fredthered:
Well I suppose it’s what we have come to expect! - Enjoy!!
I don’t see a problem with anything in that post personally. The world is ever changing and like it or not the workforce have to change with it. Today we live in a 24/7 society and so as the people who have the job of delivering the material things that modern society depends on our profession has now become a 24/7 profession. In the current times of recession the old “supply and demand” equation comes in to play. Right now there is a plentiful supply of labour and little demand, so the employers hold all the trump cards. When the economy eventually turns around that situation will no doubt be reversed and the employees will hold the good cards and the employers will have to try harder to get the good staff they want, that’s the way the world works.
Paul
Of course you don’t. You really have swallowed the diatribe and garbage that a right wing lead economy spouts.
But if I understand correctly you are part of that right wing utopia and are striving to reach the garden of eden. You work for yourself (I think) so you will, by default, try harder, work longer, expect more for less from all others and expect to keep a bigger share of the pie for yourself. You won’t really see or want to hear the expectations of others (but you DO know to what they aspire) because it does not really fit in with your thought process at this time. When (if) you take on employees you will then see the how difficult it is for them to worship your God of capitalism for not a lot of reward. You tell them they can drive a BMW if they work hard enough for you but you know you don’t really mean it and because you have to keep them interested!
The scenario you suggest assumes that everyone will be paid their worth, they will work whatever hours/days your business requires, see little of their families or partners and go to sleep at night knowing that you are running a profitable enterprise and they are contributing to making you a weathy (in cash & posessions) man for the good of your family or gain and be content in doing so.
Fair enough - you took the risks so good luck to you. But when the bad times come or you decide to move on what becomes of them? They have worn themselves out on your behalf, working all required shift patterns and hours possible just to be cast aside as a disposable commodity and no further use to anyone because they are no longer prime employable people or too old or unfit etc. They probably have a broken marriage or relationship because they were never around when they should be. A machine can be turned on and off but human beings can’t and that is what makes us all unique. We all don’t want the same - I’d rather have a life, my health and sanity than be the richest man in the cemetry!
Business breaks 'em so business should take some responsibility for their future by paying them enough to save for those bad times. If they are not your ideal employee, who made the decision to employ them in the first place? If they are bad, discipline procedures used correctly is the right and proper way to get them off the books but if they are just not suitable, surely that should be known within 3 months?
The fact is the British workforce don’t ‘have’ to change with anything if they choose not to.Or are we in a position where contrary to the Tory bs about the unions running the country it’s actually the employers and the bankers who are trying to dictate policy.If the present system of capitalism can’t deliver then that situation can be overturned if the people choose to overturn it and if the present form of so called capitalism isn’t a non performer which needs chucking out then nothing is.
All 3 of the mainstream political parties do not work for us, they work for their selves, they do not give a toss about those who pay taxes or those on benefits, if they really wanted to save money then they would not be introducing more legislation or changing some of it, they would by now of done something about the bonus culture for those top earners, if a bank can that was bailed out can afford to pay bonuses along with the high salaries then the bank should be repaying into the public ■■■■■,so far it hasn’t As for we are all in it together, = 100% BS
They who work for us are not in it at all, they haven’t taken pay cuts or significantly cut their numbers, they do as little as they can get away with doing, and get payed far too much for it,
The only way things will improve is if and when one of the smaller independent parties gets a chance, as the main 3 have all failed the country and us the people, how much longer before people realise this
repton:
I couldn’t agree more. I’m sure pretty much everyone in this industry comes across people day in day out who essentially spend their working day doing as little as they can possibly get away with safe in the knowledge that as long as they turn up on time every day that it will be nigh on impossible for their employer to do anything about it.
Paul
If you believe what you state…then you are all as guilty as each other of being lazy and out for the easy life in that case.
Not so, as I didn’t say everyone in the industry was like that, merely that I would be surprised if there was anyone on here who could honestly say that in an average working week they didn’t meet at least one person who fits that description.
As an owner driver I don’t think anyone could ever accuse me of being out for the easy life…
Paul
Excuse me…look at how you have worded your derogatory argument. Smacks of the politician to me.
By using the word “Everyone” and by inference you have stated “Everyone” to mean “Everyone”… is “Like that” you have tarred everyone in the transport industry with the same brush.
