I reckon you’ll enjoy this, Robroy.
Thanks mate…
Hmmm mixed views on some of that.
Is it from a dare I say it…‘Lefty perspective’ (God I
HATE those f…ers.) where it seems fashionable to pi55 all over our history?
Yeah a lot of facts, …the Russians lost a colossal amount of men in the East, nobody can, or will refute that .
As for us we were totally Donald Ducked in 1940, many of our men and most of our equipment was left and lost at Dunkerque.
The first stage of the Battle of the Atlantic,.and the Battle of Britain almost finished us.
Not taking away anything from the utmost bravery and duty of the RAF , (which Churchill used as a rousing propaganda exercise and rightly so) but Hitler could have just carried it on to the next wave and defeated us, but lucky for us he turned to Barbarossa…the invasion of Russia.
Most of his troops there died in the harsh winter, the same troops could or would have crushed our brave depleted army no problem,.crack fit troops against a defeated demoralised army.
So her being an American herself can bad mouth them all she likes, but they did save us if only by shear numbers.
I could go on all night on this stuff, but I have no wish to bore the arses off everyone, so yeah a lot of facts, but many of what she calls ‘‘myths’’ are also facts…(IMO.)
My late grandmother said if the Germans did win the war and take over the country she would commit suicide.
Apart from the US Navy providing some escorts during the Battle of the Atlantic and providing some of the Merchant ships The USA had little involvment in the European theatre until November 1942 when they primarily were fighting the Vichy French. It was not until February 1943 that they confronted the German Army ..and got a bloody nose. By that time, post El Alamein, Chuchill was talking about “the end of the beginning”,
Certainly the USA was involved in the Struggle against the Japanese from late 1941 , but that was in answer to them actually being attacked themselves.
Some US citizens however chose to volunteer to fight in British uniforms under British Control from mid 1940.
The US did provide materiel assistance to Britain under the Lend Lease Act - for which they were paid- however this did not really start until it became clear that Britain was not in imminent danger of being defeated and the Germans had turned their attention towards Russia.
As an indication of the British contribution to the German defeat in Normandy and Belgium, the casualties suffered by the British and Canadians exceeded (proportionately to numbers involved) those of WW1 battles, so bad in fact that many volunteers for the RAF were remustered during training for the Army as replacements.
Yeah the actual turning point did not start to 42 when the US came in after the lend lease,
Britain was not technically on their own, there were the Canadians, then Poles, and Australians in the mix.
Aftet the US arrived, the Allied offensives started against Germany, starting with them entering the air bombing campaign.
It would be fair to say that the US entered the European andNorth African Theatres of WW2 in a similar frame of mind to that of their initial participation in WW1; namely that they had seen the erronious tactics of the British, and their own - sometimes more gung ho - methods were best. Sadly when put to the test they did not know best and made the same mistakes that the British had earlier made. In both eras they sadly underestimated their opponent’s abilities and overestimated their own. Viz The Kasserine Pass failure and unescorted daylight raids by ‘self defending’ heavy bombers upon long range targets.
However, their initial low key short range air campaign in 1942 with attacks by bombers on Poesti and Wilhelmshaven fortunately did not meet with the same level of German response which the RAF had met in 1939 and they themselves were later to experience on these targets.
The following links may be of interest:
Ironically both the Soviet Union and US WW2 started in 1941 not 1939.No bombs dropped on Russia by the Luftwaffe in 1939 like Warsaw or 1940 like London, Plymouth and Coventry etc.Or any Russians killed fighting in Belgium and France then either.
The former was too busy helping their German Socialist Workers Party allies to invade and occupy Poland.
The Americans were too worried about upsetting their German Socialist Workers’ Party supporters at home.
A bit like how the US Communist Party helped China win the Vietnam War in addition to making a mockery of the US Cold War against Communism.
