Hi all , spent 10 years driving “A” frame drawbar lorries with BRS northampton- firstly for Mothercare @ Wellingborough ;then with Travis perkins . Reversing one of these 
really sorted the men from the boys 
Unlike the close coupled drags you see now- which reverse like an artic, these were a totally different animal which some drivers never mastered Has anyone else drove them or got some tales 
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Reversing these is like riding a bike, takes a bit of time getting used to but once it has clicked in your brain its easy and stays easy.
First proper challenge reversing these was in my early 20 (in the early 80`s!! 
), I came off the ferry at Ramsgate, and after getting through the water guard etc went to park up and put my papers in. In those days you drove out through the sheds then had to reverse park backed up next to each other against the wall on the right.
As I was one of the first off there was a load of space including one near the barrier / gate which i could have parked in sideways, anyway, it took me 10 minutes to back this thing in straight!!! …much to the amusement of all the dutch / german / euro W&D drivers who were watching me!!
Sat in the cab for 10 minutes afterwards “sorting my paperwork” before deciding to present my papers and take the comments on the chin but most of the other drivers, although still laughing, were good natured about it, including afew dutch guys who offered to give me some tips on reversing!
Got one stuck in a little hill village down in Provence once, followed the “road” up through the village until a got to the bit were someone had extended a hotel across the road creating a 3 metre arch!! Ended up backing down as far as i could then dog legging the drag around to the right up a small road dropped the drag which was empty, hand brake applied, bled the air out and along with a few of the locals, dragged the “A” frame bar around so it was now facing down hill, then carried on reversing the front half down the mountain for a bout half a mile before finding a turning place, spinning round the reversing back up again! Coupled up and off we went:lol: …Great fun and the locals all came out to watch!!
I enjoyed driving wagon and drags. They are tricky to reverse at first but then it clicks and off you go!
Hi Tony,
I drove a Daf 75 300 A frame drawbar outfit for BRS/Exel in wolverhampton on contract to a local metal company, it was multi drops outward usually 2-3nights out with metal bar and coiled wire , swarf/scrap as a backload, the prime mover was also a tipper. Multi drops in London to small engineering companies made me learn to reverse it in no time It had a nose coupling on the front but I found that more trouble than just reversing it, biggest mistake for most fresh people on them was putting on too much lock because it took double the amount to recover it. I had to be careful when I first went back on artics as they cut the corner more than the A frame did.
I think BRS also ran some on Halfords at Redditch.
I always say I’m just a boy,this proves it.Tried to reverse one into the workshop and ended up taking a 2 mile detour to come in nose first.A young guy who worked for K@L Transport in Glenrothes could put one in the workshop and finish at 90 degrees to the door.
Wonderful things
drove them for a German company after leaving the army doing a lot of Yugoslavia with a Mercedes 1632 then again doing trunking for IPEC swapping boxes several times a week with a Volvo F1225 before going on to Jan de Rijk where I had a MAN 22.62 easy to drive anywhere the front bit went the trailer fitted as well as the cut in on corners was next to nothing.
I could reverse a trailer with a ballasted tractor but some of the blokes there could reverse two trailers as when doing long loads you had two bogies coupled together when running to collect a load and there was a boy at Leeds depot who was driving under 25 like me was brilliant as he had an ex driver as his mate and I once saw him reverse twin trailers about quarter of a mile with out having a shunt to get into position to load as there was not enough room to turn round.In the late 60s and early 70s most ferries were reverse on and drive off and it was amazing watch some of the guys reversing around pillars onto them.
Trev_H:
Hi Tony,I drove a Daf 75 300 A frame drawbar outfit for BRS/Exel in wolverhampton on contract to a local metal company, it was multi drops outward usually 2-3nights out with metal bar and coiled wire , swarf/scrap as a backload, the prime mover was also a tipper. Multi drops in London to small engineering companies made me learn to reverse it in no time
I think BRS also ran some on Halfords at Redditch.
hi Trev , BRS had quite a few contracts that used drawbars usually with demountable bodies- remember … Kelloggs 
. We only used the front pin for de- boxing/boxing up , otherwise, like you say it was too much hassle . Travis perkins replaced there drawbars with artics about ten years ago when Exel took over & some older drivers only had class 3 licence so had to be retrained 
You dont see many A frame drags about now , the only ones that spring to mind are Anglian windows from Norwich & the parcels firm UPS 
A-Frame draw bars with de-mountable drop bodies were / are Gods joke on truck drivers 
I only drove them a couple of times, spent nearly two hours in the pouring rain, in and out the cab, trying to get the boxes to lock in and the legs up.
I would rather do multi drop in an old ERF than drop body trunking!!! 
hi, only drove one of evil things a couple of times, and that was more than enough. lucky for me we were,nt allowed to reverse them onto the loading bays because too much damage had happened.we had to drop the trailer and hook it on the front and push it on the bay.
cheers diesel
Vascoingles:
Wonderful thingsdrove them for a German company after leaving the army doing a lot of Yugoslavia with a Mercedes 1632 then again doing trunking for IPEC swapping boxes several times a week with a Volvo F1225 before going on to Jan de Rijk where I had a MAN 22.62 easy to drive anywhere the front bit went the trailer fitted as well as the cut in on corners was next to nothing.
