Is the matter with the young drivers these days? they can’t keep 'em the proper way up.
On local TV news this morning there were three road closures in Yorkshire (one was the M62) because lorries were rusty side up, blocking the road. In 45+ years on the tankers I never managed to get one to roll over. 
I’ve a ■■■■ good idea why, they live in a world of soft sprung cabs, air suspension drivers seats, etc. etc. isolated from what’s going on, they can’t FEEL what the motor is doing.
modern times brian , the "gears to go , brakes to slow " mantra . lorries are over designed nowadays , drivers are treated as if they are incapable of thinking and making decisions for themselves , so they don’t bother . anything goes wrong , they are totally unprepared for it and don’t have a clue how to cope . just be grateful we are out of it and they can’t drag us down to their level .cheers , dave
time moves on fellas. Just because younger drivers have never experienced crash gear boxes and putting a tin of beans on the manifold of a truck that wouldn’t pass todays road safety checks doesn’t make them any less of a driver. They still do the job just in different times.
ive found a lot of older blokes are a problem think a lot of them take retraining as an option or see a sign on a lampost £500 a week and can some one explain to me why experienced drivers have got satnavs ?
no offence meant lee , i was just pointing out that the constant dumbing down of the industry in general is having a detrimental effect . also the fact that there are drivers and screwdrivers , always have been , always will be . the comfort and quietness of todays truck must make it very easy to lose concentration on a long boring run . cheers , dave
There is a new control system being fitted to one manufacturer’s lorries, according to an ex-colleague of mine who works there. If it detects the onset of a rollover- presumably by monitoring airbag pressure- it applies the brakes. Great- having entered a corner a bit too fast, the driver now has a potential skid to contend with. Presumably, there is another system, to control the skid.
I once saw a video of an artic avoiding a car, which had strayed into its path. The driver threw the tractor unit sideways, which slowed the vehicle somewhat, and also set it up in a direction to swerve around the car. He steered it out of the jacknife and simply drove around the obstacle, all in a split-second. Imagine trying to do this, with the interference of multiple software algorithms, meddling with the controls.
I agree with the above post, in regard that modern vehicles hide the laws of physics from the driver, until he is in a dangerous situation. It is the same with cars- they have good tyre grip but give no feel of the road. They are designed to understeer, when the limit of grip is exceeded, rendering the steering wheel useless.These “clever” systems simply encourage all drivers, whatever their skill, to corner at the same limit, then crash in the same way. They may be safer in the hands of idiots but, I fear, may prevent better drivers from using their skills to avoid accidents. Progress in the engineering of tyres, brakes and suspension has been wasted.
hear ya Rigsby, no offence taken mate, I was just offering a different point of view.
one of our 08s when pushed hard intae a corner slows down /brakes by its self ,to say its a very strange feeling is an understatment ,the old girl i drive (99) can go round this wide open corner a bit faster and still be and feel safe!.
why have experienced drivers got sat navs?.. imo to be prepared for any occassions ,roadworks,closures.sent somewhere new.after all time is money nowadays.
jimmy.
I’m afraid that, from my position of advanced grumpyness, my view is very simple.
I don’t need a vehicle to think for me, I can do that myself. I don’t need a vehicle that tells me if i have crossed a white line because I know if I have done that or not and I don’t need an automatic gearbox because I know how to drive a proper one. It’s called experience you know.
So if you want a computer to drive your truck Boss then hire one. Me? I’m a driver (and proud of it)
David
i’ll agree with that david , now retired , but my car is bog standard , no cruise control , and no fancy gadgets . it does what i want it to do , when and how i want , not some spotty oik looking for another useless selling point . cheers , dave
David Miller:
I’m afraid that, from my position of advanced grumpyness, my view is very simple.I don’t need a vehicle to think for me, I can do that myself. I don’t need a vehicle that tells me if i have crossed a white line because I know if I have done that or not and I don’t need an automatic gearbox because I know how to drive a proper one. It’s called experience you know.
So if you want a computer to drive your truck Boss then hire one. Me? I’m a driver (and proud of it)
David
Hey David Miller, are you still from the 19th century, like me who only can drive a fuller box,repair an old days lorry and fiddle with 
are you.Than change to driving a horse and cart, we simply can’t keep up with the youth who can’t start out if the GPS doesn’t work or change a tyre.
Cheers Eric,
Makes me chuckle gentlemen, was down at the old firm the other day just chewing on times gone by, and John, semi-retired appeared in the yard, got to go and fetch an ERF c series from other yard because the drivers■■? that were about couldn’t drive a twin splitter,DOH 
So i’m in agreement with you old school boys. I was asked the other day by a young whipper snapper how did you find your way about? err they were called Maps and we used to talk to the other guys to see who’d been where," Aye lad go down road to the Rose @ Crown do a left, carry on to The Fox @ Hounds do a right", ah the good old days. Just another, I’ve not seen a driver at the side of the road in a while changing a wheel or with the cab up!! Brought my old gal back from southern Spain on three wheels { tandem axle trailor ] a good few year ago, that was intresting at 48 ton, but got her home, oh and head gasket middle of France another time, WHAT get your hands dirty ooh don’t know about that boss 
these new drivers avant got a clue give em a map and a atki strato with the eaton twin splitter in they be snaffhoo iam 31 been in the job all my life and masterd the fullers and eaton boxes in my teens whilst shunting coal round immingham docks been on the road 13 year now past at 18 on the young drivers scheme i dont have a sat nav just the old map i always wounder how they roll em over to busy on there i pod ear phones in dont know how they can hear whats going on 
In all fairness there have always been rollover’s etc, there were two occasions in 1975 when the Midland Hotel in Matlock Bath nearly came to grief due to tankers falling over on the bend in the A6. Also plenty of lorry runaways down Cromford and Lime Tree hills, Sydnope Hill, Steep Turnpike etc which rarely occour these days so things are possibly better than they were!
