gingerfold:
ramone:
gingerfold:
ramone:
Which was the better coach The Leyland Leopa4d 680 0r the AEC Relliance AH760 there seemed to be more Leopards about than AECsThere’s probably not a definitive, objective, answer to that question because there was no “standard” specification for either. For instance the Reliance could be specified with a ZF 6-speed synchro-box, or the semi-automatic Pneumo-cyclic 'box. Some operators even fitted the D203 6-speed overdrive constant mesh box as used in Mandators. Similarly the Leopard had options. Both the AEC AH690 and horizontal Leyland O.680 engines were de-rated, so worked well within their capabilities. I have heard it said by knowledgeable bus people that the Reliance had the better chassis and suspension by the late 1970s when AEC production was coming to an end. The end result of a contest between the Leopard and the Reliance would probably be an honorable draw; both were excellent premium quality coaches in their day. After production ceased it was reckoned that a Volvo coach of the 1980s was the nearest vehicle to a Reliance or Leopard on the market. As for there seeming to be more Leopards than Reliances that was because of Leyland’s latter years policy of always pushing the Leyland brand and pricing the Reliance higher.
I asked on an earlier thread why the higher power wasnt available on the Reliance and someone said they didnt have an axle to cope , couldnt a mandator axle work or is it more complex . A rear engined TL12 would have been interesting
When you look at some of the long distance route timings achieved by Yelloway of Rochdale (Reliances), Premier Travel of Cambridge (Reliances), Abbots of Blackpool (Reliances), Ellen Smith of Rochdale (Leopards), Ribble (Leopards) I think the answer would be that there wasn’t any need for higher power. They were running daily services from the North West to as far as Torquay in timings that a modern day high powered coach wouldn’t better. Obviously modern traffic conditions are more difficult and the coaches are speed limited. I once travelled from Manchester to Cheltenham on a Yelloway Reliance and it was a constant and steady 70 mph down the M6 and M5. That had the ZF 6-speed 'box and the rear axle ratio would have been about 4.25:1. My only worry was about a front tyre blowout! I looked what tyres it as was running on when we got to Cheltenham. 11.00 x 20 Michelins, so that was reassuring.
I think you have inadvertently answered or part answered the question to another thread Why did British Leyland fail ? The Leopard and Reliance pushing out 165 bhp was adequate at the time with respectable journey times but shouldn’t they have been thinking further ahead. AEC certainly had done earlier with the V8 Sabre so i wonder why they didn’t drop the TL12 into it when introduced. Volvo came along with their F88 engined coach and the writing was on the wall , they even rubbed our noses in it by buying Leyland Bus and subsequently closing it down .