The eu referendum- how do you intend to vote?

del trotter:
How does it prove that being in the EU harms UK jobs? Globalisation is a fact of life, what made it more attractive for Kraft, Cadbury being just a brand in a huge US food company,a higher returns for their shareholders as a result of lower costs, such is the nature of business.
Globalisation works the other way as well, with companies coming to the UK, Siemens for example in Hull.

Basic maths says that expanding by locating the extra capacity or closure and relocation outside the country instead of here means we see no benefit in jobs.

On that note are you really trying to suggest that EU membership didn’t 1 turn a trade surplus into a trade deficit and 2 result in a ‘net’ loss of jobs and industry to our European competitors and 3 result in a net addition to the domestic labour supply in the form of free movement.As for globalisation see above.The common link being the general rule of re location or free movement to take advantage of lower wage regimes or expectations.

Of which Labour has shown itself as being supportive of ‘if’ it can be shown to be of ( perceived ) advantage to the bigger Socialist agenda.In this case obviously being the idea of Federation,in the form of the EU,replacing the Nation State.Which no surprise you seem to be trying to avoid the question of your own motivation in that regard.

Harry Monk:
County-wide poll of 1,001 Kent residents carried out for KentOnline shows 57%-43% in favour of Brexit.

kentonline.co.uk/kent/news/k … xit-97358/

That might probably reflect the general UKIP friendly MEP vote here in the South East Harry ?.IE we didn’t send loads of UKIP MEP’s to Brussels because we like the EU. :bulb:

OVLOV JAY:

del trotter:

OVLOV JAY:
The twinnings factory in Poland was built by the polish government, to create jobs, using eu money.

No it wasn’t the EU cancelled the grant.

foodmanufacture.co.uk/Busine … tory-grant

Well I’m glad that loop hole got closed. I hadn’t bothered searching it, I just posted what I was told when it was announced, incidentally the last time I loaded an export load out of Andover a few years back

So you make your claim on false information, without even searching it, claiming what you was told is right, nice :grimacing: :grimacing:

Carryfast:
3 result in a net addition to the domestic labour supply in the form of free movement.

You need to be mentally challenged not to realise this. Plenty don’t though.

I deliver to plenty of places where in the warehouse you struggle to hear an English voice. A few times I’ve had to ask for someone English to speak to and 5 mins later an English supervisor will appear. Now these foreigners in these jobs are low/non skilled workers in crappy jobs. We have hundreds of thousands of British people who are suited to these jobs sitting on benefits which is paid for by, oh yeah, the tax payer.

There is no doubt that many of the benefit Brits choose benefits coz they’re too lazy to work in a warehouse or think it’s beneath them. Importing cheap labour isn’t the answer. Forcing Brits into these jobs is the answer.

I keep hearing about how migrants contribute more in tax than what they take out but you can bet your left bollock they don’t take into account wider issues such as the thousands of unemployed Brits that could be made to do these jobs that are funded by the tax payer to sit at home, the extra burden put on public services, housing shortages, school place shortages and god knows what else.

Another classic, oh the NHS would collapse without foreign nurses. Well I doubt you’ve done much good to the health services of the nations you poached these nurses from. So much for caring about Africa.

Maybe we wouldn’t need foreign labour if nursing in the UK was an attractive job. Ditto truck driving. ■■■■■■ conditions backed up by cheap imported labour will always win though. There ARE people benefitting from cheap imported labour but its certainly not the average British tax payer.

If voting changed anything, they’d make it illegal.

Dolph:

OVLOV JAY:

del trotter:

OVLOV JAY:
The twinnings factory in Poland was built by the polish government, to create jobs, using eu money.

No it wasn’t the EU cancelled the grant.

foodmanufacture.co.uk/Busine … tory-grant

Well I’m glad that loop hole got closed. I hadn’t bothered searching it, I just posted what I was told when it was announced, incidentally the last time I loaded an export load out of Andover a few years back

So you make your claim on false information, without even searching it, claiming what you was told is right, nice :grimacing: :grimacing:

Yes that’s right, I was told it by a guy on notice at Andover. And the only thing that was incorrect is they got refused. They still moved their factory to save wages because ours are so called too high, and they still applied to get the money in the first place

Terry T:
There is no doubt that many of the benefit Brits choose benefits coz they’re too lazy to work in a warehouse or think it’s beneath them. Importing cheap labour isn’t the answer. Forcing Brits into these jobs is the answer.

