Hi guys hope you all had a merry crimbo,i sort of did i ended up in hospital
with chest pains on crimbo day,but thats another storry.
What shall we do about this.
My wife who is the registered keeper of our family car received a letter
around 2 weeks ago stating she has failed to provide the authoritys
with the persons name who was driving the car last JUNE.This was the first
she had known about the speeding ticket which stated she was doing 40 in a 30 zone.The wife sent the letter back saying that she did not know anything about the letters they say they had sent,which they claim were recorded.
Today she has received a court summons to attend the local court on jan 15th.
i have done a bit of research on the net about speeding tickets and it states
almost on every site that the police have to inform you of the intended prosecution with in 14 days of the offence,my wife was informed nearly 6 months after the alledged offence,she is ■■■■■■■■ herself now what is the best thing to do ?
My wife received two letters recently asking for details of who was driving the car at the time it was photographed speeding, one from Bedfordshire and one from Hertfordshire police. Neither of those letters arrived by recorded delivery, the follow up letters offering her the fixed penalties didn’t arrive by recorded delivery either so if the letters had gone missing in the post she would have been none the wiser.
My son also got one a while back from a different force, can’t remember which one, and that just arrived by regular mail so I would check that they do indeed send them by recorded delivery in your area.
As far as I know the police have to issue a notice of intention to prosecute within 14 days of the offence.
Then after issueing this they have 6 months in which to procede with the prosecution.
As we all know things can go missing in the post so if the police claim that the letter was sent by recorded delivery throw the ball back into there court and ask for proof.
The trouble is that if you contest it you will end up in court and if it goes against you then it will cost a hell of a lot more than £60 so you’ve really got to ask if it’s worth it.
If the Police have claimed in writing that the letters were sent by recorded delivery, dispute this in Court and request an adjournment in order for the Police to produce evidence that this is indeed the case.
Check the wording carefully on what they sent - they have 14 days to ISSUE the NIP, I believe it is common practise for them to argue that if they can prove they sent the letter then it is deemed to be delivered - this does not mean it has been sent recorded delivery, it may have been sent 1st class and they have made some record of it being sent from their end. Loads about this on various sites, basically you will have to convince the court that you never received the letter, and the Police will have to prove that they sent it. Same a a summons, if sent by 1st class it is deemed to be delivered - do a google about how much 1st class mail goes missing and try using that as well as other sources as your defence, you never know it may work - either way you got nothing to loose as they are taking it court anyway
Although the Police have said the letter was sent recorded, I very much doubt they mean recorded delivery. They may mean that the fact that the letter has been sent is recorded (Via proof of posting). This is not usual as in English law proof of posting is proof of delivery. (Unless previously stated otherwise)We all know that the Royal Mail never lose anything
As Harry Monk as already stated. The six months is between date of offence and lodging papers before the court, this is important depending on the date the offence is alleged to have take place and the date the police wrote to your wife to say they were prosecuting for failing to supply. I would hazard a guess to say they were less than six mouths apart.
Be aware that a prosecution for failing to supply will have a greater impact on your insurance than a prosecution for speeding. She will receive an MS90 code on her license which the insurance companies take a dimmer view on than a speeding code.
As you now have a date for court, you can know ask the CPS for a copy of ALL the evidence. (Don’t forget to check the addresses VERY carefully) If you don’t get everything you ask for ask for an adjournment or even a dismissal. But I won’t go overboard on paying too much for a brief as the Magistrates have heard them all before and I’m afraid to say it very much guilty until proven innocent.
Don’t get me wrong, I sincerely hope that your wife can beat this, but she won’t be the first and definitely won’t be the last.
But did she do it? Was she there? If the answer to both is yes then she should go to court, admit the offence but plead with all the ‘evidence’ garnered above that the request never arrived. It might just work and she ends up with the lesser offence of speeding to pay for.
If the answer is no and she thinks she can prove it. Get a brief.
Diddyman:
If the police have sent them recorded then ask them for proof of signiature when you go to court.
Also ask them for proof of posting. If they did send them recorded, which I very much doubt, they will have a receipt showing where and when the NIP was posted. Then check with the post office.
I’d ask for proof now - if they can’t provide it then I’m sure they will give it up.
Also ask them why they have taken so long to write? They would have written long before now.
Conor:
DON’T LISTEN TO THE RUBBISH ON PEPIPOO WHICH IS NOTHING MORE THAN THE SAME RUBBISH YOU’LL HEAR IN PUBS THROUGHOUT THE LAND.
There’s been quite a few cases in the newsgroups where people have relied on Pepipoo only to find themselves well and truly in the [zb].
Spot on.
The essential question to ask yourselves is “Did she commit the offence?”
And if she did, then it’s best she puts her hands up to it now- unless she can think of some plausible excuse which the bench haven’t heard a thousand times before-otherwise all she is going to do is cost herself a lot of time and money.
