understand that Phil, I,m just trying to show the other side…
but maybe your company should have made arrangements for you to either collect the disc or for them to get it to you…
tachograph:
whisky777:
you must have a valid tax disc displayed on the vehicle to use it on the public roads. There is no 7 or 14 days grace’mickyblue:
talk about over the top,you have 14 days or is it 7 days after the tax runs out to get a new one and if you are still driving with an old tax disc after 28 days your car,lorry or bus will be lifted.
only way tax is linked to insurance is when you go to the post office to buy one and thats when you need insurance to get tax etc, As you say Phill, they are security guards and no NAFF all
If you tax a vehicle on-line before the old tax expires then you can drive the vehicle for 5 days from the expiry date of the old tax disc without displaying a current disc.
Five working days I applied for my last renewal on line on the evening of the 31st December and it came on January the 8th but Friday, Saturday and Sunday were not working days so no problem to drive. Don’t renew online, or by any other means, before midnight on the expiry date and there is no grace period.
The responsibility of the guards is, or always was, to keep a log of who goes in and goes out, and who brings what in and takes what out.
unless you know the facts you don,t know… i used to think a driver was just that but now driving, i know alot different…
alot of haulage/transport sites I have dealt with in my security background have involved several other things, coca cola was one where the driver was not allowed entry unless curtains were open and tied to the back and the bed of the trailer was clean (collection), (delivery) if there were signs of unsafe load, curtain bulging ect again not allowed in. if there were any health and safety concerns again either flagged up the ladder for the site manager to make a decision but again not allowed in…
were battening down the hatches and staying put., but you say they are only responsible for booking in and out??
this is what i mean about blame for everything laying at security,
dle1uk:
The responsibility of the guards is, or always was, to keep a log of who goes in and goes out, and who brings what in and takes what out.unless you know the facts you don,t know… i used to think a driver was just that but now driving, i know alot different…
alot of haulage/transport sites I have dealt with in my security background have involved several other things, coca cola was one where the driver was not allowed entry unless curtains were open and tied to the back and the bed of the trailer was clean (collection), (delivery) if there were signs of unsafe load, curtain bulging ect again not allowed in. if there were any health and safety concerns again either flagged up the ladder for the site manager to make a decision but again not allowed in…
were battening down the hatches and staying put., but you say they are only responsible for booking in and out??
this is what i mean about blame for everything laying at security,
Now i have missed an earlier answer to this question so forgive me if i ask it again…
How would the Guard deal with a foreign registered truck who has no legal requirement to display a UK tax disc?
Would they refuse them access to the site? If not, then it makes the whole argument around lack of funds/servicing/stolen trucks completely null and void.
It does, indeed, ■■■■■. If they are he all powerful as is suggested then surely they should make the foreign truck drop his trailer and the shunters should move it.
I know enough of the facts as I went to induction for a security job when I was laid off once. It was the first and only job I ever looked at from the jobcentre, as it goes, and it was a waste of time. I didn’t go back. Even the man doing the induction hated all of us there. And our responsibilities were minimal. If there was a problem then call the supervisor and sit tight.
My point about the farmers was that we didn’t expect anything different. We were sat waiting in Magor services one night, and down on the industrial estate another night. We were as “unprotected” there as anywhere. The guards there were decent with us, and I never had a quarrel with them. But they were there to log drivers in and out, and to make sure the trailers had what they said they had on board when they left. That was pretty much it.
And I don’t profess to having a great respect for security guards as a whole. I got into a fistfight with one in Madrid (Coslada… someone vouch for me here) because they were obviously on the take=. When the german truck got turned over and everything was taken from the cab, it took them over an hour to call the Guardia. Then they had the gall to say it was secure parking, which is why I got fighting with the little ■■■■.
I have no doubt there are many guards out there doing a brilliant job. I have come across many who were thoroughly decent people, but I have come across the others, too, as have many of us. Steve Langdon dragged the little fool out of his hut in Asda once because he had sent him away due to the RDC being full, then marked him as late arrival when he came back at the time he was told.