Although I agree with most of what you say, I disagree with this. Thirty years ago vegetable packhouses in Lincolnshire (for example) had no trouble staffing their factories with locally born and bred people, I doubt anything has happened in the interim to make the local population idle and feckless. Perhaps it’s just that wages have been relentlessly driven downwards, and housing costs driven upwards ever since then, and Lincolnshire folk just can’t afford to pay western European rents on eastern European wages.

Dolph:
If voting changed anything, they’d make it illegal.

Blimey, you’ve only been over here a month pal, and you already know how our MP’s think! :open_mouth:
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

OVLOV JAY:

Yes that’s right, I was told it by a guy on notice at Andover. And the only thing that was incorrect is they got refused. They still moved their factory to save wages because ours are so called too high, and they still applied to get the money in the first place
[/quote]
So if they have moved the company in China instead of Poland, what were you going to say? :unamused:
Companies dont care about people, they care for profit…
I’ll give you simple example, onе of Bulgaria biggest butter/mayo producer moved to Romania because its better, cheaper etc. for them, they don’t care if we are in or out of EU, because they have the whole EU market.
Same with companies in UK, why heaving 65 mil customers when you cant have 500 mil.

Dolph:

OVLOV JAY:

del trotter:

OVLOV JAY:
The twinnings factory in Poland was built by the polish government, to create jobs, using eu money.

No it wasn’t the EU cancelled the grant.

foodmanufacture.co.uk/Busine … tory-grant

Well I’m glad that loop hole got closed. I hadn’t bothered searching it, I just posted what I was told when it was announced, incidentally the last time I loaded an export load out of Andover a few years back

So you make your claim on false information, without even searching it, claiming what you was told is right, nice :grimacing: :grimacing:

Let’s get this right the UK employees still lose their jobs to cheaper Polish competition.But applaud the fact that the EU didn’t after all pay any grant out of our net contributions to sweeten the deal even further.

Meanwhile no they might not have received ‘that’ supposed grant.But they obviously didn’t need it anyway because the EU will just call it part of ‘this’ grant instead.Which obviously helps to reduce the tax burden among other costs on Polish industry. :unamused:

roedl.com/pl/en/services/sta … 42020.html

So great scam.We move the jobs from UK to Poland,using EU cash paid for by us,to help Polish competitiveness but we’ll just pretend we didn’t then the UK workforce and Europhile Green MEP’s will claim it as a Brit victory. :unamused: :laughing: :laughing:

Dolph:

OVLOV JAY:

Yes that’s right, I was told it by a guy on notice at Andover. And the only thing that was incorrect is they got refused.

Obviously depends on the definition of ‘incorrect’ ‘grant’ and ‘refused’. :bulb: :unamused: :wink:

Harry Monk:

Terry T:
There is no doubt that many of the benefit Brits choose benefits coz they’re too lazy to work in a warehouse or think it’s beneath them. Importing cheap labour isn’t the answer. Forcing Brits into these jobs is the answer.

Although I agree with most of what you say, I disagree with this. Thirty years ago vegetable packhouses in Lincolnshire (for example) had no trouble staffing their factories with locally born and bred people, I doubt anything has happened in the interim to make the local population idle and feckless. Perhaps it’s just that wages have been relentlessly driven downwards, and housing costs driven upwards ever since then, and Lincolnshire folk just can’t afford to pay western European rents on eastern European wages.

I don’t watch much TV but isn’t there like, whole TV shows now dedicated to people who think working is beneath them. Benefits street or whatever.

I know people personally who choose a life of benefits and you know what, they do ok out of it. Not rich, but too well off for what they contribute to society. Which is absolutely nothing.

It’s pretty simple really. If companies had a plethora of cheap British people to employ then surely they would. The fact is the foreign worker will work for less and allow Mr White Middle Class Tory voter to treat them like crap. Of course they’re going to employ them. We don’t really need these people, but for the select few they provide a marvellous service.

