Ukraine [merged]

[carryfast]

robroy:
Well this is my stance on it,.I didn’t realise the criteria was so low…so.
I’m shipping out as a freedom fighter to join the Ukraine forces.
Military based qualifications??
I once delivered to RAF Lossiemouth, stayed overnight, .and had a couple of pints in the Sergeant’s mess.
I’ve also delivered to The Horse Guards HQ in Hyde park,.and had my dinner there.
So those two examples with the fact that I have seen every episode of Seal Team on the telly…TWICE,.will qualify me quite enough for military service.

Cheers Carryfast,.I appreciate your guidance.
I’ll let you know how I get on.

You don’t seem to get this nuclear war thing.
It’s launch crew v civil defence and defence doesn’t mean in the literal sense.
Not have a go granny armed with an NLAW or a rifle v MLRS or Howitzer.
But if you do go take Liz Truss with you.

[robroy]

Carryfast:

robroy:
Well this is my stance on it,.I didn’t realise the criteria was so low…so.
I’m shipping out as a freedom fighter to join the Ukraine forces.
Military based qualifications??
I once delivered to RAF Lossiemouth, stayed overnight, .and had a couple of pints in the Sergeant’s mess.
I’ve also delivered to The Horse Guards HQ in Hyde park,.and had my dinner there.
So those two examples with the fact that I have seen every episode of Seal Team on the telly…TWICE,.will qualify me quite enough for military service.

Cheers Carryfast,.I appreciate your guidance.
I’ll let you know how I get on.

You don’t seem to get this nuclear war thing.
It’s launch crew v civil defence and defence doesn’t mean in the literal sense.
Not have a go granny armed with an NLAW or a rifle v MLRS or Howitzer.
But if you do go take Liz Truss with you.

Nah you’re right my experience in nuclear war is pretty shallow, but I bow to your expertise…Thanks.

[robroy]

Probably won’t bother going over after all.

[the_maoster]

Carryfast:
I’ve probably seen the inside of more local government nuclear bunkers than you’d know even existed.

I’ve been inside umpteen restaurants but I still know eff all about cooking.

[carryfast]

robroy:
Probably won’t bother going over after all.
0

Too late you’ve took the Queen’s shilling now Rob.
She’ll be fine with me in the bunker but not sure about her cooking and shopping skills.
She’s more likely to stock up with cabbages and Vodka than a decent supply of steak and chips and Beer.
How bad can it be.

[carryfast]

the maoster:

Carryfast:
I’ve probably seen the inside of more local government nuclear bunkers than you’d know even existed.

I’ve been inside umpteen restaurants but I still know eff all about cooking.

I’ve never been in a restaurant that’s underground with a massive blast door no windows and a big generator and a nuke fallout filtration system and a makeshift morgue.
Which left me with the view that Id rather be outside facing oblivion and a quick end rather than be locked in there facing a slow end working under and imposing emergency martial law.
Regardless of how good the food might be for as long as it lasts.
Good luck with the containment strategy.

[carryfast]

the maoster:
Facebook is currently showing a video of Diane Abbot criticising Putin for rolling his tanks into Croatia!

Dear God, that very nearly was our Home Secretary.

To be fair that’s better than Liz Truss thinking that German tanks painted with the black crosses rolling up to Russia’s borders will fix everything.
If only JFK had tried that it would have ended the Cuban missile crisis much quicker.

[juddian]

Remember, whatever source you are getting news from, the first casualty of war is the truth.
The last 2 years of lies and propaganda can’t have been forgotten already shirley.

PS are you missing Trump yet.

[robroy]

Juddian:
Remember, whatever source you are getting news from, the first casualty of war is the truth.
The last 2 years of lies and propaganda can’t have been forgotten already shirley.

PS are you missing Trump yet.

I’ve wondered a couple of times how Trump.would have dealt with all this.
Love him or loathe him, he was the kind of guy who took no sh. off anybody,.and was not afraid to speak his mind no matter how unpopular it made him to others…a bit like me when I think about it, but with a different hairstyle.

[carryfast]

robroy:

Juddian:
Remember, whatever source you are getting news from, the first casualty of war is the truth.
The last 2 years of lies and propaganda can’t have been forgotten already shirley.

PS are you missing Trump yet.

I’ve wondered a couple of times how Trump.would have dealt with all this.
Love him or loathe him, he was the kind of guy who took no sh. off anybody,.and was not afraid to speak his mind no matter how unpopular it made him to others…a bit like me when I think about it, but with a different hairstyle.

