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11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:18 pm
by Wee Man
Hi guys, can you clarify this .....

If I have less than 11 hours complete rest, I can only do this x3 times over a 2 week period?

As it counts for reducing to 9 as it's less than 11 ?

Does POA come into it ?

Sorry bit confused don't want to get an infringement,

Cheers. :?

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:43 pm
by ROG
You can do a max of 3 reduced daily rest between any two weekly rests

A weekly rest will be any rest period of 24+ hours

You can have a reduced daily rest of 10 hrs 59 mins - that does not mean it counts as 9 hours because it is 10.59

POA does not count as rest

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:54 pm
by Wee Man
ROG wrote:You can do a max of 3 reduced daily rest between any two weekly rests

A weekly rest will be any rest period of 24+ hours

You can have a reduced daily rest of 10 hrs 59 mins - that does not mean it counts as 9 hours because it is 10.59

POA does not count as rest


Ok thanks rog,

So if it's 9h59m it auto goes to 9h ? As it's not a complete 10?

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:06 pm
by ROG
Wee Man wrote:
ROG wrote:You can do a max of 3 reduced daily rest between any two weekly rests

A weekly rest will be any rest period of 24+ hours

You can have a reduced daily rest of 10 hrs 59 mins - that does not mean it counts as 9 hours because it is 10.59

POA does not count as rest


Ok thanks rog,

So if it's 9h59m it auto goes to 9h ? As it's not a complete 10?

No - it goes to 9h59m

The regs work in minutes

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:45 pm
by Wee Man
ROG wrote:
Wee Man wrote:
ROG wrote:You can do a max of 3 reduced daily rest between any two weekly rests

A weekly rest will be any rest period of 24+ hours

You can have a reduced daily rest of 10 hrs 59 mins - that does not mean it counts as 9 hours because it is 10.59

POA does not count as rest


Ok thanks rog,

So if it's 9h59m it auto goes to 9h ? As it's not a complete 10?

No - it goes to 9h59m


The regs work in minutes


So you basically have to be bang on 9h not 8h59m not 9h01 then? Just wanted to know the round up point.

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:54 pm
by tachograph
I'm not quite sure what you mean but any rest period of less than 11 hours but not less than 9 hours is a reduced daily rest period, if the rest period is less than 9 hours it's not a valid daily rest period, if less than 9 hours rest are completed within the period of 24 hours it's not a valid daily rest period.

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:16 pm
by Wee Man
Sorry I'm not explaining myself very well,

I'm on about the amount of times you can reduce your daily rest period, as I see it as you can only do this x3 over a 2 week period,

So if your having less than 11 hours rest on say x4 occasions over a 2 week period will I get an infringement ? No matter if it's one minute under the reduced requirement of 11 hours.

I hope that's a bit clearer.

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:35 pm
by tachograph
Wee Man wrote:So if your having less than 11 hours rest on say x4 occasions over a 2 week period will I get an infringement ?

Not necessarily, you can have a reduced daily rest period 3 times between weekly rest periods not 3 times in 2 weeks :wink:

If you work Monday to Friday you can have 3 reduced daily rest periods Monday to Friday, if you work Thursday to Tuesday you can have 3 reduced daily rest periods Thursday to Tuesday ec't ec't...

A daily rest period of 10 hours 59 minutes is a reduced daily rest period, if you don't have a reduced daily rest period available you will get you an infringement for it, it may seem a bit harsh for the sake of 1 minute but I suppose the line has to be drawn somewhere.

Even on the last day of your working week, if you don't have a reduced daily rest period available and you can only fit 10 hours 59 minutes into the 24 hour period you will get an infringement, even if you're off work for the next 45 hours or more ............. crazy isn't it :)

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:07 pm
by Wee Man
Thanks for that tacho, makes more sense now,

I work mon - fri starting around 05:00 - 06:00 so my weekly rest period is plenty,

So I think I might get an infringement if I have one more as I worked this .......

Last week all 11 + 12 hour days apart from a 15h on Thursday *

Then this week ....

Mon 05:30 - 18:30 (13)
Tues 05:30 - 19:15 (13.75)*
Wed - 06:00 - 19:30 (13.5)*

Would that be right then ? Say for example tomorrow I can't be having less than 11h rest between thurs and coming in Friday ? But could say do a 15h on Friday as my rest period is the sat and Sunday before starting again Monday morning say 06:00 ? Then would be reset to the 3 again or my 2 reduced days from this week carry on to next week ?

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:48 pm
by tachograph
Wee Man wrote:Then this week ....

Mon 05:30 - 18:30 (13)
Tues 05:30 - 19:15 (13.75)*
Wed - 06:00 - 19:30 (13.5)*

Would that be right then ? Say for example tomorrow I can't be having less than 11h rest between thurs and coming in Friday ? But could say do a 15h on Friday as my rest period is the sat and Sunday before starting again Monday morning say 06:00 ? Then would be reset to the 3 again or my 2 reduced days from this week carry on to next week ?

You've had 2 reduced daily rest periods so you can have one more this week, it doesn't matter if it's tomorrow or Friday it's up-to you.
When you've completed a weekly rest period (regular or reduced) the 3 reduced daily rest periods are reset, so you can then have another 3 reduced daily rest periods before the next weekly rest period (so you can have another 3 reduced daily rest periods next week).

Apart from reduced daily rest periods you can also have split daily rest periods which allow you to do a 15 hour shift (if you need or want to) without having a reduced daily rest period.
A split daily rest period is when you have 3 consecutive hours rest during the shift and at-least 9 hours rest after the shift, as usual the 9 hour rest period has to be completed within 24 hours from the start of the shift.
A split daily rest period does not count as a reduced daily rest period.

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 3:58 pm
by Wee Man
Ok cool, think I've got it tacho thanks for that,

But ..........

Does POA come into it at all as I'm being told that it does and extends the day but surely the rest period is exactly that ?

Just for example

06:00 - 20:00 (14) but with 1 hour POA surely it doesn't bring it back to a (13) does it ?

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:05 pm
by ROG
Wee Man wrote:Ok cool, think I've got it tacho thanks for that,

But ..........

Does POA come into it at all as I'm being told that it does and extends the day but surely the rest period is exactly that ?

Just for example

06:00 - 20:00 (14) but with 1 hour POA surely it doesn't bring it back to a (13) does it ?

POA does not 'extend' shift time
POA suspends working time in the same way break does

Re: 11 Hour reduced rest rule.

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:29 pm
by tachograph
Wee Man wrote:Does POA come into it at all as I'm being told that it does and extends the day but surely the rest period is exactly that ?

Just for example

06:00 - 20:00 (14) but with 1 hour POA surely it doesn't bring it back to a (13) does it ?

POA doesn't count as working time but it doesn't count as rest either, so it has no affect on when you need to start a daily rest period.

If you start work at 06:00 and finish at 20:00 you've done a shift of 14 hours, regardless of how much POA you've booked it's a reduced daily rest period, you could have been on POA all day but it's still a shift of 14 hours and therefore a reduced daily rest period.

The only difference POA makes is to the amount of working time you've done, a shift of 14 hours with 1 hour break and 1 hour POA is a total of 12 hours working time, but it's still a shift of 14 hour so you will not be able to complete an 11 hour daily rest period within the 24 hours from the start of the shift, hence it's a reduced daily rest period.