Harry Monk:
Thanks for that although if a driver was cleaning a vehicle at a truck show then presumably he wouldn’t be “at the disposal of his employer” unless he was instructed to be there and doing it.
Perhaps not at a truck show but I think you would struggle to argue that cleaning the truck in the yard on a weekend is anything other than “other work” given that it is specifically mentioned in the rules.
Paul
I do think that would be a very grey area to get a conviction for doing it, very similar to a driver self funding a DCPC and doing it on a rest day.
Especially if his employer hasn’t instructed him to do it and he is not getting paid to do it, same as a driver who has clocked off for the day in the services and then starts polishing his truck, it’s his free time, he can do what he wants in it.
ah this reminds me of something i missed in that magnet use thread, you can use your vehicle to go to a show - and you must have a tacho in, you then need to write on said tacho or print out why you were using it, ie going to/from a show, what i think has been missed here is that you will be able to prove this with the TICKETS you will presumably have bought for the show in question, i would say keep the tickets with your 28 days worth of proof of driving and go about your duties as normal. again, if you doubt what i am saying, ring vosa, not the help line because they are next to useless and will quote from a book, ring a test centre ie grimsby and ask to speak to a traffic examiner/vosa man/ whatever your name is for them… they will confirm what i am saying as i’ve had it from a senior traffic examiner. hope this helps.
Jenson Button:
A couple of our lads want to do some truck shows this year - I think that is a great idea - but what do they need to tacho wise when they are driving the unit to and from the show?
I would want paying for it if taking a companies truck to a show.
I’m going to the Lydden Hill Truck Festival in June but mainly because the £35 entry fee is well worth paying to watch two days of motor racing and have a weekend camping with the kids.
Jenson Button:
A couple of our lads want to do some truck shows this year - I think that is a great idea - but what do they need to tacho wise when they are driving the unit to and from the show?
I would want paying for it if taking a companies truck to a show.
But the drivers have asked US if they can borrow the trucks on these weekends ■■
Karl86:
I’m not an owner driver but like to look after my motor if I don’t get chance to clean it during the week ill go up on a sat if I’m not working or a Sunday and clean it along with my car for a few hours, I’m not asked to do it and my boss doesn’t even know I’m doing it not that he minds but I don’t feel the need to ring him Sunday morning with my intentions so am I required to put the tacho in I never have and as far as I’m concerned I’m disposing off my time and rest how I wish too I raised this on my cpc course and the instructor couldn’t give me a definitive answer and yourselfs seem to know a bit more then maybe he did. Sorry to hijack the thread many thanks.
Personally, I’d agree with you that you are freely disposing of your time as you see fit. You haven’t been instructed by your employer to do it and you aren’t being paid to do it so it seems to be no more work-related than building an Airfix model of your truck on your day off.
There are some VOSAs on here, perhaps they might have some input on this one?
Thanks Harry that was my argument with my cpc instructor that I am still disposing off my time how I choose But he wouldn’t have none off it.
Karl86:
Thanks Harry that was my argument with my cpc instructor that I am still disposing off my time how I choose But he wouldn’t have none off it.
In 27 years, I have never heard of anybody being prosecuted for voluntarily washing his truck at the weekend so I think it’s fairly safe for you to carry on.
Karl86:
Thanks Harry that was my argument with my cpc instructor that I am still disposing off my time how I choose But he wouldn’t have none off it.
In 27 years, I have never heard of anybody being prosecuted for voluntarily washing his truck at the weekend so I think it’s fairly safe for you to carry on.
i agree, totally safe - just an issue of common sense, if anyone tried to prosecute me for making my truck look better then i’d love to see them try and take me to court. if your doing it off your own back during a break of any kind then so be it, i find pottering about doing little jobs quite relaxing and afterwards when you know you’ve cleaned or fixed a small issue your mindset has to be a lot better doesnt it■■?
Jenson Button:
A couple of our lads want to do some truck shows this year - I think that is a great idea - but what do they need to tacho wise when they are driving the unit to and from the show?
EU regulations are for the carriage of goods, which presumably won’t be happening in this case, especially as they’ll just be using the units.
Check the tachograph situation with VOSA but I don’t see why they would need to use a card/chart.
I think you need to watch the insurance though, I don’t know anything about business vehicle insurance but if they borrow the vehicles will they or the vehicles be covered by the companies insurance.
Exactly I’m sad but I find cleaning relaxing it’s the same as if I’m back at the yard at lunch ill clean it or clean my car either or but if I’ve been sat in a cab sweating my nuts off on a summers day and I choose to stretch my legs and wash the motor that is my way off rest and recuperation not sitting cramped in it for another 45 mins, I’ve read on this forum before or in one off the mags off vosa issuing a fine to a driver for cleaning his mirrors and lights on his 45 if it was true the worlds gone mad.
I have done the truckfest twice with another driver when i was on containers…Peterborough, just parked in the showground parking and had a good time in my time off and the boss was happy because we were a bit nearer Felix than we would have been normaly on a monday mng…never had any hassle mind you it was some yrs back. too many stiffs in the game now.
Jenson Button:
A couple of our lads want to do some truck shows this year - I think that is a great idea - but what do they need to tacho wise when they are driving the unit to and from the show?
EU regulations are for the carriage of goods, which presumably won’t be happening in this case, especially as they’ll just be using the units.
Check the tachograph situation with VOSA but I don’t see why they would need to use a card/chart.
I think you need to watch the insurance though, I don’t know anything about business vehicle insurance but if they borrow the vehicles will they or the vehicles be covered by the companies insurance.
Tacho I would for thought you would of known better. Any vehicle over 7.5 tonnes gross has to use a tacho even for private use (fef to larger horseboxes only used privately) so driving to and from the show would require their use, once at the show the drivers would be on their normal weekly rest. So cards out till they are ready to leave on the sunday. Now if they are luck enough to get to parade in the show ring just carry on with no card in, anyone can drive that vehicle on private land with out even having a licence or tacho card. If the diver wants to cover his ■■■ then just do a printout prior to him putting his card back in if he so wishes . But when he inserts his card qfter the weekend it will ask him what hehas been doing since last withdraw and just manual entry as break. It would be no difference than a truck parked up at a yard over the weekend and say a shunnter moved it. When the driver starts on the following day he just entres what he’s been doing not the truck. If the op wants to just write a record in a diary that the trucks where at a show that weekend so they could account for any movement without a card wben the head unit was downloaded. People are just trying to make things to complicated when they are not. Go enjoy have fun get ■■■■■■ what ever
Arrive on sat at showground = tacho needed - go on rest
sunday - arena driving but no road driving so no tacho needed
bank holliday monday - arena driving and then exit showground a few hours later = tacho legally required for both arena and road drive
People keep talking about there being no exemption for vehicles over 7.5 tonne, but that’s for vehicles that are used for the carriage of goods.
I’m not saying that the drivers in question would definitely not come under EU regulations but it’s a possibility that they won’t.
Show me where in the EU regulations it says that vehicles that are not used for the carriage of goods come under EU regulations.
As far as I can see the only reason this case is complicated is because the drivers work for the vehicles operator during the week and in that time the vehicles are used for the carriage of goods, but they will be borrowing the vehicles at the weekend and in that time the vehicles will not be used for the carriage by road of goods.
In fact the vehicles won’t even have trailers attached, so I’d say the question of whether or not they come in-scope of EU regulations is debatable.
Article 2
This Regulation shall apply to the carriage by road:
(a) of goods where the maximum permissible mass of the
vehicle, including any trailer, or semi-trailer, exceeds
3,5 tonnes, or
I don’t believe the OPsd question has been answered satisfactorily in this thread and would advise him to seek clarification from VOSA.
Since VOSA have an official presence at most of the larger truck shows, I’m sure they’d have something to say if mass law-breaking was going on right in front of their beady little rat-like eyes.
ROG:
Arrive on sat at showground = tacho needed - go on rest
sunday - arena driving but no road driving so no tacho needed
bank holliday monday - arena driving and then exit showground a few hours later = tacho legally required for both arena and road drive
explain that bit rog!!■■ because until you come off of break no tacho is required, and if you don’t leave till 5 pm what you did at 2 pm bears no relevance as no inscope driving has been done till 5 pm
the op original question was about borrowing the vehicles which I think is the wrong way of putting it, the way I see it they have asked if they can take the trucks they drive to a show for the weekend, with the owners permission, why has this turned into such a converluted and confusing thread. drive there with their tacho’s in and then put them back in when they leave the same as every other driver does that goes to these shows, no one has ever been prosecuted for tacho offenses for going to shows to the best of my knowledge, all this is doing is putting doubts into the mind of the op and possibly stopping 2 drivers going and enjoying themselves for the weekend, when infact there is NO legal reasons to stop them
