entry?exit.
Yes, the site owner/operator can refuse you admission, however, clamping a vehicle or refusing to allow it to leave is certainly not in their remit. You have two choices here, theft or Illegal imprisonment, which got one security guard at one RDC 6 weeks in the big house and it still will.
its according to if the company has followed the correct procedure ect for clamping… if all the requirments are in place for a company to clamp a vehicle then you can and a charge imposed for removal of the clamp.
dle1uk:
i will try again! if the site instructions as issued by the site owner/tenant request that no untaxed vehicles are allowed on site, then if you arrive and your vehicle as run out of tax wether 1 day 4 days or several days then that will be explained to you!
Up to 5 working days from the expiry date on the displayed disc you have no way of knowing if the vehicle is taxed or not and by assuming it isn’t you are ignoring the law of the land and giving yourself powers you don’t have. If you ask the driver and he says it is taxed yet you still refer it up the food chain you are calling the driver a liar. A security guard calling visitors liars should be sacked, at least for his own safety if nothing else before someone takes offence at being called a liar and smacks him one.
dle1uk:
entry?exit. Yes, the site owner/operator can refuse you admission, however, clamping a vehicle or refusing to allow it to leave is certainly not in their remit.
its according to if the company has followed the correct procedure ect for clamping… if all the requirments are in place for a company to clamp a vehicle then you can and a charge imposed for removal of the clamp.
Well you got that bit right A site owner can refuse admission for you having tattoos, peircings, ginger hair (now there’s a thought) or any other reason they feel like!
But, as Coffeeholic has said, now we have online taxation renewal there is no way of knowing whether a vehicle is taxed or not within the 1st few days at the start of a month!
I’d also have to ask why the site owners are so interested in road fund licence when it’s of absolutely no concern of theirs… it invalidates nothing!
Not sure where clamping fits in as that’s a whole new ball game & best left alone!
Melchett.
Can’t remember who he was with, however mine is with CIS and it states it has to be kept road legal.
I know of plenty of racers who have tried to insure race bikes under their original reg numbers and have been told it wouldn’t be covered if stolen and have to take specialist insurance just for the piece of mind over theft.
Remember that they could and would quite likely change the definition of road worthy to road legal to suit themselves. I don’t know how much you deal with insurance companies but most folk who do deal with them regularly have stopped being shocked at how low they will stoop to get out of paying and I have seen people absolutely distraught at the way they have been treated…
Seriously, dealings with insurance companies are like juggling with cobras. You are going to get bit eventually. The joy is in getting them back. Norwich union (Aviva) screwed me twice and have paid back ten-fold and will pay another 100 times eventually. Their recovery is 5 times the price it should be and the storage is astronomic whilst I do a quote at about telephone numbers instead of what it should be, just to *iss them off. Even then, I wouldn’t do the work for them if I won the quote as I’ll never again give them the chance to screw me over.
dle1uk:
your missing the point, in the scenario you say I would pass it up to the site management, if they turn round and say no then no it is…
and you would be refused access…
Which is what I posted earlier…
bobthedog:
And our responsibilities were minimal. If there was a problem then call the supervisor and sit tight.
The time I went for that security job was, I think, in 91 so it was a while ago.
I never said all guards were jerks, either, but there are enough idiots to make things bad for all concerned. The same is true of drivers and managers, etc…
The thing with this thread is that the vehicle was already on site and another guard decided to supercede anothers decision and there should be no room for that kind of nonsense.
dle1uk:
ever thought why some of these guards you hate so much try and make life difficult for you??
Very much a two way street here. I am decent enough to everyone as a rule, but when some twisted little moron with “security” on his or her sleeve pulls one on me then I am not likely to allow it to pass by. I would expect the same in return.
You asked if my vehicles were taxed… Nope, not one of them. I do not have a single vehicle with a valid tax disc.
dle1uk:
entry?exit. Yes, the site owner/operator can refuse you admission, however, clamping a vehicle or refusing to allow it to leave is certainly not in their remit.
its according to if the company has followed the correct procedure ect for clamping… if all the requirments are in place for a company to clamp a vehicle then you can and a charge imposed for removal of the clamp.
Well you got that bit right A site owner can refuse admission for you having tattoos, peircings, ginger hair (now there’s a thought) or any other reason they feel like!
