Oh the joys of driving into Calais port!

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
61

mucker85:
These people traveling from Whereveristan or some other far flung places must have money to do so. The amount of money they would need for the travel a quarter the way round the world and then pay some bent trucker to smuggle them into the uk must a seizable amount of cash. Why don’t they stay at home and have an easy life there?
I’m asking a question not having a rant.

There are three ways in which they do it.

  1. They just take a chance with very little cash, usually unsuccessful.
  2. They borrow money from relatives with a view to paying them back when they get here.
  3. They use an agent, The agent puts them in a lorry, he has contacts in the UK, Once in the UK they are sold to the highest bidder. The lorry driver then gets paid and the illegal immigrant works for a pittance for several years.
62

Winseer:
Thinking big can sometimes look small because of that main bother of “futility”.

I’d be quite happy to stand as Ukip candidate in my area for example, but I suspect even supplying my own deposit to stand against that two faced tory twit who currently holds the seat won’t guarantee I’d even be given the chance to stand. Without the party apparatus, standing as an independant would also be pretty futile.
The big opportunity might come however should Ukip surge so much in public opinion, that they decide to field a candidate in every seat, rather than just some as at present. :exclamation:

You’re right, turn up with a wad of cash to pay the deposit and expect to get selected without doing any work would be folly! BUT, if you really believe in this stuff, if you really believe in UKIP which from your posts it seems you do, then as a party you could be on the edge of a momentous time in British politics. My advice is get in there, help them, do work canvassing at the next election, become a well known person in your local party, there are other ways of being involved that don’t involve being selected to stand. Most of the people standing will have worked their way up like this. So you seem passionate about your subject so if you start now there’s every possibility you would get selected at a future election if you are good enough. Like I say, be the change you want to see. Too many people just moan to each other and never do anything to stand up for what they believe in. As a UKIP voter it may never be a better time for you, go for it.

(as someone who’s fairly anti-UKIP it was quite hard to say that. But at least you know it’s geniuine)

63

mucker85:
These people traveling from Whereveristan or some other far flung places must have money to do so. The amount of money they would need for the travel a quarter the way round the world and then pay some bent trucker to smuggle them into the uk must a seizable amount of cash. Why don’t they stay at home and have an easy life there?
I’m asking a question not having a rant.

They don’t have much money. Often their life savings of them and sometimes their whole family will go on just the channel crossing, I.e paying a gang to get them across. It can take them a year and more to get to the channel from their own countries, the hard way. I’m not getting into the rights and wrongs but these people do not by any stretch of the imagination have an easy life, at home, on the road, or when they get here. I get a bit conflicted and struggle with how I feel about the situation to be honest. Because I’m fully aware that it’s just a fluke and chance that meant I was born in a country that allows me to be lying in my comfy bed at 9am tapping away at an iPad before I go down and have anything I like for breakfast. Anyof us could have been born anywhere, we were all just lucky it was the developed world and not some tinpot dictatorship where half your family has died of AIDS and you’ll be lucky to see 40. But I’m also aware there’s oly so much one country can take in immigration. So I just don’t know.

I’m sure some will tell us it was was gods will and divine right to be born in Surrey and nowhere else, but I don’t believe in god so obviously think that rubbish.

Life is like the spin of a coin, we just landed the right side up.

64

In the UK, we are scared of “life imprisonment”.

However, that “punishment” is a big step UP in lifestyle for those fleeing from the countries in question that are of course those OUTSIDE of Europe, just passing through as it were.

They have no qualms about killing one of us, because our laws do not deter them from doing it. You’ve only got to rub one up the wrong way from somewhere like Somalia or Yemen and risk getting a knife between your ribs, with “There there - here’s a prison cell with colour TV for you” to the murderer at best, whilst you get heaped around a rose bush somewhere.