12 May 1940 Many will have seen the fictitious Film Saving Private Ryan This is the real McCoy. Mr & Mrs Garland lost all four sons to the RAF in WW2
Mr & Mrs Gray lost three of their five sons to the RAF in WW2
Donald Garland VC age 21and Thomas Gray VC age 26 are buried in the same communal grave together with crewmate Lawrence ‘Roy’ Reynolds age 20 who received nothing.
To be fair no more the real McCoy than this.
The story line was all about saving the last one left of the parents’ line and them maybe considered too old to have another.Not some or most of them.Maybe the difference in the humanity that applies in an ideology whereby the individual and saving the individual ( family ), is viewed as being just as important, as saving the collective and the hive Soviet and Chinese style.
Edward Francis Niland (December 22, 1912 – February 28, 1984),[2]
Preston Thomas Niland (March 6, 1915 – June 7, 1944)
Robert Joseph “Bob” Niland (February 2, 1919 – June 6, 1944)
Frederick William “Fritz” Niland (April 23, 1920 – December 1, 1983),
I make that 2 sons died and 2 survived.
Eisenhower 'thought" that 3 of them ‘had’ ‘died’ ‘before’ he ordered removal of the 4th from the line.
Also check out the stories of the Borgstrom Brothers and Sullivan Brothers if you think that the story of the Nilands doesn’t cut it.
Yes we know that things would be different in the Soviet Union and Chinese PLA red Armies.
Hardly fictitious, it was based on a true series of events.
Ok maybe not wholly accurate to what actually happened, but dramatic licence is in all ‘True story’ movies…especially those made by Americans.
But still an excellent WW2 film imo,… and not bettered since.
(Maybe apart from the 'Band of Brothers’series, made by the same team.)
The Omaha beach landing sequence was far from fictitious, it is the best portrayl of it I have ever seen at least, and wholly accurate from what I have read.
To be honest I found that scene inside the house when the German soldier chased the American soldier up the stairs then they had a fight, the American got pinned down by the German as he put his hands over the American soldiers mouth, told him in German to hush,then very slowly inserted the dagger in to his heart to be a very graphic moment in cinema history.
Ironically it also showed the base human instinct of wanting the ‘coward’ shown running away to instead avenge the victim.Whereas the intention of the scene was probably more about finding the humanity to resist that and to think it was just an example of what war really means for all those involved.
The MG42 scene was also poignant in that regard.With instinct saying kill its surviving operator when having to euthanise their wounded medic at his own request.
Of the limited amount that my Father would say about his war service it was the effects of the 88 anti tank gun on tanks and their crews and the MG42 and Teller mines on soft skinned vehicles and personnel which are what seemed to stay with him.
No doubt our armchair general is one of those who thinks it was unjustified Tiger/88 phobia and the MG42’s bark was worse than its bite.
When the truth is a burst of MG42 fire could shred the occupants of a Diamond T cab or anyone standing near it without/before ever hearing the buzz saw report.
Similar in the case of an 88 round hitting a tank without any need to penetrate it.
That’s a very sagacious, sapient and and a perspicacious post CF, the dagger plunging scene was a reality of war especially when the ammunition has ran out or the weapon suffers a jam as in the components getting stuck or seized up, this was quite common in sandy conditions, if fighting in the desert, so regular cleaning and oiling is essential.
The euthanasia scene was in my opinion a well acted scene by the administration of excess morphine and it was portrayed by the actor in such a realistic manner, they do say that men call out for the mother’s in their last few minutes of death, it must be hard wired in our brains since humans were living in caves.
The body language and facial expressions by Tom Hanks in the action of authorising the morphine is another masterpiece by the actor where his crew knew exactly what he wanted to do without talking.
Fun fact:
sagacious, wasn’t even a word before Carryfast was born. It was his mum who invented it for his middle name.
Geoffrey Sagacious Carryfast. It sounds like Roman nobility.
It’s got a ring to it and rolls off the tongue.
It could have been added to the script in Gladiator with Russell Crowe.
I did think gladiator, alas it was but a fleeting thought, he’s never had that much energy.
The fight scene in the forest was quite good.