ROG:
EASY - the SUV was in a lane that did not allow it to go right (see previous posts) so if it wanted to change its mind then ok but it must indicate its intentions and give way to those already in the other lane
As I said - EASY
In a lane that did not allow it to go right■■? Well that is not evident on the video. There are no lane markings so I don’t understand how you can say that.
Poor explanation really.
I suggest you look at the lane approach markings on google maps before commenting on that aspect
I really can’t be bothered with that. I then take it the van was in a lane for going left on approach and therefore was totally in the wrong?
Possibly traffic lights in these types of situations would help relieve the incompetence of drivers.
Drivers get into their heads that at roundabouts you must be in the left lane to go left, and must be in the right lane to go right without looking at road markings. So the suv driver probably made an assumption that the lorry is in the right lane so must be going right.
Few examples near me where those rules and assumptions are not the case.
Junction 19 M6 NB you come off and both left and right lane say Manchester on them which is right at the roundabout. Most people just go in the right lane. But then as everyone sets off people in the right lane move into the left lane on the roundabout itself thinking that traffic in the left lane on a approach will have gone left. Causes a lot of horn beeping.
M62/M66 junction westbound. There’s a dedicated lane to go left, the other 2 lanes both go right. Same as above, a lot of drivers go in the right lane to go right then try and move into the left lane once on the roundabout thinking that traffic that was waiting in the left will be going somewhere else. Traffic in right lane should go into the right lane on the roundabout and traffic in left lane go on left lane on roundabout. Both go right.
Then another one near me has 2 lanes on approach yet from the right lane it’s marked to turn left or go straight, or go right from the right lane. So if you go in that lane you can then go right at the next roundabout. That one baffles them when your sat in a right lane but then go left.
Perhaps it is worth knowing the facts before commenting
I was simply going by the video shown as evidence as I already said as 99% would do. I wonder why the full facts were not given in the write up?
It may just help people decide to make a clearer decision on the matter. Still reckon badly designed and truck could have taken more care and used a signal.
Others would have avoided a collision.
The biggest culprits here are the people who designed the road layout.
The lorry driver seemed to make the mistake of taking for granted that any vehicles on his nearside would turn left, he never even indicated, the SUV driver made the mistake of taking it for granted that anyone in lane 2 was not exiting the roundabout.
Although the SUV driver had put himself in the wrong lane when joining the roundabout the lorry driver moved into a lane where there was other vehicles without checking that it was safe to do so, so for me he has to accept most of the responsibility.
I’ve no idea why anyone would think the SUV was in a lane that didn’t allow it to bear right, in fact it looks like if you came off the A1 (12 o’clock in the image) and wanted to take the Lincoln road (6 o’clock) the lane markings would put you in the same place as the SUV.
The lorry with the red trailer in the image has got it near enough right in my opinion.
The red lorry is in the wrong lane if heading for A17 and trying to move right to get in the A17 lane after exiting is very difficult because it is a very short stretch between the two roundabouts hence why the lorry in the incident was in the correct lane for A17
Vehicles in the lane for A17 do not need to indicate as they are in a designated lane for that exit
The SUV on the other hand MUST indicate if it wants to go other than what that lane is designated for and MUST ensure it is safe to do so
ROG:
The red lorry is in the wrong lane if heading for A17 and trying to move right to get in the A17 lane after exiting is very difficult because it is a very short stretch between the two roundabouts hence why the lorry in the incident was in the correct lane for A17
Fair comment if he’s heading for the A17.
ROG:
Vehicles in the lane for A17 do not need to indicate as they are in a designated lane for that exit
People who wonder why driving standards are low should read that and weep
ROG:
The SUV on the other hand MUST indicate if it wants to go other than what that lane is designated for and MUST ensure it is safe to do so
If the lane was specifically designated for vehicles heading towards the A46/A17 there would be lane markings on the roundabout, there aren’t so it’s not a lane that’s specifically designated for a particular direction.
As I said before vehicles coming from the A1 are directed to that lane for the B6166 (Lincoln road) so even ignoring the fact that there are no appropriate lane markings on the roundabout how can it be designated specifically for vehicles heading towards the A46/A17
Lane markings are on the approach so no need for markings on the roundabout itself - would also get too busy with paint if all the roundabout was done that way
All my comments come from an advanced driving and LGV instructing viewpoint so the standards I would say are ‘pretty high’ especially as those have been backed up by trafpol when I take my ongoing tests
id say the main culprit would be the wazzocks who painted the lane markings ( or the lack of them ) as its not uncommn for there to be a complete lack of them after certain points on large roundabouts like that which leads to a who dares win scenario.
ROG:
Lane markings are on the approach so no need for markings on the roundabout itself - would also get too busy with paint if all the roundabout was done that way
All my comments come from an advanced driving and LGV instructing viewpoint so the standards I would say are ‘pretty high’ especially as those have been backed up by trafpol when I take my ongoing tests
Come on, you are not the only one to do advanced driving and only instructing LGV for 3 years.Just a beginner then.
You are not thinking on the same lines as the average muppet driver unfortunately.
dieseldog999:
id say the main culprit would be the wazzocks who painted the lane markings ( or the lack of them ) as its not uncommn for there to be a complete lack of them after certain points on large roundabouts like that which leads to a who dares win scenario.
For once I make you right. Some of these junctions / roundabouts are totally beyond the understanding of most drivers. Apart from the muppets painting lines incorrectly sometimes the average motorist never looks at lines or markings!
Driverless vehicles will work far better when they arrive.
dieseldog999:
id say the main culprit would be the wazzocks who painted the lane markings ( or the lack of them ) as its not uncommn for there to be a complete lack of them after certain points on large roundabouts like that which leads to a who dares win scenario.
