mac12:
But he is right any job that you can be trained for in four days can hardly be considered skilled/quote]It doesn’t take any training to stack shelves or pick orders in a warehouse and it definitely doesn’t cost YOU several thousand pounds. Last time I checked Tesco didn’t ask you to p*as in a bottle or sleep behind the bins at the back of the shop. And yet we’re paid very similar money. And they get staff discount!
msgyorkie:
The BBC did a so called Reality Check on the shortage of drivers. How serious is the shortage of lorry drivers? - BBC News
It was obvious they have gone running to the RHA for so called facts. No mention of DVLA proving there is more HGV licence holders than vacancies. No mention of the crap pay, long hours and poor onsite facilities that a lot of drivers have turned their back on.
I have written a formal complaint to the BBC on this half arsed effort and also included a link to this excellent report. 'Haulier supermarket' puts drivers on right side of supply and demand equation - The Loadstar
Every year there is a shortage of people to do harvesting on farms. Every year labour is brought in.
There is no shortage of people with the necessary qualifications to do this work, so saying there is a surplus of LGV licence holders is an irrelevance. You don`t even say these licence holders are unemployed? There is no scheme to force licence holders to give up their chosen work and return to driving.
If licence holders choose to leave then that is a sign of trouble in the industry, I agree, but no more than that.
I reckon there is a danger now that some yards assisted by the government - will be so eager to wave through ever more EE “drivers”, that they don’t actually vet those would-be drivers properly, and we end up with a bunch of say, Moldovans with mickey mouse licences and poor eyesight (common among the slavs, apparently…) driving over here causing mayhem to the general public, only for Indigenous brit drivers to carry the can when masses of UK general public get wasted by such dodgy credential drivers… 
OR firms can simply wise-up, aggressively recruit whilst there’s still a large base of Ex-agency workforce looking for jobs to pick and choose from… And never look back.
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
The BBC did a so called Reality Check on the shortage of drivers. How serious is the shortage of lorry drivers? - BBC News
It was obvious they have gone running to the RHA for so called facts. No mention of DVLA proving there is more HGV licence holders than vacancies. No mention of the crap pay, long hours and poor onsite facilities that a lot of drivers have turned their back on.
I have written a formal complaint to the BBC on this half arsed effort and also included a link to this excellent report. 'Haulier supermarket' puts drivers on right side of supply and demand equation - The LoadstarEvery year there is a shortage of people to do harvesting on farms. Every year labour is brought in.
There is no shortage of people with the necessary qualifications to do this work, so saying there is a surplus of LGV licence holders is an irrelevance. You don`t even say these licence holders are unemployed? There is no scheme to force licence holders to give up their chosen work and return to driving.
If licence holders choose to leave then that is a sign of trouble in the industry, I agree, but no more than that.
Only since the opening of the floodgates did we import labour for agriculture. I grew up on a farm and untill mid 2000’s fruit and veg picking was seasonal work done by students/housewifes/gypsies and kids wanting pocket money. I know because at the age of 8 I was helping mum pick strawberries in summer holidays then moving on to raspberries. When a bit older we did onion hoeing and potato harvesting in the summer holidays.
The government have stated that there are more licence holders than vacancies. These licence holders that are no longer in the game will need tempting back into the game with up to date wages and working conditions.
*Edit to add …there was an old WW2 prisoner of war camp near us that was converted into a camp for foreign STUDENTS to come and do some work whilst practising their English skills. These were mainly French/Belgium/Dutch with a few Italians thrown in. They came for about 5-6 weeks for the summer fruit picking. Said camp is now overun by the EE’s with no desire to learn English and are only here for the money.
I went out raspberry picking during the 1960s .The school calendar is worked around the needs of agriculture Scottish schools are off now for six weeks mainly for the soft fruit , they stop again in October for two weeks for the potato harvest. Not many children do this work nowadays but they still get the time off school. I would have the prisoners out working the fields with a pony patrol of armed officers to “deter” them from escaping.
msgyorkie:
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
The BBC did a so called Reality Check on the shortage of drivers. How serious is the shortage of lorry drivers? - BBC News
It was obvious they have gone running to the RHA for so called facts. No mention of DVLA proving there is more HGV licence holders than vacancies. No mention of the crap pay, long hours and poor onsite facilities that a lot of drivers have turned their back on.
I have written a formal complaint to the BBC on this half arsed effort and also included a link to this excellent report. 'Haulier supermarket' puts drivers on right side of supply and demand equation - The LoadstarEvery year there is a shortage of people to do harvesting on farms. Every year labour is brought in.
There is no shortage of people with the necessary qualifications to do this work, so saying there is a surplus of LGV licence holders is an irrelevance. You don`t even say these licence holders are unemployed? There is no scheme to force licence holders to give up their chosen work and return to driving.
If licence holders choose to leave then that is a sign of trouble in the industry, I agree, but no more than that.Only since the opening of the floodgates did we import labour for agriculture. I grew up on a farm and untill mid 2000’s fruit and veg picking was seasonal work done by students/housewifes/gypsies and kids wanting pocket money. I know because at the age of 8 I was helping mum pick strawberries in summer holidays then moving on to raspberries. When a bit older we did onion hoeing and potato harvesting in the summer holidays.
The government have stated that there are more licence holders than vacancies. These licence holders that are no longer in the game will need tempting back into the game with up to date wages and working conditions.
*Edit to add …there was an old WW2 prisoner of war camp near us that was converted into a camp for foreign STUDENTS to come and do some work whilst practising their English skills. These were mainly French/Belgium/Dutch with a few Italians thrown in. They came for about 5-6 weeks for the summer fruit picking. Said camp is now overun by the EE’s with no desire to learn English and are only here for the money.
So, its OK to to “tempt existing licence holders” with more cash, but are disparaging of those who are “only here for the money”?
These workers “overrun” a camp (I guess you mean it is over crowded? I.E. too small) and we only offer temp work permits, so why would they bother with our language if they can`t stay? Yet again you bemoan the poor working conditions for drivers?
And what happened with farm labour decades ago isn`t really relevant today is it?
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
The BBC did a so called Reality Check on the shortage of drivers. How serious is the shortage of lorry drivers? - BBC News
It was obvious they have gone running to the RHA for so called facts. No mention of DVLA proving there is more HGV licence holders than vacancies. No mention of the crap pay, long hours and poor onsite facilities that a lot of drivers have turned their back on.
I have written a formal complaint to the BBC on this half arsed effort and also included a link to this excellent report. 'Haulier supermarket' puts drivers on right side of supply and demand equation - The LoadstarEvery year there is a shortage of people to do harvesting on farms. Every year labour is brought in.
There is no shortage of people with the necessary qualifications to do this work, so saying there is a surplus of LGV licence holders is an irrelevance. You don`t even say these licence holders are unemployed? There is no scheme to force licence holders to give up their chosen work and return to driving.
If licence holders choose to leave then that is a sign of trouble in the industry, I agree, but no more than that.Only since the opening of the floodgates did we import labour for agriculture. I grew up on a farm and untill mid 2000’s fruit and veg picking was seasonal work done by students/housewifes/gypsies and kids wanting pocket money. I know because at the age of 8 I was helping mum pick strawberries in summer holidays then moving on to raspberries. When a bit older we did onion hoeing and potato harvesting in the summer holidays.
The government have stated that there are more licence holders than vacancies. These licence holders that are no longer in the game will need tempting back into the game with up to date wages and working conditions.
*Edit to add …there was an old WW2 prisoner of war camp near us that was converted into a camp for foreign STUDENTS to come and do some work whilst practising their English skills. These were mainly French/Belgium/Dutch with a few Italians thrown in. They came for about 5-6 weeks for the summer fruit picking. Said camp is now overun by the EE’s with no desire to learn English and are only here for the money.