Pete.
Are you sure there are more “roll over” accidents now than in the good old days that are always being refered to on these posts?
Maybe it sounds more because virtually every accident that is causing a hold up on any M’way in U.K. is reported every 30 mins on national radio [usualy "Radio 2] along with local radio…
In years gone by there were not all these so called “traffic reports” during all daylight hours so there may have been numerous accidents we were not aware of.
As for “we were better drivers” then – well I’m old enough to remember when we were treated as labourers who happened to have the ability to drive a vehicle. Although I qualified for my HGV licence under the “grandfather” rules I was also compelled to take a test because as an employee of Shell Mex & BP that [along with training] was mandatory!! I wonder how many of the “good old boys” qualified for their licences under the same rule but took their self taught bad driving habits with them.
As far as HGV drivers go we all think we’re better – had it harder – know more than all later generations. My father could tell me how he drove a Maudsley that was on solid tyres, chain driven and he sat on a solid fixed seat & by his standards when I drove an eight wheeler with a semblance of power steering I was having it “soft”…
The road junction is still exactly the same so this would still apply.
A20 Mottingham traffic lights London bound 40 limit. My AEC Mercury would make creaking noises from the front springs as it swayed over the hump where the two roads met. On creak - fine, two - too fast. Never let it make three.
Hey, i have already said what i think about electonic trucks,but a word more of it, of course you become with ease to be used with modern comforts and that makes a human lazy.And new technology or electonics are made to use,but we are from the old school and can’t adapt us and youth make it them easy.
New technology is not always bed but to much is to much. If things become more safe like ABS or all other it makes it easy to drive faster in bends or later braking to stop. Take for instance speed limiters you set the speedcontrol and let drive the lorry,it’s easy because pushing the pedal constandly to the ground makes it tiresome.Because with a limiter you can’t control your speed easlily.So and of my part diving on the limiter is dangerous because of causing to fall asleep,less attention and even some will keep themself doing something else or looking around with all the consequences.In old days of course you had to been carefull with as example an artic without an load sensing valve on the rearaxle in wet wetter,and so you learned to be carefull. And last but not least it mustn’t be like in my fathers days just after WWII,with a fixed seat,no heating and only one single line braking system and not to speek about the bed stoned ways.And in slippery days if you were snowed up cause of no salt speaders"but in those days a pub was never far away" 
.
Cheers Eric,
rigsby:
i’ll agree with that david , now retired , but my car is bog standard , no cruise control , and no fancy gadgets . it does what i want it to do , when and how i want , not some spotty oik looking for another useless selling point . cheers , dave
My lad is a fitter with Volvo Truck and Bus, he tells me that the very latest Volvo model just about to be introduced has 4…count 'em, battery settings (modes), the driver has to select what mode he requires. What the hell are they on about? 4 modes? that’s something else to go wrong and require a main dealer visit to sort out. I KNOW how to look after a battery, I sure as hell don’t need 4 modes/settings.
I think one of the points I was trying to make was us old lads KNEW what a motor was capable of, we learned the art on 50/60s motors (plus a it of roping and sheeting as a by product). Us older lads could use one of the new modern motors (the only problem i would have now is climbing all those bloody steps to get into the saddle) AND we know how to use the old motors, there are a lot of the younger fellas can’t say the same.
It’s not boasting i don’t think, It’s a bit of pride that we could do it. I would have loved to have been able to master and use a Foden/Sentinal steamer with chain drive. One or two of those young wannabe TV superstars on the ES series made be cringe.
Half of the younger brigade of drivers wouldn’t have a clue of how to get some of the old motors through the gears.They wouldn’t know how to double declutch or find half the gears with the gearstick stuck by the side of the engine cover and about 30 inches long.
Cheers Dave.
Some cracking comments and reasons in this topic as to why “Roll-overs” appear to occur in today’s industry. It’s probably a valid argument that air suspended seats, softer suspension, and braking systems don’t really give a true feel as to how the vehicle is responding to road/weather conditions, driving speeds etc. Many older boys may think, as I do, that these modern introductions to wagon design maybe give today’s driver a false sense of security that they cannot respond to quickly enough in times of emergency. Although it is a step up in driver care I agree that comfort, cosiness and very little in cab interaction with the vehicle ie due to lack of gear changes etc would tend to make a driver lax in his observations. That’s when things become dangerous and maybe on too many occasions everything goes ■■■’s up.