This 90%of the time^^^^^^^ there’s so many miles of highways in this country that have ■■■■ poor lineage or Faded to oblivion, Councils need to be held more accountable.
ROG:
Lane markings are on the approach so no need for markings on the roundabout itself - would also get too busy with paint if all the roundabout was done that way
I’m sorry but that’s such bull[zb], but if that’s what you’re saying them presumably you’re going to say the lane is also a designated lane for the B6166, which incidently cuts right across the lane you claim is designated to vehicles heading onto the A46
ROG:
All my comments come from an advanced driving and LGV instructing viewpoint so the standards I would say are ‘pretty high’ especially as those have been backed up by trafpol when I take my ongoing tests
This says nothing for the ADI or the traffic police
dieseldog999:
id say the main culprit would be the wazzocks who painted the lane markings ( or the lack of them ) as its not uncommn for there to be a complete lack of them after certain points on large roundabouts like that which leads to a who dares win scenario.
I agree, personally I don’t agree with this idea of having no lane markings on roundabouts, or in some cases as few lane markings as they can get away with, in my opinion it results in the sort of accident this thread is discussing.
ROG:
The red lorry is in the wrong lane if heading for A17 and trying to move right to get in the A17 lane after exiting is very difficult because it is a very short stretch between the two roundabouts hence why the lorry in the incident was in the correct lane for A17
Fair comment if he’s heading for the A17.
ROG:
Vehicles in the lane for A17 do not need to indicate as they are in a designated lane for that exit
People who wonder why driving standards are low should read that and weep
ROG:
The SUV on the other hand MUST indicate if it wants to go other than what that lane is designated for and MUST ensure it is safe to do so
If the lane was specifically designated for vehicles heading towards the A46/A17 there would be lane markings on the roundabout, there aren’t so it’s not a lane that’s specifically designated for a particular direction.
As I said before vehicles coming from the A1 are directed to that lane for the B6166 (Lincoln road) so even ignoring the fact that there are no appropriate lane markings on the roundabout how can it be designated specifically for vehicles heading towards the A46/A17
isn’t that the A1 exit? I thought the truck and SUV came from the A46 exit?
And the car with the camera exits from Lincoln Road hence the white backed road sign as its a minor road,
dieseldog999:
id say the main culprit would be the wazzocks who painted the lane markings ( or the lack of them ) as its not uncommn for there to be a complete lack of them after certain points on large roundabouts like that which leads to a who dares win scenario.
For once I make you right. Some of these junctions / roundabouts are totally beyond the understanding of most drivers. Apart from the muppets painting lines incorrectly sometimes the average motorist never looks at lines or markings!
Driverless vehicles will work far better when they arrive.
From my understanding driverless vehicles will need really clear lane markings.
ROG:
The red lorry is in the wrong lane if heading for A17 and trying to move right to get in the A17 lane after exiting is very difficult because it is a very short stretch between the two roundabouts hence why the lorry in the incident was in the correct lane for A17
Fair comment if he’s heading for the A17.
ROG:
Vehicles in the lane for A17 do not need to indicate as they are in a designated lane for that exit
People who wonder why driving standards are low should read that and weep
ROG:
The SUV on the other hand MUST indicate if it wants to go other than what that lane is designated for and MUST ensure it is safe to do so
If the lane was specifically designated for vehicles heading towards the A46/A17 there would be lane markings on the roundabout, there aren’t so it’s not a lane that’s specifically designated for a particular direction.
As I said before vehicles coming from the A1 are directed to that lane for the B6166 (Lincoln road) so even ignoring the fact that there are no appropriate lane markings on the roundabout how can it be designated specifically for vehicles heading towards the A46/A17
isn’t that the A1 exit? I thought the truck and SUV came from the A46 exit?
And the car with the camera exits from Lincoln Road hence the white backed road sign as its a minor road,
That’s right, the point of the link is that ROG is arguing that lane markings on roundabout approach roads make a lane on a roundabout designated for that route, the link shows that the lane ROG says is designated for the A46 is also (according to his theory) designated for Lincoln Road, which sort of makes a nonsense of the idea that approach road lane marking apply when on a roundabout to.
In other words, if approach road lane marking mean the roundabout lanes are designated for that route this roundabout has a serious problem because lane 2 on the roundabout is designated (his theory not mine) for both tha A46/A17 and the B6166 depending on which way you approach the roundabout.
To be honest this is nonsense and to prove the point I posted a link to the road from the A1 where it approaches the roundabout, according to google maps the lane markings guide B6166 traffic straight across the roundabout lane that you say is designated for the A46/A17.
According to your theory the lane the SUV was in is designated for the A46 so the SUV has to give way, on the other hand as the lane markings on the A1 approach direct traffic into the same lane on the roundabout it must also (according to your theory) be designated for the B6166 so the SUV can bear right towards the B6166 (Lincoln Road).
The reality is that on the approach to the roundabout the SUV driver had placed himself in the wrong lane, however having found himself in the outside lane he had every right to cautiously bear right while the lorry driver should have made sure his path was clear before crossing over to the the A46 exit, to say the lane did not allow the SUV to go right is complete nonsense.
As far as who should or should not have indicated is concerned, I’d say both of them should have been indicating their intentions but as the lorry crossed into the path of the SUV the lorry driver has to be mostly, if not completely, responsible.
Some of these junctions / roundabouts are totally beyond the understanding of most drivers. Apart from the muppets painting lines incorrectly sometimes the average motorist never looks at lines or markings!
