If, as a driver, you go voluntarily to a checkpoint regards questioning load security after workplace says it’s ok but you don’t think it is what would DVSA do if they agree it’s not safe?
Would they take action against driver?
There would be no access to put rachet strap over btw as always to very top of trailer and preloaded when we go to pick up so it’s not as if we have chance to strap as we go so if turned up at checkpoint it’s not as if can rectify there and then which is why questioning what view would they take ?
In bit of dispute over DDs as work says it’s ok to just use the internal for pallets on both decks.
I have doubts as the combined weight of the 2 pallets lower/upper is around 600kgs. I’m fine with the singles at the front but not the rest on DD as they’re expecting a single internal to be ok for both decks.
It’s come to a head as they’re now actively disciplining over insufficient strapping, which I’m fine with but when asked about DD got the answer above. They can’t whine about strapping correctly when they don’t offer facilities or access on DDs.
It sounds as if you work for a large logistics supplier type rather than a small company where you can actually talk to someone?
Ask for written instructions and risk assessment on load securing. Cover your tutu. Put the ball in their court.
Franglais:
It sounds as if you work for a large logistics supplier type rather than a small company where you can actually talk to someone?
Ask for written instructions and risk assessment on load securing. Cover your tutu. Put the ball in their court.
The large companies I work for has written instructions & risk assessments for everything including how to wipe your own bottom, so if that’s how they tell you to do it crack on and don’t worry about it. I’m sure if those lovely vosa people want a chat, it will be with the company not you.
If, as a driver, you go voluntarily to a checkpoint regards questioning load security after workplace says it’s ok BUT YOU DON’T THINK IT IS what would DVSA do if they agree it’s not safe?
Would they take action against driver?
So if that is what you (or the hypothetical driver) genuinely believes why are you/he leaving the yard with it in the first place??.
The driver is reponsible for load security and risks all the grief if things go ■■■■ up.
■■■■■■■■ to what some office monkey says, if you think you’re right and they are wrong… stand your ground.
If in doubt and you think there is some element of risk in the security methods get advice from VOSA …before you take it on the road.
If, as a driver, you go voluntarily to a checkpoint regards questioning load security after workplace says it’s ok BUT YOU DON’T THINK IT IS what would DVSA do if they agree it’s not safe?
Would they take action against driver?
So if that is what you (or the hypothetical driver) genuinely believes why are you/he leaving the yard with it in the first place??.
The driver is reponsible for load security and risks all the grief if things go ■■■■ up.
■■■■■■■■ to what some office monkey says, if you think you’re right and they are wrong… stand your ground.
If in doubt and you think there is some element of risk in the security methods get advice from VOSA …before you take it on the road.
^^^ + 1. if you think your load is unsafe…don’t take it!
If, as a driver, you go voluntarily to a checkpoint regards questioning load security after workplace says it’s ok BUT YOU DON’T THINK IT IS what would DVSA do if they agree it’s not safe?
Would they take action against driver?
So if that is what you (or the hypothetical driver) genuinely believes why are you/he leaving the yard with it in the first place??.
The driver is reponsible for load security and risks all the grief if things go ■■■■ up.
■■■■■■■■ to what some office monkey says, if you think you’re right and they are wrong… stand your ground.
If in doubt and you think there is some element of risk in the security methods get advice from VOSA …before you take it on the road.
Agree with rob on this, however from your post you seem to suggest that the combined weight of the pallet on the bottom and the one directly above it is around 600kg, dependant on the splitthen you wouldn’t even need a ratchet, a drop down would be fine as it would be below weight, not to mention you haven’t said what type of trailer you have regarding TUV and positive fit etc etc.
Here is the good bit though, it also depends on the product as those good men from the checkpoint have left a great big grey area regarding load security beyond the weights stated in the regs, it seems to be down to opinion and mood from what I hear, it’s left up to them so they can spank you for a ton.
That said, I’m sure I read that they had agreed to back down on securing pallets on the top deck of doubles after industry pressure when they first started cracking down.
I’m not sure but is this not a reg from the early eighties that they decided to focus on, hence the low pallet weight compared to the standard pallet weight of today’s trucks? I’m probably wrong…I am on most things
Franglais:
It sounds as if you work for a large logistics supplier type rather than a small company where you can actually talk to someone?
Ask for written instructions and risk assessment on load securing. Cover your tutu. Put the ball in their court.
Done that not got an answer yet? I’ll be asking tomorrow though face to face
robroy:
So if that is what you (or the hypothetical driver) genuinely believes why are you/he leaving the yard with it in the first place??.
The driver is reponsible for load security and risks all the grief if things go ■■■■ up.
■■■■■■■■ to what some office monkey says, if you think you’re right and they are wrong… stand your ground.
If in doubt and you think there is some element of risk in the security methods get advice from VOSA …before you take it on the road.
I’m not in that position … yet!!
I have heard , but not confirmed , that one driver did exactly that and got threatened with suspension as TM deemed it a reasonable request. Trailer got picked up.
It’s seems we’ve moved to a threat centred style at work so that’s why I was asking. If in same position I was going to see if they threatened same - then say ok on way back I’ll call into DVSA and clarify security as I don’t think it’s adequate to just use an internal despite asking for company guidance etc
This is new situation as we’ve not used DDs for this contract before, all other collections were very light pallets just bulky so it wasn’t a problem .
These are around 300kg each.
Wish I could truly afford to get suspended but I can’t which is why I’m thinking of the DVSA route I’m that ■■■■■■ off over how it’s changed
Norfolkinclue1:
Agree with rob on this, however from your post you seem to suggest that the combined weight of the pallet on the bottom and the one directly above it is around 600kg, dependant on the splitthen you wouldn’t even need a ratchet, a drop down would be fine as it would be below weight, not to mention you haven’t said what type of trailer you have regarding TUV and positive fit etc etc.
That’s correct both pallets around 300kg each so even split .I’m honestly not sure if they count as separate because of deck separation or indeed are combined? That’s my problem and what I’ve been trying to find out? If separate then yes all good to use an internal.
I dont know how they’re treated.
DD is standard. No fancy reinforcement though pallets are positive fit
Bottom line is although they’d likely go to the company and ask to see what what guidelines are being given, they’d still likely land you with a fine and impound the truck until its sorted. Very least they wont let you continue if they being ultra nice.
With our deckers, we’ve been advised to treat the top and bottom deck seperately. So an internal could be holding a 200kg pallet at the top, then a 350kg at the bottom.
I cant find any info on whether this is legit. For bigger pallets that stack to the roof I use internals or double internals (for upto 800kg). Obviously causes an issue if the entire trailer is to the top as you run out of internals.
If you carrying these a lot, I’d ask for the official company policy written down. It sounds like they need to rethink the trailers and maybe get internal curtains as well as straps like the beer trailers use.
They might be forgetting that they are responsible for your welfare under the Health and Safety at Work Act. Tends to get complience people twitching.
Bottom line is although they’d likely go to the company and ask to see what what guidelines are being given, they’d still likely land you with a fine and impound the truck until its sorted. Very least they wont let you continue if they being ultra nice.
With our deckers, we’ve been advised to treat the top and bottom deck seperately. So an internal could be holding a 200kg pallet at the top, then a 350kg at the bottom.
I cant find any info on whether this is legit. For bigger pallets that stack to the roof I use internals or double internals (for upto 800kg). Obviously causes an issue if the entire trailer is to the top as you run out of internals.
If you carrying these a lot, I’d ask for the official company policy written down. It sounds like they need to rethink the trailers and maybe get internal curtains as well as straps like the beer trailers use.
They might be forgetting that they are responsible for your welfare under the Health and Safety at Work Act. Tends to get complience people twitching.
Read that link though still think they’d end up fining me even if acting in good faith!
Think our company are saying same , treat as separate decks but like you I can’t find definite answer.
As I’ve said previously I’ve send request for policy to TM but not back into work till tomorrow where I’ll be asking FtF for policy, preferably backed up in black and white!
It’s a sad state of affairs when companies need “Compliance Officers” or even whole departments, just to stay legal. It certainly suggests over-regulation…
Harry was exactly right though, the VI are not our friends. Doesn’t matter how fluffy and cuddly they wish to appear these days, they’re in it for the brownie points and the money.
Bottom line is although they’d likely go to the company and ask to see what what guidelines are being given, they’d still likely land you with a fine and impound the truck until its sorted. Very least they wont let you continue if they being ultra nice.
With our deckers, we’ve been advised to treat the top and bottom deck seperately. So an internal could be holding a 200kg pallet at the top, then a 350kg at the bottom.
I cant find any info on whether this is legit. For bigger pallets that stack to the roof I use internals or double internals (for upto 800kg). Obviously causes an issue if the entire trailer is to the top as you run out of internals.
If you carrying these a lot, I’d ask for the official company policy written down. It sounds like they need to rethink the trailers and maybe get internal curtains as well as straps like the beer trailers use.
They might be forgetting that they are responsible for your welfare under the Health and Safety at Work Act. Tends to get complience people twitching.
Read that link though still think they’d end up fining me even if acting in good faith!
Think our company are saying same , treat as separate decks but like you I can’t find definite answer.
As I’ve said previously I’ve send request for policy to TM but not back into work till tomorrow where I’ll be asking FtF for policy, preferably backed up in black and white!
Not chased our compliance chap yet over it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
How are you communicating?? Writing/Emailing is a MUST.
If you have a vebal chat follow up with an Email.
Example: Further to our chat today on 02/12/2018 @ 20.10 we dicussed etc etc…
robroy:
So if that is what you (or the hypothetical driver) genuinely believes why are you/he leaving the yard with it in the first place??.
The driver is reponsible for load security and risks all the grief if things go ■■■■ up.
■■■■■■■■ to what some office monkey says, if you think you’re right and they are wrong… stand your ground.
If in doubt and you think there is some element of risk in the security methods get advice from VOSA …before you take it on the road.
I’m not in that position … yet!!
I have heard , but not confirmed , that one driver did exactly that and got threatened with suspension as TM deemed it a reasonable request. Trailer got picked up.
It’s seems we’ve moved to a threat centred style at work so that’s why I was asking. If in same position I was going to see if they threatened same - then say ok on way back I’ll call into DVSA and clarify security as I don’t think it’s adequate to just use an internal despite asking for company guidance etc
This is new situation as we’ve not used DDs for this contract before, all other collections were very light pallets just bulky so it wasn’t a problem .
These are around 300kg each.
Wish I could truly afford to get suspended but I can’t which is why I’m thinking of the DVSA route I’m that ■■■■■■ off over how it’s changed
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So not a Union firm then evidently…and not in what position exactly?
Not able to stand up for yourself when you genuinely think you’re right and they are wrong?
If they are being like that, ie (in your opinion) making you do unsafe practices, inform VOSA…■■■■ em.
Never been one for running to the teacher or grassing people up, but I would make an exception in their case if they are threatening you with suspension or the sack.
You are a professional driver making a legitimate appeal, not a naughty school kid, if you are saying their practices are unsafe, …and this is what they come back with?
I hate these type of ■■■■ s.
Don’t see what you gain one way or the other now. You say you can’t afford to be suspended, I’d assume that would be the minimum you could expect if you just dropped into a DVSA checkpoint with a load you’re unsure about. If you’re right then whether the DVSA decide to do you personally or not, then your working life becomes untenable very quickly. If you’re wrong then you’ve gone off route and wasted time. Only one loser here and that’s you.
If you’re not happy then you do not take the load out of the yard, as long as you’re suspended on full pay, it’s not a bad time of year to take advantage of the extra holiday and seek out a new job whilst doing so. Whichever way the coin lands, your days there are numbered, make those numbers work to your advantage.
Not load related but I remember a lad years ago who upon starting with his new employer set out on his first trip and then took it upon himself to take a detour to a ministry of transport test station for them to check the truck was roadworthy before he continued the journey. It wasn’t, 1 GV9 for a minor air leak (a nylon chassis lube pipe had rubbed a small hole in a metal air pipe) and that was the end of his employment with that company!
windrush:
Not load related but I remember a lad years ago who upon starting with his new employer set out on his first trip and then took it upon himself to take a detour to a ministry of transport test station for them to check the truck was roadworthy before he continued the journey. It wasn’t, 1 GV9 for a minor air leak (a nylon chassis lube pipe had rubbed a small hole in a metal air pipe) and that was the end of his employment with that company!
Pete.
I can’t believe this thread was started, but to carry on with " the hypothetical situation " what happens when you turn into the vosa station and the load falls off? Do you have the defence of I was bringing it here to check if it was safe to travel? It is clearly not safe!! You will get exactly as you deserve!! Also your reputation as a spineless grass will be firmly cemented. “Hypothetically"of course. I never had a problem with " getting a tug” in over forty years, but I never ever had a thought about deliberately going out of my way to cause trouble for any employer. Grow up .