So don’t say this guard was right. If the vehicle was already on site then he should have accepted it and let the work commence. If the vehicle was untaxed then it was for the police to decide, not him. Besides, wouldn’t the olympic be classed as off road?
I have not mentioned anything about powerfull, just responsibilities as laid out in the sites instructions/SOP,s. I don,t know wether this is the case in Phils post but I believe it may be due to the supervisor explaining that to Phil…
Security officers now have to be registered with SIA which includes completing a course not some induction, any officer not registered is breaking the law and can be prosecuted, same goes for door staff ect…
I know of various sites that although vehicles are not checked for this on entry but if found to be untaxed or in obvious poor condition, the owner will, if possible be contacted to remove the vehicle. if owner cannot be contacted the vehicle can be clamped, or removed after further attempts to contact the owner.
wether off road or not, ususally security are agents of the landowner and or tenant, so basically if the landowner does not want an untaxed vehicle on his land then thats his choice and no traffic law covers this…
as stated by others any claim against an untaxed vehicle will take ages to process and the claim probably reduced or not paid at all, lets hope this does,nt happen to any of us,
ref none uk trucks not displaying tax and argument being null and void can i bounce that back and ask wether your own vehicles are taxed? and why?
so if stopped by a police officer because your car is untaxed you will get away with it by saying euro trucks don,t need tax in this country… so i dont need it…
I wonder if the same would happen if the guy driving Phils truck was polish or would the comments be well he should obey the rules of the country ect…
dle1uk:
I know of various sites that although vehicles are not checked for this on entry but if found to be untaxed or in obvious poor condition, the owner will, if possible be contacted to remove the vehicle. if owner cannot be contacted the vehicle can be clamped, or removed after further attempts to contact the owner.wether off road or not, ususally security are agents of the landowner and or tenant, so basically if the landowner does not want an untaxed vehicle on his land then thats his choice and no traffic law covers this…
If I turn up at a site you are working on the 4th of the month with a tax disc which ran out on the last day of the previous month you have absolutely no way of knowing if that vehicle is an untaxed or taxed vehicle. You could only make an assumption as to its status, no more than that, and could not therefore refuse entry on the grounds it was untaxed.
“Steve Langdon dragged the little fool out of his hut in Asda once because he had sent him away due to the RDC being full, then marked him as late arrival when he came back at the time he was told.
So don’t say this guard was right. If the vehicle was already on site then he should have accepted it and let the work commence. If the vehicle was untaxed then it was for the police to decide, not him. Besides, wouldn’t the olympic be classed as off road?”
I think you will find that all ASDA depots and in many cases the approach roads are private property, nothing to do with the Police while it’s on site, nothing to do with ASDA when it’s off site. Admittance to ASDA sites is the responsibility of site Management and ebbs and flows as directed by goods inwards not gate staff. Management phone down to gate and tell staff to stop entry until they rescind the instruction. The time should have been recorded as the time load first arrived at site though.
i,m afraid you can… does,nt matter how you look at it, a driver is if you like a guest of the landowner/tenant, no more. if they dont want your vehicle on their land than thats it,
in phils case i believe the security had the backing of the site owner/tenant as phils company had to fax proof of the vehicles tax status to the site…
dle1uk:
i,m afraid you can… does,nt matter how you look at it, a driver is if you like a guest of the landowner/tenant, no more. if they dont want your vehicle on their land than thats it,in phils case i believe the security had the backing of the site owner/tenant as phils company had to fax proof of the vehicles tax status to the site…
You can turn it away if you feel like but in the scenario I outlined above you couldn’t claim it was because it was an untaxed vehicle, you couldn’t possibly know if it was or not so you would have to come up with another reason. If under those circumstances I tell you it is in fact taxed and you say it isn’t you are calling me a liar to my face, at which point you are on a loser.
your missing the point, in the scenario you say I would pass it up to the site management, if they turn round and say no then no it is…
and you would be refused access…
dle1uk:
your missing the point, in the scenario you say I would pass it up to the site management, if they turn round and say no then no it is…
and you would be refused access…
So you pass a perfectly legal vehicle up to the site management? Why? Are you an idiot? 
