Chas:
English law is based upon what a reasonable person thinks
Did you not get the memo, reasonable people were outlawed in this country in 1997. The Abolition of Common Sense Act 1997
Isn’t this a paradox, because these are the very same people that voted for Blair, having previously only voted Tory?
I never voted for Thatcher OR Blair - because they’re both standing for the same thing. Efficiency gains by enforced unemployment. Public Theft via Inflation. Foreign alliances pursued without public consent.
The only ones in each of the main parties I would have liked to have seen as PM were the ones who shied away from it of course.
Winseer: Anyone can “legally run a red light” if it would be a danger to other road users NOT to. Its a judgement call - nothing more.
I don’t think there are any situations in which running a red light would be allowed in which not doing so could be considered as being a ‘danger to other road users’. I think that applies more in regard to the amber light before red which means stop unless it’s not safe to do so .In the case of either the emergency services or the public it’s the same in just being a case of balancing the risk of running a red light resulting in an accident and/or prosecution for whatever reason against the emergency vehicle being delayed.
ROG:
For the NO pollsters would it be fair for me to say that they are putting the possibility of getting a FPN issued (not enforced) over that of using common sense ?
You would ROG. Purely because common sense is not a trait associated with those behind the FPN’s
Saying that mind, a couple of months ago I got zapped by a red light camera in Oldham. I had to make a tightish left turn, of course the lights changed as soon as the unit went through so I was committed. I had to slow right down to a near stop to make the turn and the trailer wheels pinged the sensor in the road. It was a dark morning and the two camera flashes were unmistakeable.
I spent a nervous fortnight waiting for the letter but it didn’t arrive. It would’ve been pretty obvious from the photos what was going on - the unit and trailer at right angles and barely moving, so maybe they were seen by someone with a bit of sense. But it’s a sad reflection of the view we have of these unbending sticklers for the rules in authority that I spent a nervous fortnight waiting.
martinviking:
No I wouldn’t run a red light, I got 3 points for running one 3 years ago 1 second after it went red. A mate of mine got do done for exactly what this thread is about & when he contested it they said that they couldn’t find any evidence of an emergency vehicle in the area at the time of the offence, so f’ the consequences, there’s not much chance it’s a member of your family anyway & would any body else be bothered about any one else’s family ■■?
Would it bother you that the rest of humanity thinks you’re a selfish, heartless, neolithic knuckledragger.
No but it bothers me you’ve been self appointed to speak on our behalf. I wont take points for nobody, the emergency services are trained to deal with these situations.
yes i would
just last night a police car come down the road behind me on blues and twos and the lights on the roundabout i was at were red i went throu them and blocked the roundabout so they could get throu the copper even put his hand up to say thanks
as i know if i were being attacked house on fire or wot ever i would want the emergency services there as soon as possible
Muckaway:
I wont take points for nobody, the emergency services are trained to deal with these situations.
What if the only way they can deal with it is to wait for say 2 minutes and that if they had arrived 1 minute earlier they could have saved a life or two … would you still consider it worth a super outside possibilty of getting points ?
Could you live with that knowledge for the rest of your life especially if it was a childs life ?
Muckaway:
I wont take points for nobody, the emergency services are trained to deal with these situations.
What if the only way they can deal with it is to wait for say 2 minutes and that if they had arrived 1 minute earlier they could have saved a life or two … would you still consider it worth a super outside possibilty of getting points ?
Could you live with that knowledge for the rest of your life especially if it was a childs life ?
Stop thinking of the children Rog. At traffic lights I keep all round observation like any decent driver should do. If I see/hear an emergency vehicle approaching I’m already sussing out what’s best. It’s the ditherers that hold up the blues and twos.
Muckaway:
I wont take points for nobody, the emergency services are trained to deal with these situations.
What if the only way they can deal with it is to wait for say 2 minutes and that if they had arrived 1 minute earlier they could have saved a life or two … would you still consider it worth a super outside possibilty of getting points ?
Could you live with that knowledge for the rest of your life especially if it was a childs life ?
How would you know where there going or coming from we are not mind readers there could be training.
There could be late for there tea we have no insite to them, but let look it this way what if you did move one car length and you hit a child how would you live with that, the light is red for a reason, someone could be crossing the road or the other junction is moving. If you think its ok you do it but don’t expect me to follow suite.
You never know but the emergency vehicles could be on there way to a Traffic Accident involving an hgv with the driver trapped in the vehicle.…they could be on there way to save one of us?
smokinbarrels:
You never know but the emergency vehicles could be on there way to a Traffic Accident involving an hgv with the driver trapped in the vehicle.…they could be on there way to save one of us?
Sorry but I wouldn’t. I’d make every effort to move out of the way but I would stop short of setting the camera off. No camera I’d go through and clear the way but like many others have said I wouldn’t trust common sense to prevail.