So, when what you consider to be…by your own inference… a “Good for nothing lazy driver” comes into contact with you…as he is included in the collective “Everyone”… he is entitled and must think the same as you… correct?
That undoubtedly being the case… then you are all the same because:
Everyone means everyone and not just those you consider to be superior to others in some way .
Carryfast:
The fact is the British workforce don’t ‘have’ to change with anything if they choose not to.Or are we in a position where contrary to the Tory bs about the unions running the country it’s actually the employers and the bankers who are trying to dictate policy.If the present system of capitalism can’t deliver then that situation can be overturned if the people choose to overturn it and if the present form of so called capitalism isn’t a non performer which needs chucking out then nothing is.
CAPITALISM■■? Capitalism??
Capitalism died in 2007-2008.
The IMF knows this.
The World Bank knows this.
The Central Banks know this.
The City of London and all it’s associates know this.
The Politicians of most countries know this.
And the World’s Media knows this, but this detestable group…the mouthpiece of the Corporate state are in a state of hush with their cohorts in deception the political class’s and the obscenely wealthy to keep it hushed.
We have at present and in the recent past Capitalism and it’s consequences for the masses, and ironically Socialism for the wealthy and influential. Don’t believe me? Witness the recent Banking crash …sorry crisis and their respective “Bailout”.
Bank debt has been “Socialised”. The masses are being forced to pay the price of rampant “Capitalism”. The Corporate sponsored media and it’s mouthpieces in government(s) are to act as if nothing has happened and coerce their populations to swallow the deception. Witness the Euro-zone at present.
But WHOA! Greece isn’t playing by the rules of the deception and it’s back to crisis time. What to do?? Beercroft and his cronies have a partial answer to hushing the British public’s concerns. He knows the answer. Let’s erode some more of the workers rights to appease our paymasters he tells the government. Hasn’t worked in Greece so why are there those who are aiding and abetting him in the workforce in Britain?? You couldn’t make it up.
‘…Every mainstream party is Pro EU. …[A]ny party that is anti EU would carry a certain stigmatism as they all appear (or are labelled) as far right groups…’
Maybe watch and listen to how the BBC very effectively and consistently dismiss such groups by their off-handed but clearly pro-federalist sniffiness: They ought to be seen as The EBC since very little of their heart is dedicated to the the British living in Britain
The BBC’s supposed objectivity is blantantly absent when their Guardianista presenters apply their pro-Brussels bile as if we should never question the paternalistic, abusive, undemocratic norms [sic] from ‘Europeans’ force-feeding their foreign, federalist, grey slime to the many brainwashed turkeys in the Former UK.
Carryfast:
The fact is the British workforce don’t ‘have’ to change with anything if they choose not to.Or are we in a position where contrary to the Tory bs about the unions running the country it’s actually the employers and the bankers who are trying to dictate policy.If the present system of capitalism can’t deliver then that situation can be overturned if the people choose to overturn it and if the present form of so called capitalism isn’t a non performer which needs chucking out then nothing is.
CAPITALISM■■? Capitalism??
Capitalism died in 2007-2008.
The IMF knows this.
The World Bank knows this.
The Central Banks know this.
The City of London and all it’s associates know this.
The Politicians of most countries know this.
And the World’s Media knows this, but this detestable group…the mouthpiece of the Corporate state are in a state of hush with their cohorts in deception the political class’s and the obscenely wealthy to keep it hushed.
We have at present and in the recent past Capitalism and it’s consequences for the masses, and ironically Socialism for the wealthy and influential. Don’t believe me? Witness the recent Banking crash …sorry crisis and their respective “Bailout”.
Bank debt has been “Socialised”. The masses are being forced to pay the price of rampant “Capitalism”. The Corporate sponsored media and it’s mouthpieces in government(s) are to act as if nothing has happened and coerce their populations to swallow the deception. Witness the Euro-zone at present.
But WHOA! Greece isn’t playing by the rules of the deception and it’s back to crisis time. What to do?? Beercroft and his cronies have a partial answer to hushing the British public’s concerns. He knows the answer. Let’s erode some more of the workers rights to appease our paymasters he tells the government. Hasn’t worked in Greece so why are there those who are aiding and abetting him in the workforce in Britain?? You couldn’t make it up.