We’ll pull NATO back from the old Soviet WP buffers and stay out of Ukraine.
But SALT is history and we reserve the right to make an all out preemptive nuke strike that takes out their crap motherland if these Russian retards as much as look at us in a dodgy way from now on, seems to cover it.

[adam277]

robroy:

Juddian:
Remember, whatever source you are getting news from, the first casualty of war is the truth.
The last 2 years of lies and propaganda can’t have been forgotten already shirley.

PS are you missing Trump yet.

I’ve wondered a couple of times how Trump.would have dealt with all this.
Love him or loathe him, he was the kind of guy who took no sh. off anybody,.and was not afraid to speak his mind no matter how unpopular it made him to others…a bit like me when I think about it, but with a different hairstyle.

Trump was a nato skeptic and against nato expansionism. He didn’t like having ten’s of thousands of us troops in Europe.
He also didn’t like the USA basically subsidizing the EU’s defence budgets.
I don’t think Russia would of invaded if trump was president. Not least because he would not of wanted Ukraine in NATO.

Whereas biden wants to act tough on Russia when he could of avoided this just by giving Putin the assurances he wanted.

bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53589245

[carryfast]

adam277:

robroy:

Juddian:
Remember, whatever source you are getting news from, the first casualty of war is the truth.
The last 2 years of lies and propaganda can’t have been forgotten already shirley.

PS are you missing Trump yet.

I’ve wondered a couple of times how Trump.would have dealt with all this.
Love him or loathe him, he was the kind of guy who took no sh. off anybody,.and was not afraid to speak his mind no matter how unpopular it made him to others…a bit like me when I think about it, but with a different hairstyle.

Trump was a nato skeptic and against nato expansionism. He didn’t like having ten’s of thousands of us troops in Europe.
He also didn’t like the USA basically subsidizing the EU’s defence budgets.
I don’t think Russia would of invaded if trump was president. Not least because he would not of wanted Ukraine in NATO.

Whereas biden wants to act tough on Russia when he could of avoided this just by giving Putin the assurances he wanted.

bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53589245

Russia’s justified issue is clearly about NATO expansion to Russia’s borders.
Attacking Ukraine isn’t going to fix that.
Sooner or later Russia has to take that fight to NATO.
Which leaves the question where and how and by definition that means WW3.
I’ve always thought that Ukraine is a sideshow and diversionary exercise.
It looks almost as if he’s using it as bait to create a move by NATO.
NATO has basically zb’d up big time by going all in on a flawed strategy of containment instead of MAD and especially UK will be lucky to survive the resulting trap that Russia seems to be setting.
We’re a sitting duck for a large scale combined air and naval attack and/or possibly a strategic nuke attack.

[juddian]

I agree with the above, with Trump everyone knew where they stood and the bod meant what he said, you didn’t have to like him to know that.

Trump treated Russia and Putin with due respect (mutually reciprocated) when since the fall of the USSR they’ve continued to be treated like some sort of pariah, i believe Trump would have made an agreement agreeable to both sides here, putting the EU (Germany) and its expanionist dreams back in its box.

Now the muppet show is running the USA anything could happen.

[adam277]

Juddian:
I agree with the above, with Trump everyone knew where they stood and the bod meant what he said, you didn’t have to like him to know that.

Trump treated Russia and Putin with due respect (mutually reciprocated) when since the fall of the USSR they’ve continued to be treated like some sort of pariah, i believe Trump would have made an agreement agreeable to both sides here, putting the EU (Germany) and its expanionist dreams back in its box.

Now the muppet show is running the USA anything could happen.

Remember when they said Trump would start WW3 if elected?
Turned out he kept peace with Russia. the first president to meet a north korean leader, meet with the taliban and agreed a timescale for withdrawal (which Biden ignored) And pulled troops out of Europe.
Whereas Biden, it is one foreign crisis after another. All because he wants to seem tough to China, Russia, Taliban. They call his bluff everytime.

Trump really was not that bad in retrospect. He was America first and did not want the USA to be the world police.

[franglais]

Jeez…
Putin invades Ukraine and you two are talking about NATO being expansionist. Un…!..Believeable

[the_maoster]

Of course NATO or more particularly te EU sis expansionist. It’s their whole reason to exist.

Imagine for a minute if Putin had somehow effected a regime change in Mexico to a very Moscow sympathetic one. The banshee wailing from the Americans would be unbelievable.