Your poll is asking us if we do it, not why or where the emergency is.
you ask us for are opinion, and the make it out as we all don’t care about life. I do and I care about whats around me not whats happening 5 miles or less,
I have seen on TV my cop shows cop cars racing to get to the motorway to stand vigil on a bridge waiting for a drug lord in is car or but if i am at a traffic light and its red I would not cross it cos something can happen to me by crossing a red light i could kill a child or hit a car or truck or bus or anything that in my way as I have jump a red light.
Your poll is asking us if we do it, not why or where the emergency is.
The video says it all.Effectively it says don’t enter a bus lane to let an emergency vehicle get through amongst other issues like getting off the road if needed.
Similar types of bs apply to emergency vehicle drivers on call as the general public.There’s inevitably going to be times when lives depend on the driver of an emergency vehicle saying to hell with all the safety and what’s legal bs and just getting on with it by doing whatever needs to be done and accepting the risk of the consequences if it all goes pear shaped.The same applies in the case of the general public in co operating with that situation.
Careless/inconsiderate driving
28.As with dangerous driving, the circumstances of every case of careless or inconsiderate driving will be unique and we will consider these before reaching a decision as to the appropriate level of charge.
29.People can drive carelessly or inconsiderately with tragic consequences. Under the law as it stands at present, the consequence of a driver’s actions are irrelevant to the level of charge that is chosen.
30.That will change with the introduction of the new offence of causing death by careless driving (see note 17).
31.The test that we apply will not change. However, if we decide that the driving was careless and caused a death, the appropriate charge will be, under the new legislation, causing death by careless driving.
32.There are decided cases that provide some guidance about the driving that the courts will regard as careless or inconsiderate and the following examples are typical of what we are likely to regard as careless or inconsiderate driving:
Careless driving
overtaking on the inside;
driving inappropriately close to another vehicle;
inadvertently driving through a red light;
emerging from a side road into the path of another vehicle;
tuning a car radio;
using a hand-held mobile phone or other hand-held electronic equipment where the driver was avoidably distracted by that use;
selecting and lighting a cigarette or similar where the driver was avoidably distracted by that use.
Inconsiderate driving
flashing of lights to force other drivers in front to give way;
misuse of any lane to avoid queuing or gain some other advantage over other drivers;
unnecessarily remaining in an overtaking lane;
unnecessarily slow driving or braking without good cause;
driving with un-dipped headlights which dazzle oncoming drivers;
driving through a puddle causing pedestrians to be splashed;
driving a bus in such a way as to alarm passengers.
the bit in blue made me laugh, you now no you could get don for that
ROG:
Chance of getting points = virtually none
Chance of causing problems for others in delaying emergency vehicle = very probable
Logic and common sense says to do what is likely to cause the least problems
IMO those saying NO are going against common sense and logic for purely selfish reasons
Mayhe if this country hadn’t been so infested with health and safety box tickers (which to be honest going by your posts on here you seem to be) then the outcome would be different.
As for living with a fictional childs death on my hands get real and stop living in a fantasty land. What do you think it would be reported on the news? ‘A young child died today after a truck didn’t move over for the ambulance fast enough’. Like I pointed out in my first post I know of two people first hand who got points for this very issue. About 10 years ago maybe but this country has only got worse since then not better.
Unfortuntely this culture of paranoia and fear of cameras and prosecution is one manufactured by the government over the past decade or so, as such its no wonder a majority of us dont apply common sense in this or other situations but rather panic about the camera first, and think rationally second. At the end of the day, if you have an unpredictable dog with a history or biting, or a venonous snake in a corridor you’re trying to get past, you’re going to worry about the worst case consequences before anything else, regardless of the fact the owner of said dog or snake are telling you not to worry, it’ll be fine. Well its only fine until the camera does flash or the dog does bit or the snake does strike, then things are out of our hands and we’re at the mercy of others. I personally dont trust the authorities to throw a case out of court with regards a camera, I’m sure theres quite a good chance that they would but that also leaves every possibility that they would not. If they chose not to endeavour to find evidence of an ambulance then I’m going to be paying the consequences which could be loss of licence and job or at the very least a massive rise in insurance premiums. So bearing that in mind, if theres a fixed camera, I will do nothing to set it off in an effort of self presavation, just as I would with the dangerous dog or the snake, in all cases it could go either way but the worry and risk of the consequences is enough for me and possibly most people to take the safe option.
I would move through a red, life and death and all that, I’m quite sure the camera becomes inactive after the light has been red for a short period of time.
I have seen vehicles doing exactly that and the camera not being set off.
I think that applies more in regard to the amber light before red which means stop unless it’s not safe to do so 
.In the case of either the emergency services or the public it’s the same in just being a case of balancing the risk of running a red light resulting in an accident and/or prosecution for whatever reason against the emergency vehicle being delayed.
