This is exactly the reason I voted for Brexit I’ve been driving HGV’S for 26 years and the wages along with T&C have got worse, Zero hours contracts and Umbrella wasn’t even a thing when I started, I worked at Tescos when they used to ship in EE by the coach load they kept wages down and new that if you wanted to leave they had a cheaper replacement lined up.
They even factored in monthly damages and it still worked out cheaper.
Finally the rates are heading to where they should be, also dare I say it but this is our time to get a decent job with a decent pension, wages and working life before the government bows down to pressure from corporation’s and opens up the cheap labour market again.
One of the many reasons why i’ll never darken their doorstep long as i live, not as they were alone but they were a main player, despite fantastic profits which are never enough.
Agree this is the time to negotiate better terms at your present or find a stable job, playing the agencies off against one another might be fine in the short term, but there’s a lot of media hysteria about the driver shortage (supposedly leading to food shortages, which will come anyway but for other reasons) and there’s very good chance the govt of the day will please their mates by opening things up for foreign lorry drivers and others…maybe train for free a percentage of the hordes of illegals too for good measure?, i suspect the time to make hay is limited before the wage wave dips back again.
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This may interest you
DCPCFML:
I can say with a good degree of confidence that Juddian won’t be interested in Soros’ funded “fact-checkers” for biased lefties.
Founded by?
Michael Samuel, a conservative party donor, and Will Moy.
All UK parties have representatives in it’s board.
A UK registered charity, hence prohibited from political activity. Anyone can complain to the Charity Commission if they think they are in breach of the rules.
Soros is one of many who have given money to support it. No secret sponsors here.
As ever it’s sources are clear and can be checked on by anyone.
.
But please, all feel free to ignore anything you find upsetting.
Franglais:
Our “native” workers are no longer going to be in competition with EEs coming here to work in UK factories, but will be in direct competition with Asian, Chinese, etc workers.
And they can drive trucks on UK roads from Asia?
I’m impressed.
Thought Asians an Chinese were usually in back off containers
OK bit poor taste.
ETS:
A shortage of anything means a price increase, in this case the price of labor which of course means higher prices of products and services so I don’t see the cause for celebration?
Because if inflation was to rise to 5% pa but HGV driver wage inflation was running at 30%+ pa then we as HGV drivers would be better off.
Pie in the sky Harry. Wages having been lagging behind real inflation for a long time. As I keep saying, look at your food bills (remembering to note shrinkflation), rent bill (for those not lucky enough to buy before they were priced out of the market), CT bill, utility bills, vehicle purchase and running costs. Average hourly rates for perm should be well into £20/hr now to have the same purchasing power as we had 20 years ago. Note how TPTB adjust how they calculate CPI every few years . It’s all a massive con as they try to keep everyone in the dark and assure you it’s only 1-2%. Yeah righto.
Yes, I agree. However pay increases are still better than no pay increases. Unless some Government intervention occurs I can only see pay rising further.
The Government have already told the haulage association to up their pay rates.
Because if inflation was to rise to 5% pa but HGV driver wage inflation was running at 30%+ pa then we as HGV drivers would be better off.
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Pie in the sky Harry. Wages having been lagging behind real inflation for a long time. As I keep saying, look at your food bills (remembering to note shrinkflation), rent bill (for those not lucky enough to buy before they were priced out of the market), CT bill, utility bills, vehicle purchase and running costs. Average hourly rates for perm should be well into £20/hr now to have the same purchasing power as we had 20 years ago. Note how TPTB adjust how they calculate CPI every few years . It’s all a massive con as they try to keep everyone in the dark and assure you it’s only 1-2%. Yeah righto.
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Yes, I agree. However pay increases are still better than no pay increases. Unless some Government intervention occurs I can only see pay rising further.
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The Government have already told the haulage association to up their pay rates.
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The ONLY time anyone is actually better off among the workforce - is when their wages inflation is significantly higher than the RPI/CPI official figure.
then there’s no hope for us home-grown Brits, other than a prosperous retirement, whilst Final Salary Pension Payouts last.
There’s the rub isn’t it. Back when the welfare state was formed the decision was made to pay pensions from those currently working. Not an issue then as most working folk would be lucky to see 70.
Of course the baby-boomers are now retiring and living 15 years or so longer but chose to have less children to support their pensions.
