Who right

Who is in the wrong then.

thesun.co.uk/motors/9804084 … ses-crash/

From the article

Neil Greig, director of policy and research at IAM RoadSmart, said: "On the face of it the lorry driver appears to be in the wrong lane and then changes lane without signalling and has caused the crash.

"However, it’s not possible from the video to see the lane markings on the approach roads taken by the lorry and the 4x4 so it may have been the 4x4 driver who was in the wrong lane and who should have been going left.

“What the video does show is that a lorry driver can see very little out of his or her cab so it’s always wise to be absolutely sure you are clear in what you are doing before entering their huge blind spots.”

But, but, but our resident “expert” says blind spots dont exist on lorries!

I agree with the guy in the article, was the car legitimately turning right from the left hand lane?

I know this roundabout and the lorry was in the right to turn into lane 2 on the exit

The car was at fault as that lane does not go past that exit - you must turn left into lane 1 of that exit

To be certain I checked out the lane markings on google maps

The guy in the dash cam car looks like he is watching tv?

lane 1 from the direction the lorry and car came from is marked up as A46 and A617, A46 is first exit A617 is second exit, if you look at the road markings lane 1 is for 1st and 2nd exit, lane 2 is 3rd and 4th exit, very faint though and i can’t make out any arrows, hgv at fault for me.

Know it, use it a lot, SUV driver is being a knob.

So, looking at the video both vehicles are on the A46 Newark bypass, on the approach to that roundabout the left hand lane is for the A1 (North) only. The centre lane, which the black SUV was in is marked for the A46, A17 and A1 (South) and the right hand approach lane marked for the A46(N), A17, A1(South) and the B6166 (Newark). The SUV was either going into Newark or back on to the A46(N), whatever destination, it was in the wrong lane. The only way to legally turn right at that roundabout is to be in the lane the HGV was in.
The truck driver, who has probably used the junction many times and knows that to go onto the A1 south, then the right hand lane on approach to the roundabout is the best lane to use as it leads you into the correct lane on the exit of the roundabout for the A1 south. That is assuming he was going to the A1 south, even if he wasn’t, and was heading to the A46 or A17 he was still in a correct lane, just needs to make a lane change post exit of the roundabout for the A46 and a lane change either before or straight after the next roundabout if travailing up the A17.

Van driver…

Is at fault.

But, lorry driver should have seen it coming.

yourhavingalarf:
But, lorry driver should have seen it coming.

Do not know about anyone else but I, as a 60+ year old with many LGV driving years as well as a few years as an LGV instructor and teaching advanced driving on cars/LGVs, certainly could not foresee that :exclamation:

But, but, but our resident “expert” says blind spots dont exist on lorries!

I presume you are talking about me? Please show me where I said there were no blind spots on a lorry? I did not say that. What I did say was that drivers seem to use blind spots as an excuse for moving when its not safe. I probably drove lorries when you were still in nappies and drove wagons with a lot less mirrors than they have now so I know all about blind spots.
I also know its the drivers responsibility to make sure there is nothing in the blind spot before moving!

Please get you facts correct before spouting absolute rubbish. :imp:

Both partly to blame in my view. Lack of observation from both drivers and no left signal from the lorry. Just your usual muppets not paying attention to a badly designed road.

Regardless of fault, and I do think the suv driver is at fault, if both drivers had been using correct signals and been more observant and anticipated what could happen then it could have been avoided.

Rowley010:
Regardless of fault, and I do think the suv driver is at fault, if both drivers had been using correct signals and been more observant and anticipated what could happen then it could have been avoided.

Even with both signalling the SUV must give way to the lorry

jakethesnake:
But, but, but our resident “expert” says blind spots dont exist on lorries!

I presume you are talking about me? Please show me where I said there were no blind spots on a lorry? I did not say that. What I did say was that drivers seem to use blind spots as an excuse for moving when its not safe. I probably drove lorries when you were still in nappies and drove wagons with a lot less mirrors than they have now so I know all about blind spots.
I also know its the drivers responsibility to make sure there is nothing in the blind spot before moving!

Please get you facts correct before spouting absolute rubbish. :imp:

So if you’re saying there are blindspots on trucks how do you know drivers are using them as an excuse? A vehicle might have actually been in the blind spot.

ROG:

Rowley010:
Regardless of fault, and I do think the suv driver is at fault, if both drivers had been using correct signals and been more observant and anticipated what could happen then it could have been avoided.

Even with both signalling the SUV must give way to the lorry

Really, I would like to know why? Personally I do not know the road and it’s not overly clear on the video but from what I can make out neither were signalling (as has been mentioned) but I would have said a signal from the lorry would have been more appropriate than the SUV. The lorry was leaving the roundabout so a signal may have been helpful would it not?
From what I can see there is nothing to say that the SUV should have given way to the lorry ? No markings, no signs. Or are you saying you should always give way to a larger vehicle■■?
These type of juntions/roundabouts certainly are not the best even for the most astute driver however if both drivers in the video had used better observation and anticipation the accident would have been avoided in my opinion.

jakethesnake:

ROG:

Rowley010:
Regardless of fault, and I do think the suv driver is at fault, if both drivers had been using correct signals and been more observant and anticipated what could happen then it could have been avoided.

Even with both signalling the SUV must give way to the lorry

Really, I would like to know why? Personally I do not know the road and it’s not overly clear on the video but from what I can make out neither were signalling (as has been mentioned) but I would have said a signal from the lorry would have been more appropriate than the SUV. The lorry was leaving the roundabout so a signal may have been helpful would it not?
From what I can see there is nothing to say that the SUV should have given way to the lorry ? No markings, no signs. Or are you saying you should always give way to a larger vehicle■■?
These type of juntions/roundabouts certainly are not the best even for the most astute driver however if both drivers in the video had used better observation and anticipation the accident would have been avoided in my opinion.

Yes ROG why? What high code rule says in that situation the suv should have given way? Because the lorry is bigger so can bully smaller vehicles?

I agree the SUV is mostly at fault. Wrong lane, no signal, carrying on round in wrong lane.

But if the lorry was signalling as he should have been that might have set alarm bells ringing to the suv driver, if the suv was signalling that might have set alarm bells to the HGV driver, and if he HGV driver has been watching those near side mirrors more and anticipated what a car could potentially do he could have reacted or sounded horn as a warning just before. You see, suv at fault but other actions could have avoided it.

EASY - the SUV was in a lane that did not allow it to go right (see previous posts) so if it wanted to change its mind then ok but it must indicate its intentions and give way to those already in the other lane

As I said - EASY :smiley:

muckles:

jakethesnake:
But, but, but our resident “expert” says blind spots dont exist on lorries!

I presume you are talking about me? Please show me where I said there were no blind spots on a lorry? I did not say that. What I did say was that drivers seem to use blind spots as an excuse for moving when its not safe. I probably drove lorries when you were still in nappies and drove wagons with a lot less mirrors than they have now so I know all about blind spots.
I also know its the drivers responsibility to make sure there is nothing in the blind spot before moving!

Please get you facts correct before spouting absolute rubbish. :imp:

So if you’re saying there are blindspots on trucks how do you know drivers are using them as an excuse? A vehicle might have actually been in the blind spot.

Read again please. I said they seem to be using them as an excuse and not that they are. You hear it all the time now. Oh that vehicle was in my blindspot. If they had stayed out of it I would not have hit it! You know as well as me it is the truck drivers responsibility for their blindspots and not the responsibility of the other vehicle and it is up to the truck driver to check whatever way possible before moving. You also know a lot of blindspots that we had years ago are now covered by mirrors which cause other blind spots. :wink:

Stop nitpicking. You are better than that.

ROG:
EASY - the SUV was in a lane that did not allow it to go right (see previous posts) so if it wanted to change its mind then ok but it must indicate its intentions and give way to those already in the other lane

As I said - EASY :smiley:

In a lane that did not allow it to go right■■? Well that is not evident on the video. There are no lane markings so I don’t understand how you can say that.
Poor explanation really.

jakethesnake:

ROG:
EASY - the SUV was in a lane that did not allow it to go right (see previous posts) so if it wanted to change its mind then ok but it must indicate its intentions and give way to those already in the other lane

As I said - EASY :smiley:

In a lane that did not allow it to go right■■? Well that is not evident on the video. There are no lane markings so I don’t understand how you can say that.
Poor explanation really.

I suggest you look at the lane approach markings on google maps before commenting on that aspect