hi, i am currently working through my hgv class 2 then class 1 and would like some clarification on working hours.
i currently work between 55 and 60 hours driving a forklift in a warehouse (nights) and would like to do agency work on the weekends when i get my licence but having looked into working time rules i already do more hours “work” than drivers are allowed so i would not have any working hours left to drive on a Sunday.
am i correct on this that i would be unable to do odd days driving to get experience without having to book holidays with my current job
If you work permanent nights you are legally only allowed to do 8 hrs per night maximum, averaged over 17 weeks , and you MUST have 90 hrs per week off every week.
So driving isnt going to happen as you cannot get enough time to drive legally.
3 wheeler:
If you work permanent nights you are legally only allowed to do 8 hrs per night maximum, averaged over 17 weeks , and you MUST have 90 hrs per week off every week.
So driving isnt going to happen as you cannot get enough time to drive legally.
3 wheeler:
If you work permanent nights you are legally only allowed to do 8 hrs per night maximum, averaged over 17 weeks , and you MUST have 90 hrs per week off every week.
So driving isnt going to happen as you cannot get enough time to drive legally.
Unless you opt out.
I don’t think anyone bothers with the WTD now anyway. VOSA don’t care, plod don’t care, employers don’t care and nor do any drivers. I haven’t bothered with it for years. Just make an effort to have a half hour break before 9 hours into your shift if you don’t need a tacho break beforehand and on your time sheet at the end of the week tot up your total worked hours and if it’s more than 48 hours just pluck some random figures out of your head and stick them in the POA column to get your worked hours under 48. And yes I am serious!
I was going to say that if the OP wants to be the only person on the planet to religiously care about the WTD then he is absolutely correct.
If he takes the view that no-one anywhere (as far as I can see) checks up on it, then it seems (at first glance) that he could do a shift every other weekend and comply with EU driving hours regs, and pass muster if VOSA ever stop him. The weekly rest is the thing to watch when you have 2 jobs (like I do)
th2013:
I was going to say that if the OP wants to be the only person on the planet to religiously care about the WTD then he is absolutely correct.
If he takes the view that no-one anywhere (as far as I can see) checks up on it, then it seems (at first glance) that he could do a shift every other weekend and comply with EU driving hours regs, and pass muster if VOSA ever stop him. The weekly rest is the thing to watch when you have 2 jobs (like I do)
Not allowed to opt out if a permanent night worker !!!, and if a serious traffic offence happens it will be someone like my Brother in Law (Plod) that nicks him and his employer I bet. You oly get away with it until [ zb] happens.
3 wheeler:
If you work permanent nights you are legally only allowed to do 8 hrs per night maximum, averaged over 17 weeks , and you MUST have 90 hrs per week off every week.
So driving isnt going to happen as you cannot get enough time to drive legally.
AVERAGE OR MAXIMUM - do not spread it…
AVERAGE AND MAXIMUM ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS !!!
Yet managed to put them both in one.
I fixed it for you.
3 wheeler:
If you work permanent nights you are legally only allowed to do 8 hrs per night , averaged over 17 weeks , and you MUST have 90 hrs per week off every week.
So driving isnt going to happen as you cannot get enough time to drive legally.
th2013:
I was going to say that if the OP wants to be the only person on the planet to religiously care about the WTD then he is absolutely correct.
If he takes the view that no-one anywhere (as far as I can see) checks up on it, then it seems (at first glance) that he could do a shift every other weekend and comply with EU driving hours regs, and pass muster if VOSA ever stop him. The weekly rest is the thing to watch when you have 2 jobs (like I do)
Not allowed to opt out if a permanent night worker !!!, and if a serious traffic offence happens it will be someone like my Brother in Law (Plod) that nicks him and his employer I bet. You oly get away with it until [ zb] happens.
So true - no one enforces it unless accident happen and than you are …d
Guys , a question here, but please only reply if you know it 100%
Lets say, If I reduce my daily rest on monday to 9 hrs then on tuesday to 9 hrs ( basicaly go below 11 hours between finishing my ■■■■ on monday and starting on tuesday and between finishing my shift on tuesday and starting my shift on wednesday, spending at work around 14 - 15 hrs each of those days) and then I do 13.5 hrs on wednesday but get 11 hrs rest that night and start on thursday morning after having 11 hrs rest. How many hours am I allowed to work on thursday and friday?