The essential question to ask yourselves is “Did she commit the offence?”
And if she did, then it’s best she puts her hands up to it now- unless she can think of some plausible excuse which the bench haven’t heard a thousand times before-otherwise all she is going to do is cost herself a lot of time and money.
Totaly agree there Harry.
Ask for the Photo’s, and if it is her car, with her in it, dont argue. And if she has no other, or very few points at this time, ask the Majistrate to consider what reason she would have to try and evade the Fixed penalty, when even Insurance companies dont load premiums on so few points.
welshlad:
What shall we do about this.
My wife who is the registered keeper of our family car received a letter
around 2 weeks ago stating she has failed to provide the authoritys
with the persons name who was driving the car last JUNE.This was the first
she had known about the speeding ticket which stated she was doing 40 in a 30 zone.The wife sent the letter back saying that she did not know anything about the letters they say they had sent,which they claim were recorded.
Today she has received a court summons to attend the local court on jan 15th.
i have done a bit of research on the net about speeding tickets and it states
almost on every site that the police have to inform you of the intended prosecution with in 14 days of the offence,my wife was informed nearly 6 months after the alledged offence,she is ■■■■■■■■ herself now what is the best thing to do ?
When you got the letter about 2 weeks ago you should of rung them up rather than write, but thats moot now. I sort of smell a rat because it is almost as if they have made a mistake and forgotten about you and have now panicked to get you to court before their time runs out. Note that the magistrates court are in a partnership with the camera authorities and if they say they posted it to you, they will believe them over you. You could plead not guilty and hope they make a mistake with the paperwork somehwere, that may get you off. But if not then expect a heavier fine and costs if found guilty. If you have had a NIP but chose to ‘pretend’ you didn’t get it or you know you where speeding and you are prepared to admit it, i think if you contact the people who are taking you to court and tell them you never got a NIP and you would be prepared to accept the fixed penalty and points then they would accept that.
The essential question to ask yourselves is “Did she commit the offence?”
And if she did, then it’s best she puts her hands up to it now- unless she can think of some plausible excuse which the bench haven’t heard a thousand times before-otherwise all she is going to do is cost herself a lot of time and money.
Totaly agree there Harry.
Ask for the Photo’s, and if it is her car, with her in it, dont argue. And if she has no other, or very few points at this time, ask the Majistrate to consider what reason she would have to try and evade the Fixed penalty, when even Insurance companies dont load premiums on so few points.
Irrelevant now I’m afraid. At this time it is very important to remember she is charged with a different offence (Failing to supply). It has no connection (In Law) to the original speeding offence.
You are only entitled in law to view the evidence relating to the case the prosecution will present. The prosecution will not enter the original speeding matter into evidence.
Ask the CPS for all the evidence relating to the Offence (Failing to supply), Check the address on the NIP’s (should have been more than one sent) are exactly the same as the one on the letter informing your wife of intended prosecution.
I’m sorry to say but if everything matches up. It could only be one of two things:
1 Your wife has been adopting a head in the sand approach.
2 Your postman is dumping the mail (Don’t use this as a defence if you can’t prove it)
smcaul:
Check the wording carefully on what they sent - they have 14 days to ISSUE the NIP, I believe it is common practise for them to argue that if they can prove they sent the letter then it is deemed to be delivered - this does not mean it has been sent recorded delivery, it may have been sent 1st class and they have made some record of it being sent from their end. Loads about this on various sites, basically you will have to convince the court that you never received the letter, and the Police will have to prove that they sent it. Same a a summons, if sent by 1st class it is deemed to be delivered - do a google about how much 1st class mail goes missing and try using that as well as other sources as your defence, you never know it may work - either way you got nothing to loose as they are taking it court anyway
Good advice. The only slight change I would make is, speak to the CPS BEFORE you go to court. Try and convince them you never received the NIP’s and ask them to consider a guilty plea to the original speeding offence. If they go for it. Ask them to consider dealing with the matter by means of a conditional offer of a fixed penalty to save the courts time.
You must do this before court as the CPS will only go for this, to save themselves time. It’s too late in court because they are already there.
Thanks guys for all your advice on this matter,the wife is adamant she is not going to a court as she has never been in one and dont intend to ever step in front of a judge.The wife is in the middle of writing a letter to the courts and i will posat it on hear when she has finished it.
On the other matter about my health
on wednesday i was suffering very bad with pains in the middle of my chest
i went to the docs and they told me to go to the hospital asap for a ecg test.
The symptons i was describing was as if i had suffered a mild heart attack.
Jesus i am only 22, any way after a while i was told the test was all ok
but my blood preasure is high, i go back on wednesday for another test to see if it has gone down,i think working 7 days has finally caught up with me !!
let you all know how it goes.
cheers fellas …
