Last week I was asked why am i doing a run that another driver did in 12 hours that takes me between 8 to 10 depending on traffic.
Explained to driver assessor/trainer my job for the day
Run meant to start at 1pm, but previous driver booked on at 12:00, I decided to start at 12:30 or 12:45 depending on run to work.
Leave yard A at 13:00
Travel to yard B solo , arrive 13:50 collect empty trailer. leave yard B after getting a coffee and chin wag (14:10) for collection at customer C
15:00 load trailer, other work as I am in back with pump truck , leave for next customer 15:30, arrive 15:35 (next door almost!) ,reverse onto loading bay, rest mode selected as i get coffee and read/browse web, kip for next hour or so.
16:45 leave customer. All i do is select OW then pull forward padlock trailer.
18:00 arrive at yard B drop trailer, find empty, grab coffee , more chin wag
18:15 to 18:30 (depending on trailer situation i.e trying to find one that isn’t VOR lol) leave for customer D arrive 19:00 leave 19:15 (1 pallet!) then off to customer E (19:45) to transship then trailer swap
leave at 20:15 back to yard B at 20:45
leave yard B solo (21:00) arrive at yard A 21:45 book off at 22:00 after fueling up
maybe a bit later depending on traffic on M42 or M5 in day.
Any way assessor says that I can not have a break on loading bay!
I’ll await better people than me to answer, but we run double man and the second driver can take his 45 in a moving vehicle, so I can’t see the problem with a break on a bay.
The trainer is obviously one of those who will sit on a loading bay, do nothing but drinking coffee, sleeping etc for 3 hrs then pull out and stick it on break for 45 minutes.
Might explain why it takes other drivers 12 hrs to do the same job.
Bottom line is that provided you’re not involved in tipping the load, it’s perfectly fine to have a break on a bay.
Out of curiosity, are you paid by the hour, or a flat day rate? Not that it would change my way of doing things, I couldn’t be doing with the sitting around on a regular basis.
a) When the vehicle was on the bay and your tachograph was set on break were you then unable to continue in your usual work as laid out in your employment agreement i.e. drive on to your next delivery/collection, drop or hitch up to another trailer or gain access to the rear of the trailer and load/unload manually yourself?
b) Whilst your vehicle was on the bay and your tachograph was set on break were you able to eat and/or drink and have access to either onsite provisions or food/drink you brought with you, or free to pass your time in a way that would give you a break from your usual duties i.e read, browse the internet or nap?
If the answer is YES for both the above questions then you were legally taking a break as laid out in the simple terminology provided within the EU Drivers hours regulations
A break is defined as a period during which a driver is able to obtain both rest and refreshment. The break may be on duty or off duty.
It is irrelevant where that vehicle is or what is being done to it during this period as long as it doesn’t involve you or stop you from being able to fulfil the break requirements listed above.
Furthermore those that insist you MUST then take a break offsite because the loading/unloading was on ‘other work’ are basically stealing 45 minutes extra pay from their employers for doing nothing, and tbf to them if you have your breaks deducted by your employer then that’s exactly what they deserve!
Sounds like the driver/trainer is mates with the regular driver who has told him “don’t let him chop the run up,I’m on a good screw taking 12 hours”.
Used to be like that at my old place night trunks used to take 13 hours to go from willenhall to heysham, to swop trailers,work got suspicious sent a shunter out on the run took him 9 1/2 hours,work said how can 5 trunks go to heysham an hour apart and all get back at the same time every morning lol.
andy187:
Last week I was asked why am i doing a run that another driver did in 12 hours that takes me between 8 to 10 depending on traffic.
Explained to driver assessor/trainer my job for the day
Run meant to start at 1pm, but previous driver booked on at 12:00, I decided to start at 12:30 or 12:45 depending on run to work.
Leave yard A at 13:00
Travel to yard B solo , arrive 13:50 collect empty trailer. leave yard B after getting a coffee and chin wag (14:10) for collection at customer C
15:00 load trailer, other work as I am in back with pump truck , leave for next customer 15:30, arrive 15:35 (next door almost!) ,reverse onto loading bay, rest mode selected as i get coffee and read/browse web, kip for next hour or so.
16:45 leave customer. All i do is select OW then pull forward padlock trailer.
18:00 arrive at yard B drop trailer, find empty, grab coffee , more chin wag
18:15 to 18:30 (depending on trailer situation i.e trying to find one that isn’t VOR lol) leave for customer D arrive 19:00 leave 19:15 (1 pallet!) then off to customer E (19:45) to transship then trailer swap
leave at 20:15 back to yard B at 20:45
leave yard B solo (21:00) arrive at yard A 21:45 book off at 22:00 after fueling up
maybe a bit later depending on traffic on M42 or M5 in day.
Any way assessor says that I can not have a break on loading bay!
Asked him where does it say that in regulations?
“oh you just can’t” he says
In other words…you’re forking the job up…
Before you know it…they’ll have a "just nip"pinned onto that particular run.
Thanks to people like you.
andy187:
Last week I was asked why am i doing a run that another driver did in 12 hours that takes me between 8 to 10 depending on traffic.
Explained to driver assessor/trainer my job for the day
Run meant to start at 1pm, but previous driver booked on at 12:00, I decided to start at 12:30 or 12:45 depending on run to work.