Coffeeholic:
dle1uk:
your missing the point, in the scenario you say I would pass it up to the site management, if they turn round and say no then no it is…
and you would be refused access…So you pass a perfectly legal vehicle up to the site management? Why? Are you an idiot?
He’s just waiting for a reply from the site manager.
kjw21:
Coffeeholic:
dle1uk:
your missing the point, in the scenario you say I would pass it up to the site management, if they turn round and say no then no it is…
and you would be refused access…So you pass a perfectly legal vehicle up to the site management? Why? Are you an idiot?
He’s just waiting for a reply from the site manager.
OK, Insurance first.
No tax/MOT and you still have third party insurance. You still have third party insurance if you are drunk as a skunk or high as a kite on heroin. However insurance companies can and sometimes do refuse any payment for damage, theft, fire etc if you are claiming off your insurance. I have experienced this with customers an a few occasions, one involving a 30K motorhome that was stolen off the owners property when it was not taxed (tight git used to tax it for 6 months as they only used it in summer). They didn’t get a penny as it quite clearly states on most policies that vehicles must be taxed and mot’ed and roadworthy or they won’t pay out. Read your policies folks. I have also seen people lose claims when they have been hit, 100% the other parties fault and then the other parties insurance refuses to pay because the car that was blameless has a tyre below the legal limit and therefore, had no right to be on the road in the first place. Vehicle mods that haven’t been listed will have the same result. So will not admitting to any criminal record when you take out your insurance and there are a couple of cases right now, going through the courts because they didn’t admit to really petty offences. In accepting the policy, you accept the conditions in it, so again, I ask you to read yours!
I have a garage that does repairs and I have been given authority to repair, done the work and just about to give the car back to it’s owner when they have revoked the authorisation on a technicality and I’ve then had to make the customer pay and get him to sort out the insurance if he can.
Site entry?exit.
Yes, the site owner/operator can refuse you admission, however, clamping a vehicle or refusing to allow it to leave is certainly not in their remit. You have two choices here, theft or Illegal imprisonment, which got one security guard at one RDC 6 weeks in the big house and it still will.
Thank God these ‘Wanabee’ hero’s are not allowed to be armed or carry CS gas. They would use it if you had dirty headlights.
DoYouMeanMe?:
OK, Insurance first.No tax/MOT and you still have third party insurance. You still have third party insurance if you are drunk as a skunk or high as a kite on heroin. However insurance companies can and sometimes do refuse any payment for damage, theft, fire etc if you are claiming off your insurance. I have experienced this with customers an a few occasions, one involving a 30K motorhome that was stolen off the owners property when it was not taxed (tight git used to tax it for 6 months as they only used it in summer). They didn’t get a penny as it quite clearly states on most policies that vehicles must be taxed and mot’ed and roadworthy or they won’t pay out. Read your policies folks. I have also seen people lose claims when they have been hit, 100% the other parties fault and then the other parties insurance refuses to pay because the car that was blameless has a tyre below the legal limit and therefore, had no right to be on the road in the first place. Vehicle mods that haven’t been listed will have the same result. So will not admitting to any criminal record when you take out your insurance and there are a couple of cases right now, going through the courts because they didn’t admit to really petty offences. In accepting the policy, you accept the conditions in it, so again, I ask you to read yours!
I have a garage that does repairs and I have been given authority to repair, done the work and just about to give the car back to it’s owner when they have revoked the authorisation on a technicality and I’ve then had to make the customer pay and get him to sort out the insurance if he can.Site entry?exit.
Yes, the site owner/operator can refuse you admission, however, clamping a vehicle or refusing to allow it to leave is certainly not in their remit. You have two choices here, theft or Illegal imprisonment, which got one security guard at one RDC 6 weeks in the big house and it still will.Thank God these ‘Wannabee’ hero’s are not allowed to be armed or carry CS gas. They would use it if you had dirty headlights.