So, its OK to to “tempt existing licence holders” with more cash, but are disparaging of those who are “only here for the money”?
These workers “overrun” a camp (I guess you mean it is over crowded? I.E. too small) and we only offer temp work permits, so why would they bother with our language if they can`t stay? Yet again you bemoan the poor working conditions for drivers?And what happened with farm labour decades ago isn`t really relevant today is it?
Well yes it is relevent my friend because it draws parallels with what has happened with haulage. Agriculture workers also suffered the influx of cheap EE labour and keeping wages artificially down.
robroy:
cav551:
You must be such fun to meet in person.The pub must clear when they see you coming.
He can clear a pub faster than an angry Stevie Wonder walking in with a machine gun.
S’good job I’m tea total now then - init… 
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
The BBC did a so called Reality Check on the shortage of drivers. How serious is the shortage of lorry drivers? - BBC News
It was obvious they have gone running to the RHA for so called facts. No mention of DVLA proving there is more HGV licence holders than vacancies. No mention of the crap pay, long hours and poor onsite facilities that a lot of drivers have turned their back on.
I have written a formal complaint to the BBC on this half arsed effort and also included a link to this excellent report. 'Haulier supermarket' puts drivers on right side of supply and demand equation - The LoadstarEvery year there is a shortage of people to do harvesting on farms. Every year labour is brought in.
There is no shortage of people with the necessary qualifications to do this work, so saying there is a surplus of LGV licence holders is an irrelevance. You don`t even say these licence holders are unemployed? There is no scheme to force licence holders to give up their chosen work and return to driving.
If licence holders choose to leave then that is a sign of trouble in the industry, I agree, but no more than that.Only since the opening of the floodgates did we import labour for agriculture. I grew up on a farm and untill mid 2000’s fruit and veg picking was seasonal work done by students/housewifes/gypsies and kids wanting pocket money. I know because at the age of 8 I was helping mum pick strawberries in summer holidays then moving on to raspberries. When a bit older we did onion hoeing and potato harvesting in the summer holidays.
The government have stated that there are more licence holders than vacancies. These licence holders that are no longer in the game will need tempting back into the game with up to date wages and working conditions.
*Edit to add …there was an old WW2 prisoner of war camp near us that was converted into a camp for foreign STUDENTS to come and do some work whilst practising their English skills. These were mainly French/Belgium/Dutch with a few Italians thrown in. They came for about 5-6 weeks for the summer fruit picking. Said camp is now overun by the EE’s with no desire to learn English and are only here for the money.
So, its OK to to “tempt existing licence holders” with more cash, but are disparaging of those who are “only here for the money”?
These workers “overrun” a camp (I guess you mean it is over crowded? I.E. too small) and we only offer temp work permits, so why would they bother with our language if they can`t stay? Yet again you bemoan the poor working conditions for drivers?And what happened with farm labour decades ago isn`t really relevant today is it?
Tempt existing drivers
There are 70,000 people in the UK right now with class 1 and 2 license who don’t drive for a living.
Just think about that for a minute…70,000 license holders ready and able to work tomorrow morning.
70,000 people in the UK right now who could legally drive trucks… but they don’t. Why?
CR*P pay. Pure and simple.
Ooooh, it’s about toilets and sitting in a RDC and …and…and…No. It’s not. It’s about pay.
You want a plumber to clear your sh**ter? You’d better be prepared to put your hand in your pocket! Can he do it? Of course he can. Does he want to do it? Of course not. He’ll do it for a rate he deems acceptable to put his hand in your bog.
Do I care about peeing in a bottle? Not for £20 an hour. Do I care about being treated poorly at an RDC? Not for £20 an hour.
It’s all about pay and suggesting anything else is a lie or stupid.
Build5:
Franglais:
msgyorkie:
Franglais:
Every year there is a shortage of people to do harvesting on farms. Every year labour is brought in.There is no shortage of people with the necessary qualifications to do this work, so saying there is a surplus of LGV licence holders is an irrelevance. You don`t even say these licence holders are unemployed? There is no scheme to force licence holders to give up their chosen work and return to driving.