But, as Coffeeholic has said, now we have online taxation renewal there is no way of knowing whether a vehicle is taxed or not within the 1st few days at the start of a month!
I’d also have to ask why the site owners are so interested in road fund licence when it’s of absolutely no concern of theirs… it invalidates nothing!
Not sure where clamping fits in as that’s a whole new ball game & best left alone!
the online road tax part for lgv doesnt work, you still have to go to or send everything including payment to your local dvla office, yes it says online that you can but my boss tried 10 mins ago and said no, he rang dvla who has told him that he has to either go or post everything to the local dvla office.
at end of day the you dont have to produce anything to a security gaurd or his boss as they are’nt the police or vosa and i would be very suspiocos of why they were asking for this and would be asking for the police to attend as because for you know they could be scamming so i certainly wouldnt be faxing them anything regarding the truck reg, road tax, insurance. i wud give them 3 chances to let me in if it was no 3 times then nobody else would be gettin in that day as my load would tipped at that gate and the receiving firm told to bill the secrity firm
i’ll give an example here, i collect alot of goods out of the port of dundee, the security guy was always asking for id, i always showed them my id pass for another firm i do work for, this wasnt good enough for the security guy and he asked for driving license as id, my answer was no as that contains personel info that could be used to clone my id, he wasnt having it and wouldnt let me in, so i asked for his supervisor and he said same, so i called the firm i was collecting from and i was advised to sit where i was and not to move.
in the meantime there is a police car waiting to leave the docks so i jumped out of cab and signaled for the police officer to come over which he duly did, when i explained to him what had happend he said that the security personell have no right to ask to see your driving particulars if they arent happy with the id they are givin then either the firm should set up there own id scheme or just log the veichles in and out and not ask for id or just refuse entry, with that statment the security let me in and i have never been asked for my driving liscene again as id there and they acceptt the other firms id card as my id there.
as a security officer if representing the clients wishes admission to a site can be refused for any reason, you as a driver do not have a right to have access to another companies premises, if you are delivering/collecting you are a guest of that company… if something is wrong as in phils case its upto the security to pass this up same as in this case Phil passed it up to his employer and for the two of them to sort it…
yes on the open highway i could not stop you driving down the road but we are talking private property.
arent happy with the id they are givin then either the firm should set up there own id scheme or just log the veichles in and out and not ask for id or just refuse entry, with that statment the security let me in and i have never been asked for my driving liscene again as id there and they acceptt the other firms id card as my id there.
correct with the personal details as such, ID in form of a name and photo should for normal areas be ok.
police though cannot force security to let you in… the guard could still refuse but he would have to give the reason! a few sites I have dealt with even police cannot come on unless requested or by prior arrangement, (unless emergency),
dle1uk:
where do you keep getting this word power from■■?
as a security officer if representing the clients wishes admission to a site can be refused for any reason, you as a driver do not have a right to have access to another companies premises, if you are delivering/collecting you are a guest of that company… if something is wrong as in phils case its upto the security to pass this up same as in this case Phil passed it up to his employer and for the two of them to sort it…
yes on the open highway i could not stop you driving down the road but we are talking private property.
A driver just doesn’t turn into a premises you are guarding because he wants to, he is operating under instruction from either his or your employers. So that doesn’t make him a guest. He or she has legitimate business with that company and a delivery note may be addressed to someone in particular, yet the security guard will often use his own judgement. Read the stories on TruckNet where a factory has been shut down because a JIT delivery was refused at the gatehouse.
anyone who enters someone elses premises wether delivering feeding tha cat ect is a guest of that company… which is why they are eiher logged in and out or have to sign a visitors book!!
We dont turn up at these places for a laugh!!! We are bringing something that the company that occupies that premises requires, needs or has just plain bought by accident. Whether my title when delivering said item/s is guest, driver, bloke in that truck over there, I dont really care. If you want it - let me in - if you dont want it then See ya later (or maybe not).
The company that the security represent want said item presumably, if you dont then fine ,and to be honest if I got the hassle over such a petty (as your not VOSA/Police) unprovable detail nothing would give me greater pleasure than my boss telling me to take a pic of the truck outside the site for proof of attendance, and to pull straight out.
dle1uk:
anyone who enters someone elses premises wether delivering feeding tha cat ect is a guest of that company… which is why they are eiher logged in and out or have to sign a visitors book!!
The meter reader visits my house but he isnt a guest.
dle1uk:
arent happy with the id they are givin then either the firm should set up there own id scheme or just log the veichles in and out and not ask for id or just refuse entry, with that statment the security let me in and i have never been asked for my driving liscene again as id there and they acceptt the other firms id card as my id there.
correct with the personal details as such, ID in form of a name and photo should for normal areas be ok.
police though cannot force security to let you in… the guard could still refuse but he would have to give the reason! a few sites I have dealt with even police cannot come on unless requested or by prior arrangement, (unless emergency),
i never said the police forced the security to let me in they just pointed out what they (the security gaurds) could’nt ask as id. this happend a couple of years ago and i think they are now in the process of setting up there own id scheme because some drivers dont carry any id with them.
scotstrucker:
i never said the police forced the security to let me in they just pointed out what they (the security gaurds) could’nt ask as id.
In Dublin Port while waiting to get on the ferry it is a regular occurrence for a couple of plastic police to come round the vehicles checking ID, they are not police, customs or immigration, just a couple of blokes in a dodgy uniform and every time the conversation goes like this.
Bloke - “Can we see your passport or driving licence please?”
Me - “No.”
Bloke - “We need to see some ID.”
Me - “Here’s my company ID.”
Bloke - “Okay, that’ll do if it’s all you’ve got.”
Me - “I’ve got both my passport and driving licence but all your getting is my company ID”
Bloke - “Oh, okay.”
My company ID only has my name, my employee number and the expiry date on it and he writes these details on his clipboard. I have seen them write everything down from a driving licence, name, address, licence number etc and who the hell knows were that bit of paper will end up. He is on a loser asking for a passport anyway as it isn’t currently required for the ROI. I never give my licence to any security guard, they get my company ID and that is it.
dle1uk:
anyone who enters someone elses premises wether delivering feeding tha cat ect is a guest of that company… which is why they are eiher logged in and out or have to sign a visitors book!!
Oh ffs put a sock in it man. No-one cares about your power tripping past life as a security wallah. Just accept that it’s none of your business whether the truck is tax and insured. Trucks don’t just turn up at sites for the fun of it; we are either their to deliver stuff or collect stuff so just stop being such a [zb] jobsworth and let us get on with our job. FFS talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.
whisky777:
you must have a valid tax disc displayed on the vehicle to use it on the public roads. There is no 7 or 14 days grace’
mickyblue:
talk about over the top,
you have 14 days or is it 7 days after the tax runs out to get a new one and if you are still driving with an old tax disc after 28 days your car,lorry or bus will be lifted.
only way tax is linked to insurance is when you go to the post office to buy one and thats when you need insurance to get tax etc, As you say Phill, they are security guards and no NAFF all
once again its upto whoever catches you, its at there discretion. if you are a complete arse with the man chances are he will seize car or issue you fine on spot. i think its whats called an
‘absoloute offence’ like insurance you either have it or you dont!
Coffeeholic:
I never give my licence to any security guard, they get my company ID and that is it.
I had to do that last year would you argue with a pair of Gurkas with machine guns, I was delivering to RAF Northolt though
Actually I had a yearly pass for the gatehouse for RAF Waddington, it saved booking in at the guardhouse every time I delivered there, almost daily. It had my company name, my surname and initial and DOB with a passport photo that they laminated for me. Drive up to the bloke with a gun, flash my card and then I had Triple A to deliver anything from Vulcan spares, carpets, coffee or personal effects.
what i,m trying to do is explain the situation from the other side, but as ususal some drivers are only interested in what they have to say and its of course 105% correct 105% of the time! even though you have no experience or knowledge,
A site owner can refuse admission for you having tattoos, peircings, ginger hair (now there’s a thought) or any other reason they feel like!
No-one cares about your power tripping past life as a security wallah. Just accept that it’s none of your business whether the truck is tax and insured. Trucks don’t just turn up at sites for the fun of it; we are either their to deliver stuff or collect stuff so just stop being such a [zb] jobsworth and let us get on with our job. 
