This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact.
Discuss or explain.
Easy- ignore POA, put it on break and put ya feet up. Job done.
How long did he drive off for?
The best thing is to ignore the POA mode and just stick it to break when you get held up somewhere.
Although POA will reset your driving time on a tachograph head it does not count towards your driving time break.
I don’t believe it, or rather I don’t believe the version of events you have been told Midlifetrucker. In the scenario you posted no offence had been committed therefore no fine could be issued.
My suspicion would be that after his 3 hours on POA his driving time had reset to zero, he then set off and drove for more than 30 minutes before showing a break, therefore was fined for exceeding four and a half hours driving without a break.
POA isn’t rest, not sure why people are saying “Avoid like the plague” etc… we are supposed to understand these things now 
I am guessing that the driver in question drove back more than 30 mins after the POA, in which case that was a no-no, but a print out explaining “Mode Error” would have sufficed for the 45 minutes.
For the record (Esp. if you don’t get paid breaks) there would have been nothing wrong with waiting 3 hours on POA, pulling out to a suitable area (For food etc.) and having your break, as long as you don’t exceed 4.5 hours from your last break
I have done this myself MANY times, especially at the likes of Tesco RDC’s, I know (or expect) the delay to be about 2-3 hours from previous experience, I hit the square box, pull out and get a warm/hot meal on the way back (which you can’t get out of a vending or coffee machine). I get my break deducted, and reserve the right to take it where I feel.
unless multi manning
nick2008:
unless multi manning
Then it would be 45 Mins BREAK, not REST 
[/pedant mode off]
the maoster:
I don’t believe it, or rather I don’t believe the version of events you have been told Midlifetrucker. In the scenario you posted no offence had been committed therefore no fine could be issued.My suspicion would be that after his 3 hours on POA his driving time had reset to zero, he then set off and drove for more than 30 minutes before showing a break, therefore was fined for exceeding four and a half hours driving without a break.
That must have been what he did. I don’t use Poa as it isn’t required in my job. I must be honest I did think Poa would reset for a new session. So I guess I will remember that if it happens.
Our trainer didn’t explain that or I wasn’t paying attention 
midlifetrucker:
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact.Discuss or explain.
POA is neither break nor rest, if the driver picked up the trailer then did more than another 30 minutes driving he would have gone over 4½ hours driving time without a break, hence the fine.
The driver should have booked a 45 minute break instead of booking all 3 hours as POA.
trubster:
nick2008:
unless multi manningThen it would be 45 Mins BREAK, not REST
[/pedant mode off]
I didn’t remark weather rest or break I was referring to the OP comment not title
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact
and to be honest the whole quote is a puzzle … Why should you show a 45 before going to POA ?
tachograph:
midlifetrucker:
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact.Discuss or explain.
POA is neither break nor rest, if the driver picked up the trailer then did more than another 30 minutes driving he would have gone over 4½ hours driving time without a break, hence the fine.
The driver should have booked a 45 minute break instead of booking all 3 hours as POA.
nick2008:
trubster:
nick2008:
unless multi manningThen it would be 45 Mins BREAK, not REST
[/pedant mode off]
I didn’t remark weather rest or break I was referring to the OP comment not title
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact
and to be honest the whole quote is a puzzle … Why should you show a 45 before going to POA ?
Weather should be whether if we want to be pedantic 
midlifetrucker:
tachograph:
midlifetrucker:
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact.Discuss or explain.
POA is neither break nor rest, if the driver picked up the trailer then did more than another 30 minutes driving he would have gone over 4½ hours driving time without a break, hence the fine.
The driver should have booked a 45 minute break instead of booking all 3 hours as POA.
nick2008:
trubster:
nick2008:
unless multi manningThen it would be 45 Mins BREAK, not REST
[/pedant mode off]
I didn’t remark weather rest or break I was referring to the OP comment not title
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact
and to be honest the whole quote is a puzzle … Why should you show a 45 before going to POA ?
Weather should be whether if we want to be pedantic
spelling was never a hot subject 
I’ve been told by drivers at RDC’s not to bother with it. Causes more hassle than its worth apparently.
So what is the point of Poa
nick2008:
Why should you show a 45 before going to POA ?
Break is Break
POA is POA
POA effectively “pauses the clock” but does not reset it. Break resets the clock. The only exception to this is that if you are on multi-manning, the first 45 minutes of any period of POA that you record with your card in the second slot is regarded as Break (but only because the tachograph will not allow you to record Break while the vehicle is in motion). If you are going to drive more than 4.5 hours (or work for more than 6 hours) then you need to record an appropriate Break (not POA).
nick2008:
trubster:
nick2008:
unless multi manningThen it would be 45 Mins BREAK, not REST
[/pedant mode off]
I didn’t remark weather rest or break I was referring to the OP comment not title
This isn’t hearsay or folk lore. Drivers gets pulled. They look into his card. On one day he drives 4 hours then arrives at drop. Drops trailer and is then told collection trailer will be 3 hours ish. Driver parks and then switches to Poa for 3 hours. Trailer is ready and he drives off. Vostapo say he should have shown a 45 before switching to Poa. Result £100 smackers fine. Fact
and to be honest the whole quote is a puzzle … Why should you show a 45 before going to POA ?
The only time you would need to do that would be if you had done exactly 4.5 hours driving. The rules clearly state that on completing 4.5 hours driving a driver must immediately take a break, or begin a rest period.
After a driving period of no more than 4.5 hours, a driver must immediately take a break of at least 45 minutes unless he takes a rest period.
That means you can only go on break or rest at 4.5 hours, no other work or POA.
Doesn’t seem to have been the case here as he is said to have only done 4 hours so the most likely explanation is he exceeded the 4.5 hours on the return journey because he assumed POA was break.
Or it just driver/RDC BS. 
Radar19:
I’ve been told by drivers at RDC’s not to bother with it. Causes more hassle than its worth apparently.
It doesn’t, well only for drivers who are terminally bewildered.
It’s a simple concept. It isn’t break for the Driver’s Hours Regulations. It doesn’t count as working time for the WTD. That’s it, so what about those simple facts could cause hassle?
midlifetrucker:
So what is the point of Poa
The whole point of it is to allow drivers who are not paid for their breaks to be “at work” (and therefore being paid) while not actually working and eating into their permitted “working hours”. In other words, it’s a fudge designed to circumnavigate the Working Time Directive.