No thanks. THe Death penalty puts even scumbags off murder to a considerable extent. I’d love to see it returned, and as I said earlier, I’m with over 80% of the rest of the UK population on believing thus as well. :wink:

65

switchlogic:

mucker85:
These people traveling from Whereveristan or some other far flung places must have money to do so. The amount of money they would need for the travel a quarter the way round the world and then pay some bent trucker to smuggle them into the uk must a seizable amount of cash. Why don’t they stay at home and have an easy life there?
I’m asking a question not having a rant.

They don’t have much money. Often their life savings of them and sometimes their whole family will go on just the channel crossing, I.e paying a gang to get them across. It can take them a year and more to get to the channel from their own countries, the hard way. I’m not getting into the rights and wrongs but these people do not by any stretch of the imagination have an easy life, at home, on the road, or when they get here. I get a bit conflicted and struggle with how I feel about the situation to be honest. Because I’m fully aware that it’s just a fluke and chance that meant I was born in a country that allows me to be lying in my comfy bed at 9am tapping away at an iPad before I go down and have anything I like for breakfast. Anyof us could have been born anywhere, we were all just lucky it was the developed world and not some tinpot dictatorship where half your family has died of AIDS and you’ll be lucky to see 40. But I’m also aware there’s oly so much one country can take in immigration. So I just don’t know.

I’m sure some will tell us it was was gods will and divine right to be born in Surrey and nowhere else, but I don’t believe in god so obviously think that rubbish.

Life is like the spin of a coin, we just landed the right side up.

Top post Chief.

66

Winseer:
THe Death penalty puts even scumbags off murder to a considerable extent. I’d love to see it returned, and as I said earlier, I’m with over 80% of the rest of the UK population on believing thus as well. :wink:

That’s problem though, it doesn’t. Facts don’t back you up on that one. And we have a pretty low murder rate actually. Also plucking a statistic like 80% of the population are for capital punishment of of the air doesn’t make it true either.

67

Winseer:
In the UK, we are scared of “life imprisonment”.

However, that “punishment” is a big step UP in lifestyle for those fleeing from the countries in question that are of course those OUTSIDE of Europe, just passing through as it were.

They have no qualms about killing one of us, because our laws do not deter them from doing it. You’ve only got to rub one up the wrong way from somewhere like Somalia or Yemen and risk getting a knife between your ribs, with “There there - here’s a prison cell with colour TV for you” to the murderer at best, whilst you get heaped around a rose bush somewhere.

No thanks. THe Death penalty puts even scumbags off murder to a considerable extent. I’d love to see it returned, and as I said earlier, I’m with over 80% of the rest of the UK population on believing thus as well. :wink:

Sorry for quoting this again but I’ve just read it properly. Utter drivel, don’t even know where to start

68

Winseer:

switchlogic:

jase:
but I think the borders have to be closed and immigration more strictly controlled.

Leaving the EU will allow us to close the doors.

I don’t think that’s exactly the UKIP agenda.There’s actually nothing stopping us from from closing the doors now and repatriating our immigrant communities arguably even if they are born here.Considering that we’re not a part of the Schengen group of EU states and as you’ve said the problem is mostly one of non EU citizens anyway.In which case no one should be naive enough to think that a Party run by an ex Thatcherite Tory supporter would want to cut off the continuing supply of cheap labour which has been what the uk government’s immigration policy has been based on since long before we even joined the EU.Which is why we were having exactly the same issues here in the early 1970’s and it’s why Powell was sent into exile by his own Party including Thatcher.

As for return of the death penalty it’s a slippery slope that needs a lot of thought concerning wether to re introduce it or not and ( extremely ) careful discretion in it’s use.In ‘certain’ cases such as some of the type we’ve seen recently and in which the evidence is indisputable then I’d agree with it but if you’re gong to do it make it a real deterrent and not kid yourself concerning exactly what you’re really doing in that case,there should be no humane way out for the criminal,or to make everyone feel better,in the form of the rope or lethal injection.It should be the electric chair or nothing.While such a sanction obviously has nothing whatsoever to do with immigration in that many of the deserving types of such action have been from the indigenous community. :bulb:

69

it’ll be reight :smiley:

all this flooding we’ve been having aint global warming,it’s the country sinking through all the weight :open_mouth:

70

Oh fancy that, Carryfast has taken the debate back into the 70’s again. There’s a surprise. I’d love to see your house, I bet it’s like a 70’s time warp with you and your mum having debates over dinner about Macmillan, Peter Shore and Fordist policies.Is the computer out in the garden shed so as not to ruin the illusion of living in the 70’s when indoors? You always post at the same times, is that ‘Carryfasts computer time’? :wink:

71

switchlogic:
Oh fancy that, Carryfast has taken the debate back into the 70’s again. There’s a surprise. I’d love to see your house, I bet it’s like a 70’s time warp with you and your mum having debates over dinner about Macmillan, Peter Shore and Fordist policies.Is the computer out in the garden shed so as not to ruin the illusion of living in the 70’s when indoors? You always post at the same times, is that ‘Carryfasts computer time’? :wink:

I imagine a very long table in the household seating just two people, one of them holding an ear trumpet with a butler and maid hovering around :stuck_out_tongue:

Tony Blair has been recruited as an advisor to the Albanian government, expect the floods from Tirana to start shortly holding a new EU passport

72

switchlogic:

Winseer:
THe Death penalty puts even scumbags off murder to a considerable extent. I’d love to see it returned, and as I said earlier, I’m with over 80% of the rest of the UK population on believing thus as well. :wink:

That’s problem though, it doesn’t. Facts don’t back you up on that one. And we have a pretty low murder rate actually. Also plucking a statistic like 80% of the population are for capital punishment of of the air doesn’t make it true either.

Of course facts back me up on that one!

(1) Executed murderers are guaranteed not to kill anyone else.
(2) There’s no figures for how many would-be killers WOULD have killed someone, but didn’t because they were scared of being executed.

Remember, we’re not supposed to be talking about “the danger of executing an innocent person” here - that’s down to the CPS to build a watertight case, and should not be the public’s concern, especially that of the Jury. If the case is full of holes, I’ll acquit myself because I’ve sworn to act “according to the evidence” which if absent, means an automatic acquittal anyway. :exclamation:

On the other hand, the defence counsel might well take the line:-

“Members of the Jury. If you find my client guilty with the enormous evidence against him, you MAY be sending an innocent to their death, so you must acquit for the salvation of your own peace of mind!”

Yeh. Imagine how much sleep we’d lose as Jurors if we acquitted someone who went straight out and done it again? How woulld you face the future victim’s family, knowing that their loved one is DEAD because you suffer from terminal libralism, and let an obvious killer off, just because “you don’t agree with the death penalty”■■
My suggestion is of course that “libralism in Justice renders one unfit to be a Juror in a capital case Your lack in belief IN actual justice makes you unfit to judge others.”
Sorry bud, if the case against you is “beyond reasonable doubt” and we deliver as jurors a unanimous verdict, then you swing. I’ll sleep fine. :smiling_imp:

The strangest statistic of all perhaps is the way people are happy to stop believing in any religion, but rush to stop believing in capital justice?!
Is this perhaps because to an atheist, life imprisonment represents more suffering than instant death, bearing in mind the atheist believes ‘one goes into nothing when dead’, or that “You need to be alive to suffer” in any way?

"If there’s no justice and no hell then we’re all evil.
…if there’s evil all around, but no religion, then none of us are damned for it, so evil can multiple freely without check."

Personally, I don’t care what a capital criminal believes in. The death penalty punishes uniformly across all belief systems whilst quenching third party and victim thirst for justice at the same time.

…Tell you what. Perhaps a condemned prisoner’s death sentence can be commuted to life imprisonment if the victim’s family forgives them. :exclamation:
I don’t think we’ll have to prepare many “lifer” jail places somehow. :laughing:

73

I lost interest in that load of rubbish the minute you brought religion into it. You and religion seem to go hand in had like Carryfast and the '70s. Have a nice day.