In short the country needs taxpayers!
then there’s no hope for us home-grown Brits, other than a prosperous retirement, whilst Final Salary Pension Payouts last.
There’s the rub isn’t it. Back when the welfare state was formed the decision was made to pay pensions from those currently working. Not an issue then as most working folk would be lucky to see 70.
Of course the baby-boomers are now retiring and living 15 years or so longer but chose to have less children to support their pensions.
In short the country needs taxpayers!
Sent from my R19 using Tapatalk
My first wife’s uncle was a senior civil servant at the Ministry of Pensions. He said he had personally told Harold Wilson (the PM at the time) that the system of paying pensions from current N.I. contributions was a Ponzi scheme and would eventually fail. As you would expect, nothing was done to reform things and here we are with the problems.
Buckstones:
My first wife’s uncle was a senior civil servant at the Ministry of Pensions. He said he had personally told Harold Wilson (the PM at the time) that the system of paying pensions from current N.I. contributions was a Ponzi scheme and would eventually fail. As you would expect, nothing was done to reform things and here we are with the problems.
Perhaps your first wife’s uncle wasn’t a very bright guy then?
The public system of paying pensions is not a Ponzi scheme. It’s simply a direct way of charging the economy via general taxation to support the retired. The books add up at the end of the day.
Private sector pensions work in an essentially similar way - they charge employers or borrowers to support the retired. Essentially the difference is that with private schemes, there is a specific link between a pension scheme and an employer or a pension provider who run that pension, whereas with public schemes, the state simply taxes all taxpayers to pay for all pensioners at once, without the paperwork of ten thousand different schemes.
A Ponzi scheme charges new investors to pay for the investment returns of existing investors, typically without any actual investment occurring to provide the returns, or perhaps with lackluster investment that fails to meet the promised rate of return. The books do not add up at the end of the day.
I don’t think that NIcs based pensions were originally intended as a Ponzi Scheme, but the life expectancy age rising above expectations - has buggered up the entire model by way more of a “Lesson of unintended consequences.”
Where successive governments HAVE been negligent over the past 40 years in particular - is “not doing anything above the rising life expectancy age”, although a conspiracy theorist like myself might forward the notion that “Maybe this whole Covid thing - is a cull of oldsters, to get that pension liability down…”
It is plain now that NIcs can only raise so much, and the rising number of oldsters that draw the state pension, even after raising the age claim to what? 67 now, 70 in the future? - isn’t going to cancel the effect that "too many people on benefits that don’t pay NIcs AT ALL - has well and truly buggered it all up at BOTH ends.
The Social Solution - must surely be to actually enforce taxation, rather than leave it as it is, where higher earners on Self-Assessment- offset taxes that hapless lower earners on PAYE don’t get to offset.
The level playing field - is to have full PAYE taxation at current thresholds for all in my view,
so people become more frugal with their own money as a by-product too, as it isn’t so easy to choose the latest “top of the range” replacements for things one might want to buy with one’s hard-earned IF you can no longer claim it back for tax!
If present and future governments fail to act (Phillip Hammond - did the exact opposite, and opened the floodgates for “White Van Man” to claim for anything and everything - didn’t he)
…PAYE workers, that include myself- will simply drop out of taxation outright, by choosing to go part-time at underpaid hourly rates unless and until those rates climb back to a more reasonable level, making it viable once again to put in the hours, without it falling down the poverty trap pit where earning between £20k and £30k leaves you out of pocket compared to people earning below as well as above that.
“Pension Contributions @ 6%” - needs to be included as if it were taxation as well, don’t forget…
Winseer:
I don’t think that NIcs based pensions were originally intended as a Ponzi Scheme, but the life expectancy age rising above expectations - has buggered up the entire model by way more of a “Lesson of unintended consequences.”
I don’t see your argument myself. There is no significant increase in life expectancy due, and the economy is already able to afford the current level.
The real issue is that the rich are currently paying the lowest post-war tax, so unsurprisingly things become unaffordable if you refuse to charge the economy for those things.