Leave yard A at 13:00
Travel to yard B solo , arrive 13:50 collect empty trailer. leave yard B after getting a coffee and chin wag (14:10) for collection at customer C
15:00 load trailer, other work as I am in back with pump truck , leave for next customer 15:30, arrive 15:35 (next door almost!) ,reverse onto loading bay, rest mode selected as i get coffee and read/browse web, kip for next hour or so.
16:45 leave customer. All i do is select OW then pull forward padlock trailer.
18:00 arrive at yard B drop trailer, find empty, grab coffee , more chin wag
18:15 to 18:30 (depending on trailer situation i.e trying to find one that isn’t VOR lol) leave for customer D arrive 19:00 leave 19:15 (1 pallet!) then off to customer E (19:45) to transship then trailer swap
leave at 20:15 back to yard B at 20:45
leave yard B solo (21:00) arrive at yard A 21:45 book off at 22:00 after fueling up
maybe a bit later depending on traffic on M42 or M5 in day.
Any way assessor says that I can not have a break on loading bay!
Asked him where does it say that in regulations?
“oh you just can’t” he says
In other words…you’re forking the job up…
Before you know it…they’ll have a "just nip"pinned onto that particular run.
Thanks to people like you.
Spot on,the “can you just on your way back” jobs have a nasty habit of taking longer than the original run to do aswell,if the original driver takes 12 hours and they don’t say anything to him why run round and get paid less for the same job.
commonrail:
In other words…you’re forking the job up…
Before you know it…they’ll have a "just nip"pinned onto that particular run.
Thanks to people like you.
Spot on,the “can you just on your way back” jobs have a nasty habit of taking longer than the original run to do aswell,if the original driver takes 12 hours and they don’t say anything to him why run round and get paid less for the same job.
To play devils advocate, next minute another company will come in and say, we can do that for £50.00 less than your current supplier and faster. See the Suttons thread.
commonrail:
In other words…you’re forking the job up…
Before you know it…they’ll have a "just nip"pinned onto that particular run.
Thanks to people like you.
Spot on,the “can you just on your way back” jobs have a nasty habit of taking longer than the original run to do aswell,if the original driver takes 12 hours and they don’t say anything to him why run round and get paid less for the same job.
To play devils advocate, next minute another company will come in and say, we can do that for £50.00 less than your current supplier and faster. See the Suttons thread.
Here’s a story from “Headlight” years ago:
On a regular run two drivers always had a “plus” on the fuel.
One was taken off but his replacement kept up the same fiddle. Another change of driver and although reluctant he too wad persuaded “not to drop his mates in it”.
Then someone takes over the run but can’t be coerced into carrying on the fraud.
Management notice, investigation etc. Police involved.
Taking any extra tea breaks isn’t the same league, but where’s the tipping point?
I drive partly because I want some independence. I don’t want a boss micromanaging me, nor do I want the “tearoom” boys looking and pointing.
commonrail:
In other words…you’re forking the job up…
Before you know it…they’ll have a "just nip"pinned onto that particular run.
Thanks to people like you.
Spot on,the “can you just on your way back” jobs have a nasty habit of taking longer than the original run to do aswell,if the original driver takes 12 hours and they don’t say anything to him why run round and get paid less for the same job.
To play devils advocate, next minute another company will come in and say, we can do that for £50.00 less than your current supplier and faster. See the Suttons thread.
And their drivers are pushed to the max…on less money.
Company can’t retain drivers,employ idiots…fleet gets trashed and service to the customer suffers.
The job is then we’ll and truly forked.
Tricky one this without knowing the yard dynamics but basically unless some company policy advice is in place no trainer/assessor should interfere in how drivers take their breaks unless there’s a risk of infringement leading to O licence problems if audited.
Taking breaks on a bay in my opinion is fine providing it meets the EU regs criteria, one could argue how much recuperation the driver could get stuck on a bay with blokes ramming stuff through his back doors but easily countered with ‘theres a canteen, waiting area I can use or I just went for a walk’… [insert your own bollox if back door action questions are raised, or just insert your bollox into the back doors, works for me].
Lost my train of thought now…
Oh yes, there’s a big difference between biting the hand that feeds you and just nibbling it a bit. Someone who tosses the job off to much can be just as bad as someone who teararses about. Not quite as bad as someone who tosses off into your back doors though.
Oh FFS I’ve lost it now will have another go after a short comfort break.
What did you do wrong? You cut the job to shreds apparently, that’s why the driver trainer is having a discreet word with you? You work with them so you decide how you’re going to proceed in future.
Is it flat rate or hours? If hourly is it a decent rate? Or do you need 12hrs to make a good wage? Are they a good firm or do they screw you at every opportunity? Do they insist on stupid HSE stuff and OTT compliance?
It may be that screwing 12hrs out of them is no more than they deserve, or it could be that the regular driver is just taking the ■■■■. More information is necessary before judgement can be made.
TiredAndEmotional:
What did you do wrong? You cut the job to shreds apparently, that’s why the driver trainer is having a discreet word with you? You work with them so you decide how you’re going to proceed in future.
Cut the job to shreds?
Or a fair day’s work?
I dunno.
Racing to be quicker as a new boy may mean you’ve to keep up the sprint in the long haul. Not easy. Putting mate’s noses out of joint may be awkward. Ending up in a boring job twiddling your thumbs equally bad.
No easy answer on this one. But is this driver suited to this company?
Not insulting anyone at all, maybe square peg in a round hole? (Dipper?)
Where you tipped may have a rule of no breaks on bay.You sound like you want to show off and ruin the job for the other lad.Do what the regulars do pal.