Absolutely.I think that’s more or less exactly what I’ve been saying in that the so called ‘capitalism’ we’ve got now is closer to communism.It carries all the identifiable traits of dictatorial style of government not consentual,some are (much) more equal than others especially politicians and the sweat shop owners/employers/bankers,and finally the western economies have been sold out for the benefit of the Chinese communist party who’ve now got more influence in the world and on our domestic economic policies than our own government has.
Now compare that to the type of ‘capitalism’ that America had during the 1960’s.
However all that took place long before 2007 probably around 1980 when Thatcher and Reagan decided to go down the route of the ‘global free market economy’.Which just leaves the question why and who gains from this .
‘…Every mainstream party is Pro EU. …[A]ny party that is anti EU would carry a certain stigmatism as they all appear (or are labelled) as far right groups…’
Maybe watch and listen to how the BBC very effectively and consistently dismiss such groups by their off-handed but clearly pro-federalist sniffiness: They ought to be seen as The EBC since very little of their heart is dedicated to the the British living in Britain
The BBC’s supposed objectivity is blantantly absent when their Guardianista presenters apply their pro-Brussels bile as if we should never question the paternalistic, abusive, undemocratic norms [sic] from ‘Europeans’ force-feeding their foreign, federalist, grey slime to the many brainwashed turkeys in the Former UK.
Nothing to do with Brussels.The EU is being run by the Germans for the Germans and to do what’s best for Germany (in the short term until the Chinese start to dominate their domestic economic policies too) no one else.
‘…Every mainstream party is Pro EU. …[A]ny party that is anti EU would carry a certain stigmatism as they all appear (or are labelled) as far right groups…’
Maybe watch and listen to how the BBC very effectively and consistently dismiss such groups by their off-handed but clearly pro-federalist sniffiness: They ought to be seen as The EBC since very little of their heart is dedicated to the the British living in Britain
The BBC’s supposed objectivity is blantantly absent when their Guardianista presenters apply their pro-Brussels bile as if we should never question the paternalistic, abusive, undemocratic norms [sic] from ‘Europeans’ force-feeding their foreign, federalist, grey slime to the many brainwashed turkeys in the Former UK.
Spot on with the BBC, I look in ocasionally, just to see if it has changed, it has not
Patronising and brianwashing the masses for many years now
It is difficult obtaining non-biased reporting in the UK, usually have to watch a foreign news channel, but they also have agendas
This is an old, but good article debunking the Myth that we are in a “Debt Crisis” and the measures…according to the government… they are forced to take.
What do you all think?
Has it changed your perception of what we are being told by our beloved government and their corporate partners in crime the Mainstream media?
Strange, as most of the “old hands” I know claim that we youngsters have less protection now then they did. I do feel there has been a weakening of employee rights.
In my first ever job - in a haulage yard, as trailer boy. wash down, collect visa’s from embassies, the first a driver knew about a disciplinary hearing or even getting fired was when he got a good right hander and bowled out of the office- if he had really upset them then a good kicking around the yard. the bosses then were hard men not university graduates, But the lads who worked there knew the score and in many ways were similar to the bosses, hard independant men.
I got a bat a few times off Lou and Nigel for screwing up( although at 16 it was more a kick up the arse or a clip round the ear)- so I think employee rights have moved on a bit
Solly:
This is an old, but good article debunking the Myth that we are in a “Debt Crisis” and the measures…according to the government… they are forced to take.
What do you all think?
Has it changed your perception of what we are being told by our beloved government and their corporate partners in crime the Mainstream media?
Could not agree more with the contents of this article. A pity the great and good see it differently. Totally confirms why these non elected fools in the EU must not be allowed to prevail. And shows this Government for exactly what they are - self serving and class ridden members of an elitist club!
Strange, as most of the “old hands” I know claim that we youngsters have less protection now then they did. I do feel there has been a weakening of employee rights.
In my first ever job - in a haulage yard, as trailer boy. wash down, collect visa’s from embassies, the first a driver knew about a disciplinary hearing or even getting fired was when he got a good right hander and bowled out of the office- if he had really upset them then a good kicking around the yard. the bosses then were hard men not university graduates, But the lads who worked there knew the score and in many ways were similar to the bosses, hard independant men.