74

Who’s bringing religion into anything? That wasn’t even being discussed, just as an opposite side of argument, bearing in mind there’s a strong relationship between libralism and atheism compared to if you like, rough justice at the hands of a more pius system such as the way child killers are treated in Iran?

Personally, I think I’madinnerjacket is a nutcase, but doesn’t it warm your heart to see a child murderer being hoisted up on one of those cranes?
Or are you saying you’re pro-■■■■■■■■■■ murderer as well as other types of murderer, such as Cop killers?

Relgion is just on or off the stage around the world when it comes to how justice systems work in different countries - that’s all.

75

Has someone hacked your account? You don’t even seem to know what you just typed

76

Ill bring back to the present.

I used to be a firm believer in the asylum system but it has been so abused (have experience if the immigration system and used to know someone who worked at a processing centre), that I have lost all faith in it.

It had become an industry in itself.

So that lack of faith unfortunately now manifests itself as a distinct lack of sympathy towards illegals.

Luke, you have to agree the border system has massive flaws in the UK?

77

Winseer:
Who’s bringing religion into anything? That wasn’t even being discussed, just as an opposite side of argument, bearing in mind there’s a strong relationship between libralism and atheism compared to if you like, rough justice at the hands of a more pius system such as the way child killers are treated in Iran?

Personally, I think I’madinnerjacket is a nutcase, but doesn’t it warm your heart to see a child murderer being hoisted up on one of those cranes?
Or are you saying you’re pro-■■■■■■■■■■ murderer as well as other types of murderer, such as Cop killers?

Relgion is just on or off the stage around the world when it comes to how justice systems work in different countries - that’s all.

Like I said it’s a slippery slope when those with your views hold the decision between life and death.The fact is justice in Sharia law doesn’t stop at just swinging child murderers from cranes.It also thinks nothing of stoning women to death for much lesser crimes as a form of public entertainment.In which case no thanks you can emigrate to Iran if you perefer that type of a society.Meanwhile as I said hanging is a too humane way out for those who deserve to suffer such a sanction in which case it should be the electric chair.However it’s not something which I’d take any pleasure whatsoever in inflicting on anyone regardless of how much the zb’s deserve it. :bulb: :unamused:

78

Page 4 coming up after the break

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The ultimate source of a happy life is warm-heartedness. This means extending to others the kind of concern we have for ourselves. On a simple level we find that if we have a compassionate heart we naturally have more friends. And scientists today are discovering that while anger and hatred eat into our immune system, warm-heartedness and compassion are good for our health.

Dalai Lama.

It works for me. :sunglasses:

80

Carryfast:

Winseer:
Who’s bringing religion into anything? That wasn’t even being discussed, just as an opposite side of argument, bearing in mind there’s a strong relationship between libralism and atheism compared to if you like, rough justice at the hands of a more pius system such as the way child killers are treated in Iran?

Personally, I think I’madinnerjacket is a nutcase, but doesn’t it warm your heart to see a child murderer being hoisted up on one of those cranes?
Or are you saying you’re pro-■■■■■■■■■■ murderer as well as other types of murderer, such as Cop killers?

Relgion is just on or off the stage around the world when it comes to how justice systems work in different countries - that’s all.

Like I said it’s a slippery slope when those with your views hold the decision between life and death.The fact is justice in Sharia law doesn’t stop at just swinging child murderers from cranes.It also thinks nothing of stoning women to death for much lesser crimes as a form of public entertainment.In which case no thanks you can emigrate to Iran if you perefer that type of a society.Meanwhile as I said hanging is a too humane way out for those who deserve to suffer such a sanction in which case it should be the electric chair.However it’s not something which I’d take any pleasure whatsoever in inflicting on anyone regardless of how much the zb’s deserve it. :bulb: :unamused:

Cripes,I agree with all that bar the electric chair comment