just listened to a guy from FTA on breakfast tv he said there is a driver shortage because of the cost of training and there solution is to lobby government for loans for trainee drivers he said the cost was around £5000 .no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up with
crannman:
no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up with
Of course there wasn’t, the industry don’t want to spend their own money solving a problem of their own making, instead they want the government to pay for training, so they have an excess of drivers which means they can keep wages down. The government have so far refused, but if they did finally decide it would be so they could get rid of some of the long term unemployed, which means they’d be getting licences for people who are too useless or lazy to get themselves work.
Personally if I was in government I’d call their bluff and tell the haulage industry if they can’t sort out their own staffing problems, the government will remove cabotage regulations and let foreign haulage companies make up the shortfall. Then watch the industry back pedal and decide there isn’t a shortage after all. 
muckles:
crannman:
no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up withOf course there wasn’t, the industry don’t want to spend their own money solving a problem of their own making, instead they want the government to pay for training, so they have an excess of drivers which means they can keep wages down. The government have so far refused, but if they did finally decide it would be so they could get rid of some of the long term unemployed, which means they’d be getting licences for people who are too useless or lazy to get themselves work.
Personally if I was in government I’d call their bluff and tell the haulage industry if they can’t sort out their own staffing problems, the government will remove cabotage regulations and let foreign haulage companies make up the shortfall. Then watch the industry back pedal and decide there isn’t a shortage after all.
Agree 100%
The driver shortage is predominantly in certain sectors of the HGV haulage industry, rather than the industry as a whole.
I just hope some wannabe truck driver doesn’t waste their own money, thinking they going to have a plethora of jobs laid before them, just to be offered the utter crud that is bidvest, brakes, etc.
muckles:
crannman:
no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up withOf course there wasn’t, the industry don’t want to spend their own money solving a problem of their own making, instead they want the government to pay for training, so they have an excess of drivers which means they can keep wages down. The government have so far refused, but if they did finally decide it would be so they could get rid of some of the long term unemployed, which means they’d be getting licences for people who are too useless or lazy to get themselves work.
Bloody hell I hope not. There is nothing wrong with giving a guy down on his luck a helping hand, but long term doleies?
I mean have you watched the Jeremy Kyle show lately? If those sorry arsed souls are an example of the long term unemployed and unemployable (humour me, watch it for 5 mins, we are talking wastes of skin here, oxygen thieves 
) Christ help us and the Haulage industry, hell and hand cart springs to mind.
robroy:
muckles:
crannman:
no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up withOf course there wasn’t, the industry don’t want to spend their own money solving a problem of their own making, instead they want the government to pay for training, so they have an excess of drivers which means they can keep wages down. The government have so far refused, but if they did finally decide it would be so they could get rid of some of the long term unemployed, which means they’d be getting licences for people who are too useless or lazy to get themselves work.
Bloody hell I hope not. There is nothing wrong with giving a guy down on his luck a helping hand, but long term doleies?
I mean have you watched the Jeremy Kyle show lately? If those sorry arsed souls are an example of the long term unemployed and unemployable (humour me, watch it for 5 mins, we are talking wastes of skin here, oxygen thieves
I’d be all for helping those who try and help themselves, we all need a hand know and then, but the government know those people will get off their backsides and find jobs eventually, the ones they want off the benefits are the ones who find any excuse for not being out at work.
LIBERTY_GUY:
The driver shortage is predominantly in certain sectors of the HGV haulage industry, rather than the industry as a whole.
In certain sectors or just certain companies where you’re a number and treated as such.
Not only that but most companies want 2 years experience a agency were I live has been advertising for 2 weeks now urgently needing staff but have to have 2 years experience and have had to drove for 180 days consecutive and for £8 a hour a kid I no has been driving for 4 years and can’t drive a lorry to save his life so some times having experience doesn’t mean anything
Driver unions need to lobby not the Government - but the Insurance companies.
If only they could stop providing insurance for those firms unwilling to train drivers, but quite happy to let anyone with dubious credentials come in, smash up the kit, and it’s “Oh don’t worry - we’ll just claim back the damage on their insurance!”
Without insurance payouts therefore - companies employing any old driver would go under from all the damage that can no longer be laid off in the insurance market.
The company is going to go out of it’s way to harvest the pool of SAFE and LOW LIABILITY drivers - before they’ll feel confident in laying any damage from their pick themselves.
Paying better wages on it’s own won’t work. Take the relationship between agencies Pertemps & Manpower with Royal Mail for example:
The wages will be attracting everyone and anyone, assuming that parity pay is on the table.
How does RM sort the wheat from the chaff? - They rely on the agency to do it. The agency decides what fussy policy they may or may not use to filter down drivers.
Trouble is, if that policy is essentially “Don’t employ HIM 'cos we don’t like him, regardless of a clean licence but let’s try HIM because we don’t know any better as of yet”… Surely over time as the pool of drivers diminishes, a great catastrophe awaits… What would happen if one yard finds itself with a critical mass of Bosnian and Serbian drivers for example? (Que - Big Punch-up) What would happen if over this coming Christmas - a critical number of vehicles get smashed up by “new” drivers that have not been here a year yet, but happen to speak good enough English to blag their way onto Manpower’s books?
How on earth do all these “new arrivals to the UK” get past the Security vetting FFS? There was a time when getting any “Bonded” job was as easy as getting Armed Forces Clearance…
With what happened at Sharm el Sheik recently in mind - it must surely have occured to some that we’re putting the wolves in charge of the sheep here. It’s “face fits” gone mad!
What I’m saying here is that “too much positive discrimination towards minorities” will one day come back and smack such a company in the face.
All a company has to do to swing the pendulum back the other way - is build their RDCs in places where an old traditional British plant has closed down recently…
That would have meant for closing down a steel plant, dockyard, or oil refinery - replace ALL those jobs one for one with transport industry jobs.
Build the equivalent of Trafford Park or Magna Park in places like Bourneville, Grimsby, Redcar, or on the old Coal mine sites…
Where is the wisdom in having a prosperous town with all the depots on it’s outskirts - when the population of that town doesn’t actually want to work in that industry at all, and bans large vehicles from it’s town’s streets?
In my mind, this has become so serious “up north” that Manchester is now sucking the life out of other Northern cities on an even worse level than London has done for the South…
Anyone working in a yard, any size in rural Yorkshire? Wot’s the pay like? Conditions? Commute?
Do you end up putting up with all that “because that’s all there is…” 
Ask your MP “Why”.
bring back the old school route - you work as a yard lad - save some cash - pay for some training and go out and get your own licence.
it really boils my ■■■■ with this expecting society we have nowadays, why should people get stuff for free because they are too bone idle to go and find work save up and train for the role they want?
if not offer student loan type funding so they pay back when they work but make them pay x amount of it up front (this will get rid of the whole I don’t want to ever work brigade).
muckles:
crannman:
no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up withOf course there wasn’t, the industry don’t want to spend their own money solving a problem of their own making, instead they want the government to pay for training, so they have an excess of drivers which means they can keep wages down. The government have so far refused, but if they did finally decide it would be so they could get rid of some of the long term unemployed, which means they’d be getting licences for people who are too useless or lazy to get themselves work.
Personally if I was in government I’d call their bluff and tell the haulage industry if they can’t sort out their own staffing problems, the government will remove cabotage regulations and let foreign haulage companies make up the shortfall. Then watch the industry back pedal and decide there isn’t a shortage after all.
Evil8Beezle:
Agree 100%
+2
Winseer:
All a company has to do to swing the pendulum back the other way - is build their RDCs in places where an old traditional British plant has closed down recently…
That would have meant for closing down a steel plant, dockyard, or oil refinery - replace ALL those jobs one for one with transport industry jobs.
Build the equivalent of Trafford Park or Magna Park in places like Bourneville, Grimsby, Redcar, or on the old Coal mine sites…
]".
You can leave Grimsby out of that list, they nicked our(Cromer) Crab factory. Though it was never going to end in any other way, once Youngs brought them(cromer crab co). I did point this out to the petitioners including local MP and councillors, in the middle off Cromer, they were campaigning to save the factory, I listed a number of other food production facilities in Norfolk, that Youngs had stripped and shut down over the years, then pointed out that their site in Grimsby has ample room for expansion, and a willing supply of East Europeans, happy to rent cheap houses. Unlike Cromer, where the factory had no room for expansion, and even more opposition if it were to even think the idea, plus the cost of housing is not as cheap as Grimsby
Though I do agree with your argument in principle
If there is such a shortage, then you would think that economics of supply and demand, would, firstly drive up pay and conditions, and that not happening, at least not to the extent that a real crisis of supply would have it. Secondly, have hauliers/ logistics concerns training new drivers, then contracting them to say 5 years, to wipe out the cost of training.
