor
am I claiming to be a fantastic driver myself…I only passed my Class 1 in May, and sometimes I need several
shunts to reverse into a bay, or a tight space.

But some of these current set of agency drivers are the worst Class 1 drivers I’ve ever seen! I’m not saying they are
all poor, but I really can’t believe that some of them are driving artics at all!

We’ve got around 80 agency drivers and subbies with us until Christmas, then I guess things will revert back to normal,
and it will just be our regular, permanent drivers doing the job…if our units and trailers haven’t all been destroyed
by then!

Are we just unlucky with the temporary agency drivers that we’ve got at the moment? Or have other Firms got similar
problems with their run-up-to-Christmas temporary agency drivers??

How many accident was done by Ee drivers?

[winseer]

The bar isn’t being set high enough for “New Driver Recruits”. They don’t need to be agency to be that, but it’s a sign of our times that hardly any actual fresh full time jobs for drivers can just be posted and filled externally these days… If nothing else, an agency will be in to cover the “transition period” between say, a retiring driver and the new FT recruit who’s yet to be deployed following interviews, etc.

Agencies playing the “Halfway house, 9 points OK” are not helping of course. Even the “must have two years experience” seems to be being relaxed these days.

[carryfast]

Winseer:
Even the “must have two years experience” seems to be being relaxed these days.

How does anyone get the ‘two years experience’ without doing the job first to get it ?.

[slowlane]

The test probably hasn’t got easier, in fact I’d rather take the test in a crummy manual where gear selection is more luck than judgement, than today… providing I also get the same volume of traffic as back in the good old days.

Plenty of drivers simply don’t care about the job, and Juddian is on the money with the reason why, I reckon. You can only take pride in your job for a limited time when there is no backup.

[dr_damon]

slowlane:
The test probably hasn’t got easier, in fact I’d rather take the test in a crummy manual where gear selection is more luck than judgement, than today… providing I also get the same volume of traffic as back in the good old days.

Plenty of drivers simply don’t care about the job, and Juddian is on the money with the reason why, I reckon. You can only take pride in your job for a limited time when there is no backup.

Yeah blame everyone else apart from the driver. Seems to be the way on here.Nothing to do with Management it is society as a whole going down the pan.Nobody cares about anyone but themselves these days.Rude arrogant and full of ■■■■.

[kcrussell25]

Dr Damon:

kcrussell25:

Dr Damon:

Juddian:
Its not agency drivers as such its ■■■■ poor management wot causes this.

If managers aint arsed about the job, as obviously they arn’t, then like the proverbial stuff that hits the fan that attitude runs downhill until it has infected the entire operation.
Before you know it you’ve ended up where no one cares, this isn’t usually the case on smaller companies because the person risking his or her fortune to operate will keep and eye on the ball and soon as things stat to go wrong, if they want the business to thrive, they take the appropriate action.

I’ve seen this from a drivers point of view, where a diminishing circle of drivers who actually give a crap are systematically demoralised because the equipment in their care, and the job itself, are being knocked down steadily, gradually infecting even the best with same no one cares plague as all the other crap places out there.

So big cheeses, who’s to blame then, at the golf club you can moan about drivers…but who employed them, who’s mismanaging them for you? the managers you employed or promoted, teir upon tier of people where the few that do actually care are taken the ■■■■ out of by the ones just along for the ride, this is rife at all levels within companies.

Ultimately the fault rests with those at the very top, whilst they allow their various dept managers to tag along for the ride, this situation will just get worse as the ever fewer who do care at all levels have the stuffing knocked out of them.

For what its worth the damage done to the lorry i was issued with 5 years ago is about 50/50 agency and permanent staff.

Sometimes you talk sense, however this time you talk [zb]. Nothing to do with top men, the standard of driver and driving standards have been falling for years.
LGV test far too easy and any muppet can pass. Same with cars etc. Until that changes we will get appalling driving standards.

I think juddian’s point is whilst “any muppet” can get a licence it doesn’t mean you have to employ them.

That or invest some training in them rather than be surprised and moan when they do damage

Yes I realise that but my point is there are very few drivers worth taking on! I have TM mates and they tell me standards are appalling although I can see that most days out on the roads.

Then your mates need to pay better wages to attract the decent ones out there.

Or then have a choice of not employing them (lost work) or actually invest some time and money in training them. I am a new pass been driving 3 months now. I still have a huge amount to learn but I had my first 2 weeks with another driver and I learnt a huge amount in that time. Maybe if company’s invested some time training standards would rise. Rather than expect top drivers for less than top money and complain they can’t get them

[dr_damon]

Hang on fella, I do know a few transport managers but the two who I am more friendly with are actually X drivers and it certainly is not up to them to increase drivers wages.
As for companies investing money to train drivers, I would imagine most do not have spare finance for that. Drivers in the past learned themselves after passing a test (and standards were far higher than now) but attitudes seem to have changed recently. Drivers do not help each other, do not communicate and will not stick up for each other.

I just hope the driver you learned from knew what he was doing and was not teaching bad habits. Just because they have experience does not mean they are doing things correctly.
If you are expecting transport to change and improve you will be sadly disappointed especially when it comes to wages. Drivers (some) have shown they are not capable hence autonomy is coming fast.