I know we have disscussed this case before on these forum,well now the inquest is over and the jury have decided that the recovery driver was killed unlawfully.
The coroner have asked the cps to review the case.
My recomendations would be for the HATO’s not to leave a recovery driver on his own to recovery a vehicle.
After all,all they had to do was sit in their nice warm 4x4 with their becons flashing to warn other motorists,but the HATO’s that attended this accident left him to it.
I’m just curious…Lets label this unfortunate fatal accident as “Accident B”.
Now lets bring in a fictitious accident a few miles before and call it “Accident A”, and lets say that the HATO had turns up to “Accident A” and decided to stay with it and the unfortunate fatal “Accident B” still occurred as it did…wouldn’t half of the people on here just slate the HATO for staying with one accident instead of continuing to patrol the rest of the motorway?
I’m not taking any side here and I do not know a great deal of the details of the incedent. Hiowever, in reading many posts on here regarding HATOs it seems that they are considered by many to be a waste of space, but then there are calls for them to be in two places at a time. Are they wanted or not?
I’m not defending HATOs particularly, but it does seem that they can’t do right for doing wrong. They are human (and I don’t recall them claiming otherwise) and they, like all of us, make mistakes (not that I’m saying the incedent under discussion was a mistake). They also have to operate within rules and regulations (don’t most of us appreciate that?) and sometimes have to disregard personal opinions.
Not trying to stir up another argument, just wondering what some people really want.
Well I don’t have a bad word to say about HATO’s but as the guy before me said…everyone wants them in two places at once and then they’ll slag them off. I can guarantee though that if they’d of been sat at another incident for lets say 45 minutes and a crash happened further on, people on here would moan by saying they shouldn’t have just sat in their 4x4’s and they should have moved on.
Adam_Mc:
Well I don’t have a bad word to say about HATO’s but as the guy before me said…everyone wants them in two places at once and then they’ll slag them off. I can guarantee though that if they’d of been sat at another incident for lets say 45 minutes and a crash happened further on, people on here would moan by saying they shouldn’t have just sat in their 4x4’s and they should have moved on.
Not me, they could only have tried to protect one scene. If something else had happened, that would have been another units job. My opinion is the same as the Coroner’s - they should have stayed on scene.
The Sarge:
Adam_Mc:
Well I don’t have a bad word to say about HATO’s but as the guy before me said…everyone wants them in two places at once and then they’ll slag them off. I can guarantee though that if they’d of been sat at another incident for lets say 45 minutes and a crash happened further on, people on here would moan by saying they shouldn’t have just sat in their 4x4’s and they should have moved on.Not me, they could only have tried to protect one scene. If something else had happened, that would have been another units job. My opinion is the same as the Coroner’s - they should have stayed on scene.
There’s only so many units available though…going back to my situation people would still use your point to argue and just simply then say “they’re useless, there’s not enough of them blah blah blah” I’m not sure the accident could have been avoided anyway…I mean lets face it, what could the HATO do?..all they can do is put out some cones…if the VW looses control, those cones won’t make the slightest difference.
The cones may have slowed the driver down (or at least have made her take notice), thus avoiding the accident. If you do the most that you CAN do, then nobody can complain, can they?
Either way, as has been said, bad things can happen to the best of us - I hope the family can get some closure through the inquest. RIP.
Ignoring for a moment the issue of whether the HATO’s should have stayed or not the fact is he contributed to this unfortunate incident by strapping the offside of the car while on the shoulder. He could have taken responsibility for his own safety rather than relying on someone else.
That’s something he clearly could have done and then we probably wouldn’t all be second guessing the actions of the HATO officers.
The Sarge:
The cones may have slowed the driver down (or at least have made her take notice), thus avoiding the accident. If you do the most that you CAN do, then nobody can complain, can they?
Either way, as has been said, bad things can happen to the best of us - I hope the family can get some closure through the inquest. RIP.
Why would the cones have made a difference…if the flashing lights on the recovery vehicle itself didn’t slow the VW driver down, why would the cones?
The driver may have noticed earlier that vehicles were moving out into lane 2, meaning she may not have banged the brakes and skidded on the ice, causing the fatality. That’s, I assume, what the coroner feels.
I agree that we will never know - but “best practice” only comes about when possible lessons are looked at. I can see no down-side to the HATO’s staying on site and possibly putting out cones, but we have all seen the down-side of one woman (apparently) panic braking because she (allegedly) hadn’t noticed what was happening on the hard shoulder until it was tragically too late.
I’m not going to argue the point any further, agree or disagree - that’s your prerogative, but I’m not keen to prolong the argument on this. 
I believe the coronor stated that HATOs on scene followed HA procedure.( Im not saying the procedure is wrong or right) From what I understand, HATO did not leave recovery driver alone on scene, they left long before his arrival… It is procedure to stay on scene with recovery if we are still in attendence, but not wait for them to arrive. We can leave if an immediate job requires us to leave. In my area, all the recovery operators have HATO control room contact numbers (a lot of recovery drivers even have our personal numbers) and can call for assistance if needed. As Coffeeholic says, the driver seems to be on the offside, which is a big no no. Im not slaggin him off, as we have all done things then reflected afterwards that perhaps it wasn’t the most sensible thing to do. If the driver was unlawfully killed, I would suggest that the VW driver was most at fault and no amount of flashing lights and cones would have made much difference. Very sad and perhaps a lesson to all of us that work on the hard shoulder and those that drive past in lane one when they could move over into lane two.
extrucker:
I believe the coronor stated that HATOs on scene followed HA procedure.( Im not saying the procedure is wrong or right) From what I understand, HATO did not leave recovery driver alone on scene, they left long before his arrival… It is procedure to stay on scene with recovery if we are still in attendence, but not wait for them to arrive. We can leave if an immediate job requires us to leave. In my area, all the recovery operators have HATO control room contact numbers (a lot of recovery drivers even have our personal numbers) and can call for assistance if needed. As Coffeeholic says, the driver seems to be on the offside, which is a big no no. Im not slaggin him off, as we have all done things then reflected afterwards that perhaps it wasn’t the most sensible thing to do. If the driver was unlawfully killed, I would suggest that the VW driver was most at fault and no amount of flashing lights and cones would have made much difference. Very sad and perhaps a lesson to all of us that work on the hard shoulder and those that drive past in lane one when they could move over into lane two.
Now THAT would be a useful addition to the Highway Code! I cannot understand people who plough blithely on when someone (anyone) is working/waiting on the hard shoulder.
Cue other people arguing, but I won’t be involved 
I think the reason this has been handed back to the CPS was the discrepancy from two officers in the same car. Were they called off to another job or not?
There are many posts about HATO on these and other forums, most follow the same pattern, Joe Public slag off the HATO, The HATO join forces and blame poor driving, but one thing that is normally stipulated is the fact that we look after our own. One of the officers keeps a lookout for his colleague.
How many times have we read that the spare HATO will jump out and look down the road towards oncoming traffic, they are in a good position then to dive over the barrier, shout out a warning or to divert the traffic into the 2nd lane.
Just come back from Florida and the ruling there is to move out one lane if recovery or police are on scene. Not certain that it’s law but certainly lots of posters telling you to move for safety. Simple and safe
If a HATO has been sent to, or comes across a broken down vehicle, providing that vehicle is in a reasonable safe place ie, the H/S with hazards on, and where there is room for the recovery to get in and deal with it, they confirm that recovery has been arranged and leave after giving the vehicle driver safety advice (that they can’t force on him)
All the recovery operators, tyre companies etc have the control room telephone number and can recall the HATO to re-attend if there are any concerns once their operator has got on scene.
In fact, the larger recovery organisations will call the HATO control room with details of broken down vehicles on the network, and unless there is specific cause for concern the HATO is not even informed of the vehicle (unless they’re going to trip over it) the HATO is then not obliqued to stop with it unless they see something untoward, as there is nothing else they need to do.
So…THE FACTS; .The incident in question started with a vehicle that had been involved in a minor RTC due to the driver not taking care on the less than perfect road conditions, this was cleared to the H/S, and that driver has listened to the safety advice that both the Police patrol & HATO patrol had given him, was out of his vehicle stood on the verge. Both the police patrol & HATO patrol had continued on their normal patrol duties.
The recovery would have taken at least 1 hour to attend after being called, (usual sort of time, but probably longer on this day due to amount of broken down vehicles caused by the cold weather) meanwhile, hundreds, if not thousands of vehicles of all sizes would have passed this spot without bother.
The recovery driver arrives, parks in front of the stricken vehicle, doesn’t have any issues, it’s just like the thousands of recoveries he’s done before, doesn’t recall the HATO as no concerns then loads the vehicle onto the back of the truck, he then needs to strap the vehicle down, after strapping the N/S he goes around next to lane 1 to strap the O/S and gets hit by the other vehicle.
The driver of the car that hit the recovery is at fault, no-one else, although the recovery driver did put himself in harms way.
People are saying that the HATO should have stayed and sat behind with flashing lights.
- The recovery would not have arrived for over an hour, and I know on that day there were numberous incidents that kept all the HATO patrol well busy.
- There were no concerns with the position of the first vehicle awaiting recovery, and if there was a need, the recovery operator could have requested them to re-attend…He didn’t.
- Hundreds of other drivers passed that spot without running into either the broken down car, or recovery truck.
- Thousands of vehicles are recovered from the H/S on a daily basis without having some sort of patrol sat behind them with flashing lights. Ask the AA, RAC,Greenflag etc how many they recover daily.
- Last but not least, it’s not the HATO’s job to sit behind broken down vehicles, their job is TRAFFIC MANAGEMENT that means trying to keep the motorways running, ie. clearing debris from live lanes, clearing RTC’s to the H/S, making sure recovery is organised to get BDV’s off the network. To assist the police with traffic management at injury RTC’s (police are in charge, HATO’s will man closures, lane closures etc. allowing other emergency services to get on with their core jobs)
Once a vehicle is on the H/S awaiting recovery, the HATO’s job is done.
Just a few stats from around the time of this incident for the area of that part of the country.
Over 1500 jobs in a 24 hour time scale.
On 1 particular motorway where freezing fog just decended, 28 RTC’s within 1 hour, (9 were duplicates but with incorrect locations given, but still needed checking)
1 police patrol car, 1 HATO vehicle & 1 ISU truck (16 tons with more lights than Blackpool illuminations) all hit on the H/S (at different incidents, but on the same day)
53 people running out of fuel, 14 of which ran out and stopped in the live lane. (1 day!)
dave19544:
Just come back from Florida and the ruling there is to move out one lane if recovery or police are on scene. Not certain that it’s law but certainly lots of posters telling you to move for safety. Simple and safe
That’s law in most states, it’s the way it should be everywhere, I remember back to my days of running around in Europe, everybody moved over for a motor on the hard shoulder, even the Italians and them [zb]ers are always in a hurry 
The Sarge:
extrucker:
I believe the coronor stated that HATOs on scene followed HA procedure.( Im not saying the procedure is wrong or right) From what I understand, HATO did not leave recovery driver alone on scene, they left long before his arrival… It is procedure to stay on scene with recovery if we are still in attendence, but not wait for them to arrive. We can leave if an immediate job requires us to leave. In my area, all the recovery operators have HATO control room contact numbers (a lot of recovery drivers even have our personal numbers) and can call for assistance if needed. As Coffeeholic says, the driver seems to be on the offside, which is a big no no. Im not slaggin him off, as we have all done things then reflected afterwards that perhaps it wasn’t the most sensible thing to do. If the driver was unlawfully killed, I would suggest that the VW driver was most at fault and no amount of flashing lights and cones would have made much difference. Very sad and perhaps a lesson to all of us that work on the hard shoulder and those that drive past in lane one when they could move over into lane two.Now THAT would be a useful addition to the Highway Code! I cannot understand people who plough blithely on when someone (anyone) is working/waiting on the hard shoulder.
Cue other people arguing, but I won’t be involved
I’m with you on that one. I have had in the past, after moving over a lane due to HATO’s, Police, Recovery on the hard shoulder, been undertaken by someone who hasn’t moved over and then given me abuse when they come up the inside, I’m talking about other truck drivers.
I give a wave of thanks to drivers that pull into lane 2 at any jobs i’m on. It’s a simple manouvre that gives me a safe area which is greatly appreciated.