This is the transport sector trying to get something for nothing, well hears the news, the Government wont help you out, you have to help yourself, you have the money, and the contracts that need fulfilling, start paying, get training and stop bleating. Anybody would think they were Bloody Farmers with this much winging
That is the point I am making with this - the FTA don’t get it because they don’t ask drivers, they just ask the employer. We need to stand up and be counted
The FTA don’t represent Drivers, so they aren’t going to ask. Their pay masters are the big Logistics concerns, and they want to speak social responsibility, then act irresponsibly.
Any one notice the headline in Logistics Manager? Operating profit up 50% at Fowler Welch - any drivers on here working for them - love to know what their slice of the action is…Bonus, pay rise maybe?
muckles:
crannman:
no mention of poor wages long hours crap parking areas and the rest of the rubbish we have to put up withOf course there wasn’t, the industry don’t want to spend their own money solving a problem of their own making, instead they want the government to pay for training, so they have an excess of drivers which means they can keep wages down. The government have so far refused, but if they did finally decide it would be so they could get rid of some of the long term unemployed, which means they’d be getting licences for people who are too useless or lazy to get themselves work.
Personally if I was in government I’d call their bluff and tell the haulage industry if they can’t sort out their own staffing problems, the government will remove cabotage regulations and let foreign haulage companies make up the shortfall. Then watch the industry back pedal and decide there isn’t a shortage after all.
spot on fella
Just been given the details of my new rates back-dated to 1 June
For the last 5yrs I’ve been on what I consider a reasonable flat rate with an annual rise each year
New rates
Mon-Fri; rise of @9%
Sat; rise of @17%
Sun; rise of @42% not that us agency scum ever get the Sunday shifts
So maybe there is a bit of a shortage 
chicane:
Just been given the details of my new rates back-dated to 1 JuneFor the last 5yrs I’ve been on what I consider a reasonable flat rate with an annual rise each year
New rates
Mon-Fri; rise of @9%
Sat; rise of @17%
Sun; rise of @42% not that us agency scum ever get the Sunday shiftsSo maybe there is a bit of a shortage
Any link to retention? Have you been losing drivers recently?
I doubt the Govt. will intervene with any funding as if they did help out it would set a precedent for other industries to “hold out their hands”.
What’s stopping haulage firms doing the same as large service bus operators have done for many years? i.e. Taking on a car driver & putting them on a training wage whilst they go through LGV (in this case) driver training and then putting their money up once they start being productive & doing deliveries. In these days of training/testing being allowed in auto. gearboxed vehicles the training should be reasonably painless for the right candidate(s).
Basically haulage firms need to start ‘growing their own’ & doing in-house upgrading to LGV licences - some already do with initiatives such as Warehouse to Wheels and similar catchy-titled schemes. It can’t be difficult, can it■■?
Daz1970:
What’s stopping haulage firms doing the same as large service bus operators have done for many years? It can’t be difficult, can it■■?
Because they want their cake & eat it, I mean who doesn’t!?
Evil8Beezle:
chicane:
Just been given the details of my new rates back-dated to 1 JuneFor the last 5yrs I’ve been on what I consider a reasonable flat rate with an annual rise each year
New rates
Mon-Fri; rise of @9%
Sat; rise of @17%
Sun; rise of @42% not that us agency scum ever get the Sunday shiftsSo maybe there is a bit of a shortage
Any link to retention? Have you been losing drivers recently?
Don’t think so. I can only think of one driver who’s left the local hub this year, one retiring in a couple of weeks, they’ve just taken on 3 at the local hub and everyone I’ve spoken to seems quite settled. They’ve bought over another company recently (operations will be merged in the next 18 months) and gained some new contracts there’s also been a huge increase in the amount of stuff going through the warehouse over the last few months.
Surely “Retention” is a different issue to “Jobs being available in the first instance”…
What I’m getting at here is that one takes a job presumably knowing the basic T&Cs and pay etc.
I would imagine if that job is then nothing like what you signed up for - you might get a bit miffed, and move on.
I don’t like Early Starts for example. If I took a job that was described as “Nights” and then got continuously withdrawn from my regular night shift - to cover a breakfast start job - I’d probably become pretty disillusioned pretty quickly myself.
Retention therefore in my book - is about TMs not upsetting the applecart and listening to the driver’s preferences rather than play the “I’m God and you’re not” card. 