[franglais]

Meanwhile, the UK Gov is giving Russian oligarchs time to sell off their assets, rather than just seize them now.
.

adam277:
Remember when they said Trump would start WW3 if elected?
Turned out he kept peace with Russia. the first president to meet a north korean leader, meet with the taliban and agreed a timescale for withdrawal (which Biden ignored) And pulled troops out of Europe.
Whereas Biden, it is one foreign crisis after another. All because he wants to seem tough to China, Russia, Taliban. They call his bluff everytime.

Biden is here to see Trumps seeds bearing fruit. He is dealing with the crap Trump started. Im not saying Biden is making a perfect job, but Putin is taking advantage of Trump saying the US wants to pull back.

Juddian:
Trump treated Russia and Putin with due respect (mutually reciprocated) when since the fall of the USSR they’ve continued to be treated like some sort of pariah, i believe Trump would have made an agreement agreeable to both sides here, putting the EU (Germany) and its expanionist dreams back in its box.

Like Molotov/Ribbentrop Pact? Two major powers telling smaller independent countries what will happen to them?
Trump would have given in to some of Putin`s demands, yes. Appeasement of bullies.

robroy:
and was not afraid to speak his mind no matter

He sure said shed loads of stuff, all praising himself, but not all backed by fact or actions.

robroy:
Love him or loathe him, he was the kind of guy who took no sh. off anybody,

Kim Jong-un gave Trump handfuls of crap while Trump told the world he was the boss.

“Meanwhile, The New York Times in June 2020 reported that US intelligence officials determined Russia paid bounties to Taliban-linked Afghan militants to kill US troops.
The Trump administration didn’t take any known responses. Though the White House claimed Trump was not initially briefed on the matter, reporting from multiple outlets suggests otherwise. Trump in a July 2020 interview said he had not confronted Russian President Vladimir Putin on the matter.”
businessinsider.com/trump-b … ?r=US&IR=T

Too frightened to upset Putin.
A nasty piece of work who admired other nasty pieces of work.

[juddian]

bitchute.com/video/EYk3OyB9juE/

The first 4 minutes of this video are worth listening to.

[franglais]

Juddian:
Col. Macgregor keeps it real on Fox News. China ready to mediate settlement

The first 4 minutes of this video are worth listening to.

So, Ukraine is not to be allowed to determine it`s own future?

Putin alleges that if it became a NATO country it would be a threat to him, by having arms on its frontier. BUT Putin putting his arms forcibly on NATOs border is somehow OK?

Putin`s naked aggression is as good a recruiting sergeant for NATO as any. Sweden and Finland might be tempted more now than ever to join.

Let him keep half of Ukraine, so long as he doesn`t take the rest?
A reward for being a !!!. A carve up by the West of a country worthy of Hitler and Stalin.

Ukraine was never historically part of Russia. The USSR had military held its satellite countries down, but they (some of them) are now free of oppression.
History is dependent on which particular little window is chosen as “the right one” to return to.
Should the UK reclaim USA from the separatist rebels? They are English speakers after all.

[carryfast]

Franglais:
Jeez…
Putin invades Ukraine and you two are talking about NATO being expansionist. Un…!..Believeable

Russia has hit Ukraine precisely BECAUSE of NATO expansionism and is now possibly even using it as bait to lure NATO into making a move.

This is all about NATO expansionism which is a deliberate requirement of the change to containment strategy.
Ukraine was Russia’s line in the sand.
But the scary bit is that the conditions laid down by Russia also included NATO backing off from its borders everywhere that it’s moved up to them.
By definition that means Russia won’t stop at Ukraine.
While an obvious logical strategy would be advancing west along the path of least resistance which possibly means Moldova and Romania, also thereby within range of naval support, to outflank Poland and also threatening big NATO player UK with large scale air and naval bombardment and/or strategic nuke attack would be high on Russia’s list of next moves.
In answer to which we’ve got the Biden, Bozo and Truss show and our cut to the bone military that can’t think in terms of mutually assured destruction and like you obviously have no idea of the danger that they’ve sleep walked us into.
To which your solution is obviously let’s use what little defence we’ve got to fight an unwinnable conventional war, on Russia’s terms, in Russia’s back yard, across a front stretching from the Baltic to the Black Sea.
While we’ve got effectively nothing to defend our own airspace and no long range coastal anti ship missile capability and the US won’t allow any strategic nuke retaliatory strike by our Trident fleet let alone a preemptive one in the face of a clear threat by Russia to nuke us.
U zb believable.