Just wondering, how you stand with this scenario.
Parked up last night, dropped trailer,and drove into local town for provisions, and a takeaway. Tacho was removed, cos I wasnt planning to do this. Put 10 k on the milage, was I legal doing this or not, as effectively the truck became my “car”?
your kidding right?
I seem to remember there being a test case on this but I cannot remember the outcome
So if I run out of hours then , can I drop my trailer and drive my " car " home!!
Was too far to walk, and its not like i was being paid for it
No disrespect Bugcos but you are driving a HGV without a tacho , if you had been stopped what would be your defence. Also , if VOSA pulled you the next day how you gonna explain the missing milage?
It’s a no brainer mate.
Hows the job going anyway?
you used to be allowed to use your unit for ‘personal use’ but it was stopped about 5 years ago I think. I don’t know how that applies to truck shows etc though.
bugcos:
Tacho was removed,
That’s the bit you got wrong. The rest of it is a very grey area but in general, if you have a tachograph fitted you can’t move without a disc in it.
I remember something about if you own the truck and it is for personal use you are ok.
Same as if you hire a 7.5 tonner to move house.
But the matter of insurance arises. Is the truck insured for you to use it for that purpose? Usually the answer is no.
I’ve done it. Got weekended; the cafe I was staying at had closed and I needed a crap. So I sticks card in unit and jaunts down the road to a supermarket and did the ‘business’ and went back to ■■■■■■■■■■■■. Wrote on card ‘personal use’ but found out later when I handed card in NOT INSURED for said activity. 
Definately not right, what about your trailer though? Unlikely with what you were carying but who’s to stop someone running off with it while you’re gone?
Was talking to my C+E instructor when I was taking my training I was asking him about tacho rules and so on, on my last training day before test his partner arrived that morning while we were having a drink and started discussing an ex-trainee of theirs who’d been done for this exact thing, his court hearing had just taken place.
This guy was 21 years old and was working for his dads company (a friend of the instructor in question), he’d been parking up for the night, dropping the trailer and running around in the unit for private use without his tacho in. On an inspection of the companies records they found all this activity, but the charts had been ‘doctored’ in some way to try and hide the mileage missing, the distance trace didn’t add up to the written mileage. Anyway I can’t remember how long now but apparently he’d been given a prison sentance, it was 7 weeks or something, to make an example of him. I’ve got a pretty good ■■■■■■■■ detector and am convinced this was a true story as it was being talked about as it’d just happened not because i’d asked and they decided to spin a scare story.
Definitely not legal but when I did it here in France and at the end of the week got stopped in a Ministry check, the examiner, noticing the 15 missing kms merely said ‘vous cherchez un restaurant?’ On hearing my reply ‘yes’ he said ‘ok’.
But then the French do have a thing about being able to eat properly. 
RobB39,
I think you will find that even personal use on a 7.5T requires a tacho as of over a year ago. Any professional rental company will issue you with Tacho’s and show you how to fill them in before you leave their yard. It was always required but never really inforced until the rise in white van man removal companies running without O-Licences. The same applies to what you are carrying if the Police or Vosa are not happy that you are moving your own furniture etc. they can seize the truck and contents until they are satisfied that it was non-profit.
Mind you with the rise in fuel and crap rates about non-profit or reward would apply to most these days!!
‘Private’ use of a vehicle only extends to vehicles where the maximum authorised mass of the vehicle (or combination) doesn’t exceed 7.5 tonnes. Artic cabs running solo will be non private as they have an authorised mass between 18 and 26 tonnes, dependant upon number of axles.
The Court case regarding recording ‘private’ driving was DPP vs Guy, where it was determined that a driver taking a vehicle home was still required to record that driving; so taking the chart out is a no no.
The case involving the operators’ son looks like he was convicted of ‘making a false record;’ the odometer readings do not match the chart recording. That particular offence may carry a custodial sentence of up to 2 years.
The insurance question depends upon the wording of the individual policy. The majority of vehicles I drove were covered for private use ‘by the policy holder or persons in the employ of the policy holder,’ or some such wording. But you need to check the policy.
I know I used to do it many years ago, but we still run with a card in it and wrote for private use.
At least that way you can account for the mileage and may only get a don’t do it again from VOSA, but then again you might not.
However I doubt any attempt to lose miles of falsify records will get the same treatment.
I also believe that at the last round of tacho regs changes that you had to have a tacho card in a vehicle of over 7.5t even if it was a private vehicle, E.G. Horse boxes.
I might be mistaken but me thinks u breaking tacho laws.
As far as I am aware you must always keep your tacho in until you are parked up to take your daily rest/weekly rest, whether that be back at base or in a layby somewhere. Once your chart is out you cannot move your vehicle until you have had your minimum daily rest or told to do so by the traffic police, or vosa
Any driving you do must be done on your chart and included in your daily and weekly driving times
As I say I could be very wrong but thats the way I read it at the minute.
Take care
Jacko 
its a very dodgy subject this, last time i was in this position i put another card in {all filled out properly} nipped up the supermarket then handed that chart in with the one for the days work,at least then i wasnt deliberately trying to break any laws
and the mileage was accounted for, i have to add though,i was well within my driving time/spreadover,it was just that i had all ready filled in the card for that day
bugcos:
Just wondering, how you stand with this scenario.Parked up last night, dropped trailer,and drove into local town for provisions, and a takeaway. Tacho was removed, cos I wasnt planning to do this. Put 10 k on the milage, was I legal doing this or not, as effectively the truck became my “car”?
the scenario is court licence suspended. lose youre job (you broke the rules you boss has to protect his operators licence)
you filled out the missing mileage and split them between tachos(manual disks) its called fraud and youre doing 3 months porridge
you get what you need before you park up 
I think the general consensus is that it’s a big no no to use the unit to nip into town for a buttie!
I’ve done it myself in the past (the brit lads used to take it in turns for us all to pile into one of the units to get into downtown Barcelona on an evening…this was in 1988 though!).
geebee45:
‘Private’ use of a vehicle only extends to vehicles where the maximum authorised mass of the vehicle (or combination) doesn’t exceed 7.5 tonnes. Artic cabs running solo will be non private as they have an authorised mass between 18 and 26 tonnes, dependant upon number of axles.
The plate will show above weight, for axles. BUT, an artic unit detached from trailer cannot carry any goods (it is not designed to do so). Unless you strap your shopping to the footplate. It will also weigh about 7 tonnes it cannot carry goods for high or reward as it is a traction vehicle. How do you stand on that?
robB39:
geebee45:
‘Private’ use of a vehicle only extends to vehicles where the maximum authorised mass of the vehicle (or combination) doesn’t exceed 7.5 tonnes. Artic cabs running solo will be non private as they have an authorised mass between 18 and 26 tonnes, dependant upon number of axles.The plate will show above weight, for axles. BUT, an artic unit detached from trailer cannot carry any goods (it is not designed to do so). Unless you strap your shopping to the footplate. It will also weigh about 7 tonnes it cannot carry goods for high or reward as it is a traction vehicle. How do you stand on that?
A tractor unit IS designed to carry goods, they call them trailers 
You need a class 1 or C+E to drive a solo tractor unit AFAIK