I was using demount six wheeler rigids and two axled A frame trailers on uk trunking after years of using artics but always knew that a proper drawbar is the best.But would have been even better doing continental work.But reversing a double 45 foot semi artic/drawbar Stan Robinson type outfit seems like more of a challenge after you’ve got used to rigids and A frame trailers.
diesel dan:
hi, only drove one of evil things a couple of times, and that was more than enough. lucky for me we were,nt allowed to reverse them onto the loading bays because too much damage had happened.we had to drop the trailer and hook it on the front and push it on the bay.
cheers diesel
As the OP said they sort the men from the boys.
hiya,
I drove w&ds as a 21 year old and being the old 8 wheel wagon and 4 wheel trailer it wasn’t easy and took a while to get the knack, you’ve got to remember no power steering, i did my first three years pretty well driving only them there was’nt a HGV licence in those days so you really taught yourself have got to admit i taught myself how to drive an artic in about an hour, that was the reverseing bit, but got to admit got myself in a few knots with the w&ds for a week or two, this was the late 1950s and i never had an accident, i did get experience as an army driver which i suppose helped.
thanks harry long retired.
I drove them for seven years and when I got used to them found they were better than an artic - that’s why they call the trailer a “pup”.It was just a matter of practice and as has been mentioned before too much lock would spoil the reversing procedure.We never “nosed” them at all,you could see more through your mirrors when reversing them than shoving them.
Mind you,I made a right pig of reversing artics when I went back on them .
hi carryfast.
if driving a bloody wagon and drag made you a man,i am glad i remained a cheeky boy
In the mid 80s I drove a Wagon & Drag for Premier Plant Producers from Keyingham, East Yorkshire a Scania 112 (low cab)
We used to deliver to Nurseries mainly infant Lettuce plants in Plugs of peat that were in trays.
To set off on a Monday Morning with 20-30 deliveries was not uncommon, All these plant trays were loaded by an adapted barrow
so we could unload say 20 trays at once usually stacked to the roof of the box, The delivery points were absolute nightmares due to the
small growers we used to deliver to after Months of sweating reversing in and out of these places, I became rather good at getting in and out of the
yards and thought nothing of it.
Youve guessed it complacency kicked in and thought i new everything till i heard the load crash of glass breaking as I knocked a corner in
of a very large glasshouse , The owner was not impressed either. I calmed him down and apologised and said I admit it was my fault etc
I started unloading the trays onto the taillift to get away asap and I had put several of the stacks of trays on to the taillift (not very heavy at all)
then I heard the owner screaming again as I watched the taillift slowly tilting over then falling at an angle then a crash and all his lettuce plugs
thousands of them were all over the Yard.
Happy days
Regards
diesel dan:
hi carryfast.
if driving a bloody wagon and drag made you a man,i am glad i remained a cheeky boy
You would’nt have been glad on my old firm because they would’nt have let you nose them onto the bank they would have sacked you all 
Carryfast:
Vascoingles:
Wonderful thingsdrove them for a German company after leaving the army doing a lot of Yugoslavia with a Mercedes 1632 then again doing trunking for IPEC swapping boxes several times a week with a Volvo F1225 before going on to Jan de Rijk where I had a MAN 22.62 easy to drive anywhere the front bit went the trailer fitted as well as the cut in on corners was next to nothing.
I was using demount six wheeler rigids and two axled A frame trailers on uk trunking after years of using artics but always knew that a proper drawbar is the best.But would have been even better doing continental work.But reversing a double 45 foot semi artic/drawbar Stan Robinson type outfit seems like more of a challenge after you’ve got used to rigids and A frame trailers.
You were only on a Boy’s waggon & drag Carryfast ! The proper waggon & trailer is the turntable trailer but that requires a proper driver !! one who can reverse the trailer into the bay without having to put it on the nose !! The voice of first hand expirience !! Bewick.
Bewick:
Carryfast:
Vascoingles:
Wonderful thingsdrove them for a German company after leaving the army doing a lot of Yugoslavia with a Mercedes 1632 then again doing trunking for IPEC swapping boxes several times a week with a Volvo F1225 before going on to Jan de Rijk where I had a MAN 22.62 easy to drive anywhere the front bit went the trailer fitted as well as the cut in on corners was next to nothing.
I was using demount six wheeler rigids and two axled A frame trailers on uk trunking after years of using artics but always knew that a proper drawbar is the best.But would have been even better doing continental work.But reversing a double 45 foot semi artic/drawbar Stan Robinson type outfit seems like more of a challenge after you’ve got used to rigids and A frame trailers.
You were only on a Boy’s waggon & drag Carryfast ! The proper waggon & trailer is the turntable trailer but that requires a proper driver !! one who can reverse the trailer into the bay without having to put it on the nose !! The voice of first hand expirience !! Bewick.
You’re wrong again bewick.An A frame drawbar is a turntable one you’re mixing it up with the close coupled caravan mickey mouse ones.But if you’d be up to the challenge I’d bet that I could put that Stan Robinson artic and drawbar double 45 footer combination on the bank where you’d have it tied in knots before you’d got 50 feet. 
Carryfast:
diesel dan:
hi carryfast.
if driving a bloody wagon and drag made you a man,i am glad i remained a cheeky boyYou would’nt have been glad on my old firm because they would’nt have let you nose them onto the bank they would have sacked you all
Carryfast my son you couln’t drive sheep with a good dog !! No Dave I said “drive” !!! Bewick.
Bewick:
Carryfast:
diesel dan:
hi carryfast.
if driving a bloody wagon and drag made you a man,i am glad i remained a cheeky boyYou would’nt have been glad on my old firm because they would’nt have let you nose them onto the bank they would have sacked you all
Carryfast my son you couln’t drive sheep with a good dog !! No Dave I said “drive” !!! Bewick.
Bewick As you can’t seem to be able tell the difference between an A frame drawbar outfit and a close coupled caravan type one lets hope it’s not you who’ll be the judge of that.