You are of course correct, wages have been relentlessly driven down. But foreign labour plays a big part in that. They weren’t brought over here for their own sake that’s for sure. The people behind all this are far too selfish to care about others.

Dolph:

OVLOV JAY:

Yes that’s right, I was told it by a guy on notice at Andover. And the only thing that was incorrect is they got refused. They still moved their factory to save wages because ours are so called too high, and they still applied to get the money in the first place

So if they have moved the company in China instead of Poland, what were you going to say? :unamused:
Companies dont care about people, they care for profit…
I’ll give you simple example, onе of Bulgaria biggest butter/mayo producer moved to Romania because its better, cheaper etc. for them, they don’t care if we are in or out of EU, because they have the whole EU market.
Same with companies in UK, why heaving 65 mil customers when you cant have 500 mil.
[/quote]
I’d have still been annoyed as British workers would be losing jobs. I find it wrong that uk companies can export their jobs to countries exploiting cheap labour, then tell us we rely on such practices

Dolph:
Companies dont care about people, they care for profit…
I’ll give you simple example, onе of Bulgaria biggest butter/mayo producer moved to Romania because its better, cheaper etc. for them, they don’t care if we are in or out of EU, because they have the whole EU market.
Same with companies in UK, why heaving 65 mil customers when you cant have 500 mil.

You’ve defeated your own argument.IE everything is based on race to the bottom economics.In which case how does Corbyn’s support of EU membership fix that and why no calls in East Euro,or from him,for an EU wide minimum wage and social cost regime and level playing field in which no European country is considered a special case.Which of course could just as easily,if not more easily,be done within a Confederal sovereign Nation State European regime than the EU Federated one.

Right…I’m riding ■■■■■■■■ on this thread …so as to speak :wink:

What I mean is, I have not read the last 12 pages, mostly because I can’t be arsed, (and another reason I would like to bet a weeks wages 60% of the posts originate from Carryfast,) lifes to ■■■■ short to even consider it :smiley:

I’m voting out,.
I have no problem with trade, like the original ‘Common Market’ concept, but I have no desire to be a member of a European Superstate, or the USE…, ruled by non elected Belgians, Germans or whatever.

I do not believe we are going to suffer financial Armageddon, or Biblical curses of famine and pestilence…( as we are being led to believe by Cameron and his ilk if we leave :unamused: )
It reminds me of the scaremongering of the famous Millenium bug, a lighter note but same principle.

Are these ‘‘financial experts’’ the same financial experts who were advocating about 10 years ago to adopt the Euro as our currency, yeh that would have been just brilliant eh? :unamused:
At least we would have had Greece and Eire in our camp as allies in that scenario. :laughing:
So I will not be gullible enough to take notice of anything those guys say either.

In fact imo, if people like them, …Cameron, what’s his face the Chancellor, and these ‘experts’ are telling me we should stay in, that is the BEST reason so far that I can think of for me voting against, and the UK leaving. :bulb:

The most ironic thing I have seen on the tv last week, was that knob head Euro MP son of Kinnock :unamused: , …HIM telling us we should stay in :open_mouth: … is it anything to do with the fact that his virtual entire family, mother father wife etc, have had their snouts in the trough of the European gravy train since Kinnock was rejected by the UK electorate when he stood for PM. I bet they sure as hell wish we would stay in, as them many like them, will be ■■■■■■■■ themselves in fear of losing their inflted livliehoods.

The way I see it, simplistic as it may be, is that we put millions in, and get thousands back out.
Then there is another potential 12 page thread about the Immigration problem, the Muslim threat, and the ‘refugee’ fiasco, all of which that are tied in together imo…nothing to do with any form of racism either before someone plays that card
So yeh, it’s a resounding NO from me.

Carryfast:
M&S were importing from the Far East long before the UK joined the common market, the global textile market having moved over there.

As for M+S importing from cheap labour countries before we joined the EEC that’s total bs.I should know bearing in mind my mother worked there as a warehouse stock employee for more than 30 years long before and after we joined the EEC and she’s confirmed that you’re talking bollox.

During the 90’s while driving for Eagle Freight of Gt Blakenham I was fetching back to the UK women’s garments made in either Minsk, Vilnius or Moscow that were destined for M&S, and also going to C&A. I used to run out there with the all the raw materials needed even down to the price tags and hangers and the only difference when it came back as the finished article was the price ie. £9.99 for C&A but £39.99 for M&S. all made to the same quality.

edit … CF never said the first line but the next two are his and the rest are mine :slight_smile:

robroy:
Right…I’m riding ■■■■■■■■ on this thread …so as to speak :wink:

What I mean is, I have not read the last 12 pages, mostly because I can’t be arsed, (and another reason I would like to bet a weeks wages 60% of the posts originate from Carryfast,) lifes to [zb] short to even consider it :smiley:

I’m voting out,.
I have no problem with trade, like the original ‘Common Market’ concept, but I have no desire to be a member of a European Superstate, or the USE…, ruled by non elected Belgians, Germans or whatever.

I do not believe we are going to suffer financial Armageddon, or Biblical curses of famine and pestilence…( as we are being led to believe by Cameron and his ilk if we leave :unamused: )
It reminds me of the scaremongering of the famous Millenium bug, a lighter note but same principle.

Are these ‘‘financial experts’’ the same financial experts who were advocating about 10 years ago to adopt the Euro as our currency, yeh that would have been just brilliant eh? :unamused:
At least we would have had Greece and Eire in our camp as allies in that scenario. :laughing:
So I will not be gullible enough to take notice of anything those guys say either.

In fact imo, if people like them, …Cameron, what’s his face the Chancellor, and these ‘experts’ are telling me we should stay in, that is the BEST reason so far that I can think of for me voting against, and the UK leaving. :bulb:

The most ironic thing I have seen on the tv last week, was that knob head Euro MP son of Kinnock :unamused: , …HIM telling us we should stay in :open_mouth: … is it anything to do with the fact that his virtual entire family, mother father wife etc, have had their snouts in the trough of the European gravy train since Kinnock was rejected by the UK electorate when he stood for PM. I bet they sure as hell wish we would stay in, as them many like them, will be ■■■■■■■■ themselves in fear of losing their inflted livliehoods.

The way I see it, simplistic as it may be, is that we put millions in, and get thousands back out.
Then there is another potential 12 page thread about the Immigration problem, the Muslim threat, and the ‘refugee’ fiasco, all of which that are tied in together imo…nothing to do with any form of racism either before someone plays that card
So yeh, it’s a resounding NO from me.

Well said cracking post.

And for your information Rob you are correct regarding Carryfast at the last count it was 58 posts for this thread, i would lose the will to live counting again. :unamused:

raymundo:

Carryfast:
M&S were importing from the Far East long before the UK joined the common market, the global textile market having moved over there.

As for M+S importing from cheap labour countries before we joined the EEC that’s total bs.I should know bearing in mind my mother worked there as a warehouse stock employee for more than 30 years long before and after we joined the EEC and she’s confirmed that you’re talking bollox.

During the 90’s while driving for Eagle Freight of Gt Blakenham I was fetching back to the UK women’s garments made in either Minsk, Vilnius or Moscow that were destined for M&S, and also going to C&A. I used to run out there with the all the raw materials needed even down to the price tags and hangers and the only difference when it came back as the finished article was the price ie. £9.99 for C&A but £39.99 for M&S. all made to the same quality.

edit … CF never said the first line but the next two are his and the rest are mine :slight_smile:

We were actually obviously referring to M+S buying policy ‘before’ 1973. :unamused: On that note did you read the link describing Corah’s operations.

OVLOV JAY:
Next Thursday is our Berlin Wall moment

Exactly, and it’s probably the last chance we will ever get. From what I’ve read, the rest of Europe is showing enormous interest in our little country and its referendum. We resisted German ■■■■■■■■■■ in 1940 and we are resisting it now. If the vote goes for leaving the eu then I predict that several other countries will follow suit in 2017, the first one being the Netherlands.

robroy:
(and another reason I would like to bet a weeks wages 60% of the posts originate from Carryfast,)

Only 60% is being generous! :laughing: