Money owed

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS OWNER AND FLEET OPERATORS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
1

I set up last year with a single unit and trailer.

Started off working for several people, then was offered regular well paying work from another owner driver.

Since then I worked for him almost 90% of the time.

At first the money was being paid 30 days. then it’s got worse and worse, with me regularly being lied to about cheques in the post, he’s not been paid etc etc.

Anyway the total owed reached 20k the other day and I as I hadn’t been paid for anything done since the middle February, I pulled my lorry off the work. I was promised payment for work done in Feb, March and April and you guessed it, it never turned up.

Since then I’ve found out that the guy I worked for has gone round telling a rather different story to mine and has been saying I’m not working for him again. Plus he is now trying to find another O/D to take my place.

I’ve got other work so that’s not my main concern. What I want is the money that I’m owed.

Seeing as I’m speaking to many people that I suspect have been in the same boat as me, I’m asking for a bit of advice as to how I should go about getting my money back. I know the most of the options, the legal and illegal ones.

So if anyones got any good advice I’d be grateful to hear it. Thanks.

And yeah I’ve heard the bit of advice about not letting amounts build up to stupid figures like 20k.

2

Did you check out the “winding up order” yet ?.

3

Not yet. Waiting till the end of the week to be honest.
Putting everything together on paper first.

4

as you say you know the legal and illegal ways - all i’d add is the way the job is at the moment don’t give any {zb] an inch, if it’s 20k go after it hard, and soon

auto censor dodge removed…Denis F

5

Get a few of your biggest mates rounded up & go round there & scare the life out of the thieving git! You did your work now you want your money, nothing wrong with that, if the blokes in trouble then he should sell something to ensure that he pays his bills, no excuse for knocking people

6

You do this!

closely followed by this!

Who you gonna call?

7

For 2.5 k my mate Vinnie Jones will sort this little problem out for you …

8

If he is a sole trader you could register a caution against his house for the £20k. " just pop down to the land registry, they’re very helpful. "
Therefore if he did go bankrupt you would have a claim.
You could go to your bank and ask them to factor your invoices for you. This would enable you to get paid as soon as you invoice. No waiting for cheques in the post etc. Your bank will do the lot for a small %.
If you do decide to factor, Don’t tell the bank about this bloke, just get them to invoice him.
With a caution against his house and a bank chasing him he will know you are in business to stay in business.
Failing that nick his truck. :wink:

9

If he doesnt pay the factor company, they will demand the money back from you. You need to factor AND insure your invoices against non payment. I think anyone who is not dealing with the likes of Tesco/DHL/Wincanton/DSV or similar HUGE companies is MAD if they don’t insure their invoices against non payment! I would never, ever do any work for non massive firms unless the invoices were insured. One dud customer and you are probably down the road as well, all that hard work for nowt.

10

There’s loads of these b…'s about. I had some luck with a company in Liverpool called Thomas Higgins and Co, they will send a “letter before action” for you to the debtor and all it costs is around £2 (when I last used them). Most people will pay up if they don’t want a CCJ, after that if you don’t get payment it’s up to you - they explain the costs involved, but for the £2 letter it’s worth a try. Their phone number is 0151 630 8001. Cheapest threatening solicitor’s letter that I’ve found. Good luck.

11

Ive sent you a PM. My choice is obvious on the PM and I have been down that road.

Its more than likely hes done this before and any action will be water off a ducks back.

You need your money M8 else your up the swanny , placing you in financial hardship ,20 k is a lot of dough, so Id use any means necessary to get it back.

You should post this fellas name on this site to prevent any other OD from
making the same error.

Do not factor, he wont pay them and you have to pay the money back. If you caninsure your invoices and then factor maybe you will get your money back that way.

I wish ye well now

12

I’m thinking he needs to be introduced to his own spleen and fast.
If it’s bad men you need pm me :imp:

13

the banks and factoring companies will credit check the person who is getting invoiced and will only pay a percentage of the invoice value if they pay anything at all depending on their credit score.
i bought a truck about 10 years ago and was going to sub for a large well know creditable company.
they wanted 60 days credit.
the factoring company put a monthly limit on how much of the invoice they would pay.
they were only willing to pay only 50 per cent of my forecasted invoices.
they said the copmpany had not enough score to qualify.
i cant name the company here,but they are stil going strong and a large sucessful company they are.

14

I never saw the point of factoring my invoices as the factors will only pay if the company is solvent,
The percentages they take is like cutting your own rates.

That is the reason I am now an employed driver and have been since 1992.

I know a lot of people who factored their invoices,

I dont know many who are still in business. I managed to walk away with some profits.

A very good friend and one time business partner said “if you havent got enough fat on your back to keep warm all summer”, “how will you manage come winter”?

15

another thing about factors.
they will take 15 percent off your invoice for themselves.
and as an owner driver ,your turnover may not be big enough for them to take you on.
i asked bibbys in 1997 to factor for me.
i had one truck.
they would only cover me if my turnover was 100k.
i didnt know if i would turn that much over
i did get covered eventually.
the big factoring companies dont want to know the small man.

16

Do not factor under any circumstances, if you have cashflow issues then go to your bank, if they can’t sort it then it’s time to admit defeat & pack it in, harsh I know but I know people who used factors, not just commercial ones but through their banks, every last one of them is now out of business, it won’t get you out of trouble, it’ll just be another name on your list of creditors. Good luck

17

cardo.
we are slipping off topic slightly.
i was in your position in 1981.
i was owed about 15k punts.
a lot of money in those days
i never saw a penny and lost my house.
i had 2 young kids and an expensive wife.
and a truck that kept breaking down.
i hope your luck is better than mine.
when they start paying you on acount or not paying you.
this is time to operate in a more unpleasant way to get your money.
winding up companies is no use to anyone except the taxman who doesnt work for his money.
the legal system is crap.
go for it.jugular vein.
because the guy who owns the money does not care whether you or your family starve,or if you survive as an owner driver.
this type are not new to the game.
remember.
sugar in the oil causes a lot of damage.

18

I’ve never factored,never done a credit check,in fact never done any of the things that Financial Experts tell you to do.I rely on references from people I know and trust,and have never had just the one Customer,hence spreading the risk.
In over 15 years I’ve had one bad debt,still outstanding,of £4.5k.The guy had been a Debt Collector,and knows all the dodges,hides behind a P.O number,moves house every few months,rents his car and trucks etc.VOSA have his reg.numbers,Operating Centre,and he runs with a bit of blue paper in the window instead of an O licence.I ran into him on a job a few months ago and “persuaded”,him to give me a cheque.Needless to say,it wasn’t worth the effort.I hope one day he suffers one of the misfortunes he claims are the reasons he won’t pay.
I know Cardo : I think I know the feller who owes him,(it ain’t me,by the way!).I reckon he’ll get his dough in the end,because it’s a small world and bad news travels very fast.And the feller subs an awful lot of work…
But it’s a valuable lesson learned.Don’t let the bill get too big,nor put all your eggs in one basket…and preferably,(I know I bang on about it),try to get your OWN work…imho you’re more likely to get knocked by another haulier than the bloke who owns the goods on the trailer…

19

Dieseldans right,

I started off last year and was soon offered what I believed to be a great opportunity - regular subbie work from another small company. And don’t get me wrong in ways it has been. I’ve had regular work and met alot of decent people along the way.

Unfortunately I kept working when I really knew myself that I was being owed more and more. To be honest I didn’t want to pull out and lose the work. I kept getting promised there’d be more money next week, then the next.

Only when I admitted to myself that I was going out spending a fortune on diesel with little hope of seeing payment for that days job for at least 90 days plus and even then it’d take 5 phone calls to get it, did I stop doing the work.

That’s when I realised I had been incredibly stupid, I put all my eggs in one basket and if I carried on a few extra weeks I would be in a whole load more trouble than I’m in now.

To keep you up to date…

I still haven’t received any payment.

I still get told there’ll be a cheque tomorrow, everyday.

I found out yesterday they’d paid another subbie a load of money they already owed him and asked him to do all the work I was doing. First I went mad then I called up and said if I don’t get what’s owed I’ll look at taking more direct action, i.e. putting a lock on a trailer, I was told they know all their rights and I can’t do anything like that. Plus they’d call up everyone in the industry they work in to make sure I never get any other work. Yeah that’s right they’d call up everyone and tell them not to give any work to me, I’m guessing that they’d leave out the bit where they owe me a substantial amount of money and have lied to me continuously. I aint worried, I think people would know the truth if they did that anyway.

What I have had is a load of people that know me offer me advice and help. I’ve had people offer to help me block his yard, block his truck in etc etc. I must admit this has given me a great morale boost, to know there are some genuine people out there, willing to help me out when they could just watch me go under without saying a word. Thanks for that, you know who you are.

So today I took the time to visit the local court to start at putting a ccj in motion. If I looked at getting a winding up order there’s alot of others who’d lose straight away if they went under. I’m hoping the threat of this will make them pay but just to edge my bets I’m getting all the evidence together I need.

I hope that people don’t think I’m going down the wrong road for doing this. But at the end of the day I foolishly worked as hard and as good as I could for these people and I think they got a whole load of credit for that. I remained loyal to them and even recommended them to other people rather than take new work for myself. I’ve got a wife and 2 kids that I’ve gotta provide for and that’s all I’m worried about now, I’ll survive, I’ll get my money and I’ll make sure what goes around comes around.

20

I think you are doing the right thing too Cardo. The threat of court action is a lot better than brute force although violence may help you feel better, it doesnt pay the bills.

Probably holding onto some equipment like a good trailer which was paid for might have swung it for you but its too late for that anyway.

In my opinion, pinlocking trailers, blocking yards and putting sugar in the fuel isnt going to get you any money, but it may result in a prosecution.
For you :wink: