Good for you Del, you really deserve what you’ve earned. 
The ironic thing is that too often that government has been a Labour one such as Wilson,Callaghan and Healey,Blair and now that backsatabbing zb Miliband.
I certainly won’t argue with that 
carryfast, I was thinking more along the lines of what drivers are earning.
most of the other complaints apply in some form or other to most jobs.
anyway, i have exhausted my advice , except to say,
if you join any union…make it work for you, don’t be a lemming!
Ask these tanker drivers who are going on strike why they would not back another fuel firm in the same area last year when they wanted to have industrial action!!!
I tend to find all union guys these days are only fighting for there own beliefs.
I can remember working for a company were there was a small union.
The top men union man there had decided that nobody was to leave the yard until 5 on a Monday morning and if you had a long run it was a struggle to get all your drops off.
Anyway I came into work one bank Holliday Monday at 4:30 guess who was pulling out the yard yes you guess right the top union man.
Because it was a bank Holliday and job and knock it seem to sute the top man to start early. After that I never had any respect for the unions and I still see it today were I work now the union men there seem to only fight for there agender and seem to be very lazy only do what they want to do.
I tend to find all union guys these days are only fighting for there own beliefs
Oh, I happily agree with that, I certainly was.
the difference between me and those who “run away”, is that when I won , other people also benefited, not just me.
Good for you Del, you really deserve what you’ve earned
.
not sure how to take this.
is it a bit of sarcasm because in retrospect my post came over as bragging?
All I was trying to do was to point out the rewards I have had from my working life compared to what most today can expect and that I put those rewards (partly but not entirely) down to trade unions …
If it wasn’t sarcasm…thank you very much Phil
waynedl:
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and thats why the rates are [zb] in this industry drivers are there own worst enamy .and have to work 60 plus hours a week to make a decent living . some of you deserve what you getThe rates are [zb] because there’s more drivers than jobs.
If I didn’t go and cross the picket line, the next guy would, maybe not even a brit, there’s plenty of foreigners itching for our jobs.
The days of a strike working are long gone, I say “if you don’t like it, leave”.
I haven’t read the whole thread so apologies if this has been mentioned…but this statement above is ■■■■■■■■.
The rates are ■■■■ 'cos drivers are willing to work for ■■■■ wages!!! And to top them up they put more hours in during the week than our lass works in two weeks… 
del949:
I wouldn’t cross a picket line in my own company but elsewhere I’d have to weigh up the circumstances and decide for myself whether or not I thought the picket was justified
.
I respect that.
Even as an opponent of the unions you have enough integrity to judge a situation on merit and not rule out honouring a picket line because "it upsets the union men "
Thanks for that. I’m not actually anti-union, in fact I’m a paid-up member! Joined after an incident at work led to me being on a disciplinary and nearly losing my job; the shop steward at our mill, without my asking him, took union advice and accompanied me at the hearing despite the fact that I was not then a paid-up member. I felt it only right afterwards that I should pay my dues, although I balk at any political contribution towards the Labour party! 
My objection is to the worst excesses and tendency towards intransigence of the more militant union leaders. Some of them are no better than Mafia bosses.
I too no longer pay political levy.
the worst of the dinosaurs of the union movement are long gone, however the right wing media will continue to use the above phrase whenever posible in order to reinforce the memories of the 70’s
edited to add
to my everlasting shame I supported Tony Blair at the beginning and campaigned for him.
I am ashamed and apologise to all.
del949:
to my everlasting shame I supported Tony Blair at the beginning and campaigned for him.
I’m shocked, I would never have pegged you as a Tory. 
Still we all make mistakes.
I didn’t peg Blair as a Tory either
del949:
I didn’t peg Blair as a Tory either
Like I said, we all make mistakes. 
del949:
I didn’t peg Blair as a Tory either
Obviousy the Labour Party (supposedly brought into being by the unions for the unions) didn’t either.Although it wouldn’t have taken much to put 2 and 2 together considering his background and the fact that his father was a Tory councillor and and he was more inspired by Thatcher’s ideas than opposed to them.No surprise then that he turned out to be no Peter Shore or Dennis Skinner.
im gonna sit this one out,conversations about strikes usually end in a fight round these parts,and seeing as i was 12 at the time...i dont think i`ll bother 
Wheel Nut:
The unions agreed to the RTD and POA, drivers are not working any less hours, just more unpaid hoursThe unions were amongst the final decision makers for the DCPC
You can’t blame Unions for the RTD or POA, they’re a EU social legislaton creation they where in no way democratic descisions from anyone. Likewise for the DCPC, true the Unions may of had some input but only in the sense that anyone could have a input i.e ‘consultations’, they do what they’re gonna do anyway. The consultation is just to open it up for discussion in case they miss summat.
the labour party, contrary to popular belief was not founded by the trade unions.
trade unions were part of the founding organisation but were not exclusive in the founding.