I got a bat a few times off Lou and Nigel for screwing up( although at 16 it was more a kick up the arse or a clip round the ear)- so I think employee rights have moved on a bit
Blimey Rikki my old Grandad worked under conditions during the 1920’s which would have made that all look soft.
Strange though how when that sort of management started getting a bit of stick in return from the workforce having got fed up with such tactics the management were the first to complain about so called ‘violent’ pickets and called the army in to help them the gutless zb’s.
CarryFast
the point is once you get away from the big “logistics” companies and multinationals- at the bottom end of this industry there are still companies that operate and treat their employees in this manner.
Back then almost every company that worked out of North Farm in Loughton had the same reputation- and while many of the companies are forgotten the whole North Farm reputation has lived on
And trust me I was being nice to Lou and Nigel, as i did and still do respect them ( just in case they are reading this) a right hander was the least they were capable of
Thinking this doesnt go on today is niave… I agree with better enforcement it has diminished but it is still there- one thing that has changed is now there isnt the profit returns serious villians dont look to haulage as a way to launder money or hide their income like they did in the 70’/80’s
But there is still companies out there that run in this way, just one step ahead of the law- the very bottom end of our industry is still not a nice place- touchy feely hasnt pervaded the entire industry yet and there are still some strong names running transport companies
Rikki-UK:
CarryFast
the point is once you get away from the big “logistics” companies and multinationals- at the bottom end of this industry there are still companies that operate and treat their employees in this manner.
Back then almost every company that worked out of North Farm in Loughton had the same reputation- and while many of the companies are forgotten the whole North Farm reputation has lived on
And trust me I was being nice to Lou and Nigel, as i did and still do respect them ( just in case they are reading this) a right hander was the least they were capable of
Thinking this doesnt go on today is niave… I agree with better enforcement it has diminished but it is still there- one thing that has changed is now there isnt the profit returns serious villians dont look to haulage as a way to launder money or hide their income like they did in the 70’/80’s
But there is still companies out there that run in this way, just one step ahead of the law- the very bottom end of our industry is still not a nice place- touchy feely hasnt pervaded the entire industry yet and there are still some strong names running transport companies
I’ve got to say my experience has been mostly good and nowhere have I ever had to put up with anything as extreme as it might have been in those examples of being unlucky enough to be working in the wrong time and the wrong place,such as you’ve described,and which was commonplace for the 1920’s working class generation and that was one of the better more secure jobs working in an own account operation hauling coal for the gasworks.So it’s probably a fair bet that the top end of the haulage industry at that time probably matched what you’re describing as the bottom end in later years .
To all those who complain about unions I’m not naive enough to think that it wasn’t the strength of unions over the years that improved that situation and things will only go backwards if that strength continues to be eroded.
Not being funny but things are already going backwards and have been for some time, especially for new starters. No sick pay, no pensions (unaffordable), other benefits cut…gets very messy when you have a mix of old and new hands, some have all the cream and then the new boys with nothing are expected to work in the same way…
Carryfast:
‘…Which just leaves the question why and who gains from this… . ’
Maybe look to Godless Federalists and their ‘want, now, want now’ short term, self serving, leftist, blinkered demands and delusions
Incidentally, it’s perfectly enabled by the inappropriate time constraints dictated by 4-5 year political cycles that pacify but cannot realistically deliver, given their complexity, the ‘product’ demanded.
Carryfast:
Happy Keith:
Mike-C:
Juddian:
‘…British voters, ha, turkeys…’
‘…Every mainstream party is Pro EU. …[A]ny party that is anti EU would carry a certain stigmatism as they all appear (or are labelled) as far right groups…’
‘…Maybe watch and listen to how the BBC very effectively and consistently dismiss such groups by their off-handed but clearly pro-federalist sniffiness…’ blah
‘…Nothing to do with Brussels.The EU is being run by the Germans for the Germans…’
Are you seriously suggesting that Brussels (allied with Strasbourg and 10 Downing Street, of course) isn’t the Fourth Reich’s, EU mouthpiece epicentre?
. 