Trust me, theres some of them “wannabe” hero’s in supermarkets wearing uniform that looks the same as police and some of them also carry cuffs 
, there the proper wannabe’s
Someone please explain to me why you lot always fall out with security guards…I’ve very rarely have a problem…Met one or two miserable ■■■■■■■…and the odd ■■■■■■■■…but as said very rarely…A very high percentage are friendly…Sometimes you’ve to wake them up…and be patient…to get them smiling…they’ve switched off…Others are so used to dealing with ■■■■■■■■ drivers…they think ever driver is an ■■■■■■■■…(and to be honest from what i’ve seen…this is a valid point)…so can intially be a bit funny
As far as this road tax business is concerned…You weren’t displaying a valid road tax…Assuming your road tax ran out end of Jan…why is two weeks later you’ve not obtained it from the office…or…if need be couldn’t they have posted it to your home…I’m very much sure that if road tax has been sent…your suppose to display it…not leave it on the office desk…What would happen if the VOSA or the cops stopped you…
The security guard and his supervisor…where 100% right in stopping you…Maybe they have the insurance bit wrong…but if they can’t see a valid road tax displayed…how do they know if you have MOT…or insurance…Your truck was not 100% legal…so don’t complain when someone asks you to prove it is …A few day’s after Jan…most people would probably ignore…but 2 weeks…
Yar taking the ■■■■
SuperSmiley:
Someone please explain to me why you lot always fall out with security guards…I’ve very rarely have a problem…Met one or two miserable [zb]…and the odd [zb]…but as said very rarely…A very high percentage are friendly…Sometimes you’ve to wake them up…and be patient…to get them smiling…they’ve switched off…Others are so used to dealing with [zb] drivers…they think ever driver is an [zb]…(and to be honest from what i’ve seen…this is a valid point)…so can intially be a bit funnyAs far as this road tax business is concerned…You weren’t displaying a valid road tax…Assuming your road tax ran out end of Jan…why is two weeks later you’ve not obtained it from the office…or…if need be couldn’t they have posted it to your home…I’m very much sure that if road tax has been sent…your suppose to display it…not leave it on the office desk…What would happen if the VOSA or the cops stopped you…
The security guard and his supervisor…where 100% right in stopping you…Maybe they have the insurance bit wrong…but if they can’t see a valid road tax displayed…how do they know if you have MOT…or insurance…Your truck was not 100% legal…so don’t complain when someone asks you to prove it is …A few day’s after Jan…most people would probably ignore…but 2 weeks…
Yar taking the ■■■■
That’s because by the time they’ve finished trying to string your ‘sentences’ together they’ve lost the will to live and simply can’t be arsed arguing with you.
DoYouMeanMe?:
I have experienced this with customers an a few occasions, one involving a 30K motorhome that was stolen off the owners property when it was not taxed (tight git used to tax it for 6 months as they only used it in summer). They didn’t get a penny as it quite clearly states on most policies that vehicles must be taxed and mot’ed and roadworthy or they won’t pay out. Read your policies folks.
You don’t say who was insuring the motorhome at the time but I’d like to know so I never use them! If it states specifically in the terms & conditions that the vehicle must be taxed (maybe so for motorhomes) then that’s a whole lot different to saying “most policies” which, I think you’ll find, is not the case.
Having read both of my policies there is nothing requiring road tax in the T&C’s.
In fact taken from the Direct Line website…
Q:Am I still insured if my road tax has run out?
A:Yes. However, it is an offence to use or permit your vehicle to be on the public highway, without valid insurance cover, valid road tax and a valid MOT (if applicable)
More Than doesn’t even specify an MOT, only that the car must be in roadworthy condition!!
i will try again! if the site instructions as issued by the site owner/tenant request that no untaxed vehicles are allowed on site, then if you arrive and your vehicle as run out of tax wether 1 day 4 days or several days then that will be explained to you! the call to the site management will be for that decision to be verified… you can than take it upon yourself to argue with them… and not me!
ever thought why some of these guards you hate so much try and make life difficult for you??