The other groups included amongst others the Fabian society and other left wing organisations .
The Independent Labour Party (ILP) was founded in 1893 in Bradford by Scottish politician Keir Hardie. In 1900 it joined with the trade unions and other socialist groups in forming the Labour Representation Committee, which later became the Labour Party. It was formed, as the name suggests, to set up a Labour Party genuinely independent of the Liberals, who were the main Parliamentary opposition to the Conservatives at that time.
Must admit the one which puzzles me is the Socialist Workers Party. Never met one of their members who wasn’t on benefits.
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and thats why the rates are [zb] in this industry drivers are there own worst enamy .and have to work 60 plus hours a week to make a decent living . some of you deserve what you get
+1
I’m not a union man but they helped me when I was younger and had to be in one to ‘fit in’. My company had London Lorry Permit stickers on and I did a drop at 6am in Hayes, noticed a man writing on a clipboard, thought nothing of it, I had a permit. Two weeks later, a court summons , you aren’t covered, no valid permit . Talk to the TM,“oh no, it’s elapsed !!” 
. The union took over, all I got was a £60 fine that the union payed , the firm got hit with a huge fine. Speaking as I find, they (TGWU) did me proud.
I hold my hand up!
I have been a union member since I was 15 , I’m now 65 and retired.
If people, (And that includes those here) do not wish to join a union, I respect that.
May I ask them, though, how are pay and conditions to be improved in the Road Transport Industry, if not by drivers sticking together?
Who is going to do this for us?
May I also say that in my 50 years in the industry, I never once had an employer give a wage rise or conditions improvement voluntarily.
Gentlemen (And any Ladies on here!), let us conduct this debate with consideration for the views of others, without trading insults.
Alex
del949:
the labour party, contrary to popular belief was not founded by the trade unions.
trade unions were part of the founding organisation but were not exclusive in the founding.
The other groups included amongst others the Fabian society and other left wing organisations .The Independent Labour Party (ILP) was founded in 1893 in Bradford by Scottish politician Keir Hardie. In 1900 it joined with the trade unions and other socialist groups in forming the Labour Representation Committee, which later became the Labour Party. It was formed, as the name suggests, to set up a Labour Party genuinely independent of the Liberals, who were the main Parliamentary opposition to the Conservatives at that time.
I think it’s that issue of many people ‘thinking’ that the wording of ‘joined’ meant what it says in that the LRC/Labour Party and the Trade Unions had an affiliation and a link in which the Unions ‘should’ have an input and a binding VETO on Labour Party policy.If not then there’s no way that it could be called anything different to it’s original title of ILP and can’t really claim to be ‘only’ on the side of ‘Labour’.
As has since been shown numerous times when it has taken the side of the CBI and employers and bankers over the conflicting interests of working employed people,concerning the issue of the free market economy being applied in regards to prices,but wage controls being applied to workers either by direct government controls,such as in the late 1970’s,or by mass redundancies and immigration of foreign labour,to create an oversupply in the labour market.Which is one of the reasons why the economy is in the state it’s in now because prices have outrun incomes.
I think most of the history of the ‘Labour Party’ has been a case of a trades descriptions scam in which it doesn’t do what it says on the tin.Which is why there’s been repeated episodes in it’s history of incidents like Arthur Scargill (correctly) tearing up his ‘Labour’ Party memebership and infighting in which the ‘real’ Labour people within the Party have (tried) (and failed) to save it from people like Blair etc.etc. and to the point where sometimes those who shouldn’t be there decide to throw their toys out of the pram and join the Liberals instead like the Gang of Four did. 
But the fact that it allowed someone with a Tory background and with the obviously Tory views of Blair to become it’s leader and to follow on with Thatcher’s policies and then re name his obviously New Conservative Party New Labour says it all.