When I say work, I mean time between inserting my digi card into UTC and pulling it out from UTC at the end of the shift, including POA and breaks taken on that given day.
I’ve heard somewhere that I am allowed to spend at work three up to 15 hrs shifts per week, not sure if that is true and two 12 hrs shifts.
Can anyone knowledgeable answer these questions , please.
hkloss1:
Guys , a question here, but please only reply if you know it 100%
Lets say, If I reduce my daily rest on monday to 9 hrs then on tuesday to 9 hrs ( basicaly go below 11 hours between finishing my [zb] on monday and starting on tuesday and between finishing my shift on tuesday and starting my shift on wednesday, spending at work around 14 - 15 hrs each of those days) and then I do 13.5 hrs on wednesday but get 11 hrs rest that night and start on thursday morning after having 11 hrs rest. How many hours am I allowed to work on thursday and friday?
When I say work, I mean time between inserting my digi card into UTC and pulling it out from UTC at the end of the shift, including POA and breaks taken on that given day.
I’ve heard somewhere that I am allowed to spend at work three up to 15 hrs shifts per week, not sure if that is true and two 12 hrs shifts.
Can anyone knowledgeable answer these questions , please.
Thank you
You can reduce your daily rest to 9 hours, 3 times a week.
If you do more than a 13 hour shift then it counts as a reduce daily rest (9 hours) no matter how much rest you actually have.
Three 15 hrs, and three 13 hrs if you want 84 hrs max! 15 hrs and 9 hrs off no problem 15 hrs and eleven off no problem as its still a reducer! 13 hrs and one min equals a reducer as does 13 hrs spread and 10hrs 59 mins off count as a reducer! So OP for 100% Thursday and Friday no more than thirteen hours pal!
Fork lift driving is under WTD
LGV driving is under RTD
I cannot see anything in the RTD regulations that says the normal WTD must count for the RTD
This being correct then its only the RTD which counts for the normal WTD which has no legal limitations on the total amount of time worked in any week
If working as a fork lift driver mon to fri then only one day every other weekend is likely for legal LGV driving under EU regs because of the required weekly rest of 45 unbroken hours every other week and a minimum of 24 unbroken hours in the weeks where a 45 is not required
The daily rest requirements would also need to be adhered to so you if you started FLT work at 10 pm on fri then went directly on to LGV driving your daily rest of 9 hours would need to start by 1pm saturday
What are your FLT work times and what driving times are you intending to do?
hkloss1:
Guys , a question here, but please only reply if you know it 100%
Lets say, If I reduce my daily rest on monday to 9 hrs then on tuesday to 9 hrs ( basicaly go below 11 hours between finishing my [zb] on monday and starting on tuesday and between finishing my shift on tuesday and starting my shift on wednesday, spending at work around 14 - 15 hrs each of those days) and then I do 13.5 hrs on wednesday but get 11 hrs rest that night and start on thursday morning after having 11 hrs rest. How many hours am I allowed to work on thursday and friday?
When I say work, I mean time between inserting my digi card into UTC and pulling it out from UTC at the end of the shift, including POA and breaks taken on that given day.
I’ve heard somewhere that I am allowed to spend at work three up to 15 hrs shifts per week, not sure if that is true and two 12 hrs shifts.
Can anyone knowledgeable answer these questions , please.
Thank you
You can reduce your daily rest to 9 hours, 3 times a week.
If you do more than a 13 hour shift then it counts as a reduce daily rest (9 hours) no matter how much rest you actually have.
Hi FarnboroughBoy11
Thanks for your reply.
Would you be willing to attach a link to some official document (instruction) that would mention “If you do more than a 13 hour shift then it counts as a reduce daily rest (9 hours) no matter how much rest you actually have”?
I’ve checked some online but couldn’t see that anywhere.
and one more question.
So I still can work up to 13 hrs shifts on thursday and friday, is that right?
When I say shifts, I mean time spent at work driving , doing other work, POA and breaks, basically time from inserting my digi card into UTC, to pulling it out at the end of the shift.