If licence holders choose to leave then that is a sign of trouble in the industry, I agree, but no more than that.Only since the opening of the floodgates did we import labour for agriculture. I grew up on a farm and untill mid 2000’s fruit and veg picking was seasonal work done by students/housewifes/gypsies and kids wanting pocket money. I know because at the age of 8 I was helping mum pick strawberries in summer holidays then moving on to raspberries. When a bit older we did onion hoeing and potato harvesting in the summer holidays.
The government have stated that there are more licence holders than vacancies. These licence holders that are no longer in the game will need tempting back into the game with up to date wages and working conditions.
*Edit to add …there was an old WW2 prisoner of war camp near us that was converted into a camp for foreign STUDENTS to come and do some work whilst practising their English skills. These were mainly French/Belgium/Dutch with a few Italians thrown in. They came for about 5-6 weeks for the summer fruit picking. Said camp is now overun by the EE’s with no desire to learn English and are only here for the money.
So, its OK to to “tempt existing licence holders” with more cash, but are disparaging of those who are “only here for the money”?
These workers “overrun” a camp (I guess you mean it is over crowded? I.E. too small) and we only offer temp work permits, so why would they bother with our language if they can`t stay? Yet again you bemoan the poor working conditions for drivers?And what happened with farm labour decades ago isn`t really relevant today is it?
Tempt existing drivers
There are 70,000 people in the UK right now with class 1 and 2 license who don’t drive for a living.
Just think about that for a minute…70,000 license holders ready and able to work tomorrow morning.
70,000 people in the UK right now who could legally drive trucks… but they don’t. Why?
CR*P pay. Pure and simple.
Ooooh, it’s about toilets and sitting in a RDC and …and…and…No. It’s not. It’s about pay.
You want a plumber to clear your sh**ter? You’d better be prepared to put your hand in your pocket! Can he do it? Of course he can. Does he want to do it? Of course not. He’ll do it for a rate he deems acceptable to put his hand in your bog.
Do I care about peeing in a bottle? Not for £20 an hour. Do I care about being treated poorly at an RDC? Not for £20 an hour.
It’s all about pay and suggesting anything else is a lie or stupid.
.
.
Yeah?
Go ask a nurse or Doctor why they do what they do.
your exactly right what your saying.
I’m one of the 70k that holds a class 1 licence and won’t drive trucks anymore.
I operate cranes now.
nothing todo with how I get treated at a depot RDC or anything crap.
it’s the hourly rate is higher and overtime rates after 8 hours and home everynite
If the rates were higher and better conditions on trucks I would be back in the saddle.
And of the 70000 plus HGV licence holders, how many have a current CPC card? Not all that is a fact. Those 70000 plus licence holders aren’t all sat waiting for wages to go up to get in a truck, many wont drive a truck as they have better employment in other industries. Many will have passed in the forces and have never driven a truck in civvy street and have no intention of doing so.
A driver shortage is when there are not enough bums on seats to take loads down the road. Every adult in the UK could hold a HGV licence but for what ever reasons if enough don’t pursue that career then a driver shortage arises.
Themoocher:
Munchkin:
Themoocher:
a ground worker is on 200 to 250 a day at minute driving dump trucks and small diggers on sites.
The problem with haulage and now cranes is the hire rates are so low and have been for years the profit margins are so thin.
The haulage rates has been run into the ground in this country.
you just have to look at the prices of building materials has tripled and quadrupled over the past 18 months bricks timber ect.
People still pay the money for the materials. as the price is what it is and off.
Haulage they want to squeeze every last penny at the cost of the Labour driving the truck.This is an area that seems to have kept up with real world living costs unlike driving. I don’t know what the difference is apart from employer attitude.