Seems to me that we are actually returning to the good old days, when jobs were plentyful and wages were good. This was all before we joined the common wealth and Great Britain was actually Great. Enoch Powell knew the score well before immigration took hold. So instead of the negative outlook of this cannot last and it will be short lived, how about thinking of Great Britain actually standing on its own two feet and growing back our economy free of the EU and Unions once again demanding our rights as workers to a decent wage. The foreigners are not comming back and the Government stance is for employers to make their jobs more attractive to UK workers if they don’t want shortages. Only reason for any worker shortage is the fact that nobody is interested in working for a pittance and competing with a migrant who themselves have realised that they have been exploited for cheap labour. I believe the tide is turning and we are going through the predicted big reset. The day of the fat cat is over,
Yorkshire Tramper:
. The day of the fat cat is over,
Bwah hah hah hah. Good joke mate.
The fat cat will soon pounce back. Enjoy it whilst it lasts as there will be some kind scheme to put us working class plebs back in our place.
Winseer:
I don’t think that NIcs based pensions were originally intended as a Ponzi Scheme, but the life expectancy age rising above expectations - has buggered up the entire model by way more of a “Lesson of unintended consequences.”
I don’t see your argument myself. There is no significant increase in life expectancy due, and the economy is already able to afford the current level.
The real issue is that the rich are currently paying the lowest post-war tax, so unsurprisingly things become unaffordable if you refuse to charge the economy for those things.
That’s just not true though - is it?
Threre would be no talk of ending the Triple Lock if what you say were accurate here, and no implemtation of the retirement age raised from 65 neither…
I agree with you though that the Rich - pay far too little tax, - but my argument is that this is “Thanks to tax offsets” rather than the end of such things as say, Supertax which just sent even more rich people abroad, only to take their money with them…
Noremac:
Whereas the last few years there has been a buyer’s market, where companies have essentially gotten used to relying on agency staff and being able to get staff seasonally at low wage, this may no longer be possible.
It really depends what side of the fence you are on if you think this is positive or negative. Come Christmas at places like Amazon, the warehouses may no longer be able to put an advert out and double the workforce in a matter of weeks. The Amazon customers might be miffed, but Amazon having to consider its position on using agency staff might benefit workers, who may be offered a contract rather than being let go in January.
As regards truck drivers, many companies also rely heavily on agency staff. In a similar fashion, these companies may need to consider whether they can cope with agency staff who are now in a seller’s market, where they can move about and get remunerated better than before. The end result may be more full-time contracts and of course better pay. Most of the unionised pay agreements have been based on what the job entails rather than scarcity of drivers, so it will be interesting to see how pay changes.
Interesting The Royal Mail have been advertising for Class 1 drivers
It’s a hard one to call, with what’s going on with covid a lot of people would have went back to their respective countries,
As for Brexit it won’t make a slight bit of difference when things get back to normal, it will be oversupply of cheap labour as usual, you can be sure as hell that has already been worked out way even before covid
A supply of labour is the backbone of any country and a increase in wages is never going to sort that also it’s big corporate business that dictate what’s needed hence the government supply visas
A pool of cheap labour sitting right on the doorstep it’s a no brainer
They will be back
whisperingsmith: > Yorkshire Tramper: > This was all before we joined the common wealth and Great Britain was actually Great
I still can’t get over the fact that some people still think that the ‘Great’ in Great Britain means something special.
It means BIG, that is all, it is from the French ‘Grande Bretagne’ or Big Britain
Across the water from Cornwall is ‘Bretagne’ or small Britain, (Brittany as we call it nowadays).
Aye, living in the past.
Some people are saying "Weve left the EU, get used to it". Often the same people who havent yet gotten used to the death of Queen Victoria and the loss of Empire.
whisperingsmith: > Yorkshire Tramper: > This was all before we joined the common wealth and Great Britain was actually Great
I still can’t get over the fact that some people still think that the ‘Great’ in Great Britain means something special.
It means BIG, that is all, it is from the French ‘Grande Bretagne’ or Big Britain
Across the water from Cornwall is ‘Bretagne’ or small Britain, (Brittany as we call it nowadays).
Aye, living in the past.
Some people are saying "Weve left the EU, get used to it". Often the same people who havent yet gotten used to the death of Queen Victoria and the loss of Empire.
Living in the past is thinking that we are still members of the EU. Some people are still proud of our country, we can still maintain a good relationship with our EU friends whilst holding on to our sovereignty, the Great in Great Britain does not mean we are Great in the sense of we are actually Great in comparison to other country’s. We now have an opportunity to make our own way free of the constraints of the EU. Good or bad we will see.
. It’s all a massive con as they try to keep everyone in the dark and assure you it’s only 1-2%. Yeah righto.