I’m talking here about day shifts, not night shifts.
You can reduce daily rest to as little as 9 hours 3 times between weekly rests which is not the same as every week
week means the fixed week which is sunday midnight to sunday midnight
Any rest less than 11 hours but at least 9 hours is a reduced daily rest
Daily rest must fit into the 24 hour period from the end of the last daily or weekly rest
If the next shift starts before the 24 hour period is up then the daily rest is from the end of the last shift to the start of the next shift
Using the length of a shift can often get the driver confused as to the required rest so its best to stick with the required rest time as described above
hkloss1:
and one more question.
So I still can work up to 13 hrs shifts on thursday and friday, is that right?
When I say shifts, I mean time spent at work driving , doing other work, POA and breaks, basically time from inserting my digi card into UTC, to pulling it out at the end of the shift.
I’m talking here about day shifts, not night shifts.
Day or night makes no difference - the only thing with night shifts is the RTD requirements but that only refers to the working time done in the shift and not the shift time
I could say yes to your 13 hours shifts but only if every shift started at the same time every day
Lets say you did 5 x 13 hour shifts but each shift started 1 hour earlier than the last
That would mean the time between each shift was 10 hours so 4 would be reduced daily rests which is illegal
This is why using the shift time lengths does not work
Monday start at 5:30 am - finish at 20:20
Tuesday start at 6:00 am - finish at 20:30
Wednesday start at 6:30 am - finish at 20:00
Thursday start 7:10 am - finish ? (what time finish? How many hours max, can I spend at work on Thursday?)
Assuming I had at least 11 hrs rest after the end of my Thursday shift
Friday - how many hrs can I spend at work max legally?
Monday start at 5:30 am - finish at 20:20
Tuesday start at 6:00 am - finish at 20:30
Wednesday start at 6:30 am - finish at 20:00
Thursday start 7:10 am - finish ? (what time finish? How many hours max, can I spend at work on Thursday?)
Assuming I had at least 11 hrs rest after the end of my Thursday shift
Friday - how many hrs can I spend at work max legally?
Saturday and Sunday days off
Thanks
Dunno because you have not given the driving time plus other work time total for RTD
For EU driver regs you have already taken 3 reduced daily rests so must finish by 2010 thurs and must not start fri before at least 11 hours rest have been taken then fri must be a max shift of 13 hours
Hi
sorry, couldn’t continue last night as I had to go to bed
“Dunno because you have not given the driving time plus other work time total for RTD”
It doesn’t matter how many hours I did “driving” and how many “other work” as we are not calculating how many hours I worked in total this given week (this is being done at the end of every week, or you can calculate it yourself to make sure you do not go over 60 hours of work in total for this given week), I’m only trying to find out how many hours I can spend at work ( from the time I insert my digi card into the UTC in the morning until the time I pull it out off the UTC in the evening) on Thursday and Friday.
Why are you saying I’ve already used my three reduced daily rests?
a. On Monday my daily rest was 9:40 hrs (yes-reduced)
b. On Tuesday my daily rest was 10 hrs (yes - reduced)
c. On Wednesday my daily rest was 11:10 ( so, not reduced)?
Will be at work the whole day today, so won’t be able to reply until night time tonight.
Thanks
hkloss1:
2. Why are you saying I’ve already used my three reduced daily rests?
a. On Monday my daily rest was 9:40 hrs (yes-reduced)
b. On Tuesday my daily rest was 10 hrs (yes - reduced)
c. On Wednesday my daily rest was 11:10 ( so, not reduced)?
Wednesday start at 6:30 am - finish at 20:00
24 hour period starts at 0630 so to fit in a regular daily rest before 0630 the next day the daily rest must start by 1930
The shift length was 13.5 hours so the max daily rest time which fits into the 24 hour period is 10.5 hours (13.5+10.5=24)
The rest taken from 0630 to 0710 (40 mins) thursday morning does not count as rest for the regs because it is outside the 24 hour period
if you want 84 hrs max! 
15 hrs and eleven off no problem as its still a reducer! 13 hrs and one min equals a reducer as does 13 hrs spread and 10hrs 59 mins off count as a reducer! So OP for 100% Thursday and Friday no more than thirteen hours pal!