I’m sure most sites were/are as full of EE as your average RDC so that’s not it. Maybe it’s just because they pay properly that you don’t hear McAlpine moaning about labour shortages?Sent from my R19 using Tapatalk
All I here is you can learn to drive a truck in a week so you deserve to get paid 10 pound a hour.
You can learn a digger in a week and get 18-20 pound a hour plus overtime rates.
Don’t see the difference skill wise myself like.
The costs of the wages gets put on the hire costs to the site.
No driver deserves 10 quid an hour, employers who pay 10 quid an hour do not deserve decent drivers, as said they are used as a stepping stone, the driver shortage is only affecting the bottom feeder companies … decent outfits have drivers.
Maybe the government will encourage licence holders to “give it up” in a similar fashion to one’s D entitlment - IF the licence will no longer be used for it’s primary purpose for the forseeable future…
It should be more than just “letting the blue card lapse” or even the 5 year medical…
The number of In-date 35 houred Blue Card holders - should be the real statistic of "How many HGV drivers there are in the UK.
robbo99.:
And of the 70000 plus HGV licence holders, how many have a current CPC card? Not all that is a fact. Those 70000 plus licence holders aren’t all sat waiting for wages to go up to get in a truck, many wont drive a truck as they have better employment in other industries. Many will have passed in the forces and have never driven a truck in civvy street and have no intention of doing so.A driver shortage is when there are not enough bums on seats to take loads down the road. Every adult in the UK could hold a HGV licence but for what ever reasons if enough don’t pursue that career then a driver shortage arises.
Just to reiterate, it really is immaterial as to what the causes are, ie poor pay, conditions etc, the facts clearly prove that there most certainly IS a Driver shortage.
I wonder just how many one man band Ltd Co’s took the government bounce back loan (£20k IIRC) and promptly folded and scurried offf back from whence they came?
the maoster:
I wonder just how many one man band Ltd Co’s took the government bounce back loan (£20k IIRC) and promptly folded and scurried offf back from whence they came?
I reckon a lot, but if the Government were throwing money around like confetti then is there any wonder? I think this government really just don’t get the mess in the haulage industry.
robbo99.:
the maoster:
I wonder just how many one man band Ltd Co’s took the government bounce back loan (£20k IIRC) and promptly folded and scurried offf back from whence they came?
[/quot.
Noremac:
Rjan:
Winseer:
A massive recession will hit us this Autumn, I reckon… Comparable to the one that stood down this country’s entire industrial base in the early 1980’s following the 1979 Winter of Discontent, and the advent of Thatcher.
Entire industries - to disappear, never to return. Half the country culled into a premature death, or left on benefits to perish from an NHS that now neglects them to death…To be fair, industries didn’t disappear. They were simply offshored abroad, helped by Thatcher’s releasing of capital controls in 1979 which allowed the nation’s wealth to be carried away by bosses, and their ruinous monetarist policies which were designed to undermine industry and create unemployment.
Don’t encourage him, it was an outrageous tangent to begin with. The masks link was tenuous, but this changed to “opening up” within the space of two sentences. It is just a chat room to discuss whatever is on his mind at the particular moment. Thread topics mean nothing to him.
You know, you could always do what you keep telling others “Ignore me”, rather than glare daggers all the time if you don’t like what I’m about… I know I’d be a lot better off if others actually DID ignore me, rather than step on my feet and ■■■■ on my chips every damned day… 
Winseer:
You know, you could always do what you keep telling others “Ignore me”, rather than glare daggers all the time if you don’t like what I’m about… I know I’d be a lot better off if others actually DID ignore me, rather than step on my feet and ■■■■ on my chips every damned day…
It’s everyone against you eh Winseer? Well, if many are coming to a similar conclusion, then what does that tell you?
My interactions with you have been rare in the (not even) 2 years I have been a member. You are treading roughshod over any thread you choose with largely meaningless diatribe and with your customary baseless predictions that are totally off topic. Mostly I get one or two sentences into your posts before I decide to disregard. I don’t comment every time.